Butch Femme Planet - Crone Femmes?

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Quote:

Originally Posted by HumV4me (Post 17298)

Thank you soo much Dusa for starting this thread.

I could not help but come here and read everyone's words as if they were honey on the tounge..

I have refered myself in another thread as being "Of Crone Spirit".

The transition into becoming one with self is not always an easy path. To sit down and put it into words is "almost impossible".

To be of "Crone Spirit" does not mean you are totally complete... It does mean how ever, you carry the escence within you and one day... beyond your control... a tranformation ~~WILL~~ occur in your present life.

I feel this isn't my first journey and will not be my last... and with each passing of time / life... the spirit within me only gets wiser and stronger... until the day comes were I am born "As One".

This is what I long for.

Allowing change to transpire and letting go of the old, so the new can have it's way, is not an easy thing to do. Being the warrior and fighter that I am in mind and flesh has been the most difficult battle of all, in this life.

As I write this I feel the tears swell behind my eyes. I feel the nerves alight with fire and feelings I am not able to describe.

All I know is it's been a long hard road full of life experiance... and as long as we all share those experiances with each other... Passing our stories on may help another learn and grow in a softer earier way than it was for ourselves.

And might I add, there are time's when life presents questions or situations and you are not prepared to know the answer or out come, (((yet you already do know))) and you are not sure how you know. When you come to realize this it may be very frieghtening or a great experiance... it just depends on how you embrace it and acknowledge it.

Peace and LOVE to all of you... and please keep posting.... ~~smile~~ I beg you.

Oh... now we need some Crone Femme Smilies!!!! :cheer:

Beautifully and eloquently said. Much food for thought and reflection in your words.

I Identify as a crone
I also state I am a silver femme
not that one has to let their hair go grey in order to a crone
for me, however, it was a calling to do so
I am actually writing a book on Silver Femmes and Crone Butches
I use to call them Crone Daddies but many said they didnt ID with Daddy but did with Butch

I have always seen it as a term of respect for an Elder. I'm not Wiccan however I'm assuming my understanding of the word is influenced by it. I have heard/read it used as an insult but I always kind of treasured the thought of one day being a Crone.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Naneegirl (Post 71683)

For me 'crone' has a negative feel due to the first time i remember hearing it used was in Sleeping Beauty...it was an ugly, old, mean crone that gave Sleeping Beauty the poison apple....no offense to any crones out there...i am sure many of you are quite lovely and would never consider giving anyone a poison apple.....just saying:2cents:

Quote:

Originally Posted by jaqueline (Post 71693)

I've maybe been tempted to pass out a poison apple upon occasion.

I can understand why many people might hear it as negative. Its been used often enough as a negative term.

After a quick shuffle in my head, I can't readily think of too many positive terms that have been historically used for older women. I'm sure there are some, but more negatives jump to mind than positives.

For me, part of liking Crone is about reclaiming and redefining.

and why is it the apple is always poison in the story, that the woman hands over to someone? It is because apple is the fruit of love and for ever more, in legends where women's spirits were twisted so as to dethroned them from their spiritual best, the apple was given as a symbol of how twisty and untrustworthy a woman's love was deemed to be...

so if the apple is a symbol of women's love, think carefully then of the time when eve was offered the apple by the snake...

the snake, another symbol of women..more direct, of women's sexuality. Yes indeed...

in fact, even Medusa's legend, the "monster" with the hair of snakes that turned men into stone, was spun from men being so charmed, beguiled, mesmerized, and glamoured by the beauty of Medusa, that they turned her beauty, her locks, into snakes to derail her fame and love. Instead of men simply crushing out on her and acting like silly toads chasing flies, they turned her into a monster and made her gorgeous hair the sin of love....

not so...not so....

so when Eve is offered the apple by the snake, which is, for the record, a universal symbol of female sexuality, is it not a woman offering another woman, a taste of her fruit?

and was she not turned out of Eden only after she offered it to Adam?

think..think....go beyond what has been told to us....

so much has been shifted over the sands of time...but those who Know, will Hear that Crones are Real ....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Naneegirl (Post 71683)

It is very much a term of respect and high regard for elders outside of Wiccan ideology as well. Take a look at Native American thought for one. Oh, and Iconsider myself to be a butch crone.

i so limit my ID's. i ID as a very few thing. VERY few. And i do not like having other people press ID's on me based on personal characteristics -- no one is doing that here, but it happens.

i do consider myself old though, and i am proud of that. i like it. i do not like having even more of a struggle with my weight. i do not like arthritis. i like most of it though. i even would have plastic surgery if the opportunity presented itself. That does not mean i do not claim my age and that i am not happy and proud to be here. i am.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Medusa (Post 12134)

And now Im wondering if there are any Butches with "Crone"
attached to their identity!?

No. I prefer grumpy old guy.

http://www.semanacineespiritual.org/...ran_Torino.jpg

Quote:

Originally Posted by AtLastHome (Post 71792)

It is very much a term of respect and high regard for elders outside of Wiccan ideology as well. Take a look at Native American thought for one. Oh, and Iconsider myself to be a butch crone.

in my family, which has always been matriarchal here and in the old country, use the term Buba for crone women. Not Bubba which often means an overly done male with low wit and intelligence. Buba is the highest honor. Old Wise Woman. In the past, they wore hairnets and thick dark stockings that they rubber banded beneath their knees. Their laps spread and their breasts fell as they sat down. Their hands were worn and knobby from years of work. They wore the Buba uniform..the bubushka..and it came in many colors and brilliant designs. They were brought to family functions and placed in a comforting place for them and one by one, younger members would go to say their regards. A kiss for the bride at her wedding reception was a HUGE event. This woman canned enough from her garden to feed the neighborhood. And when she made her breads, people showed up that hadnt visited for months. She swatted with wooden spoons..or her hand if you were bad and close enough. Shame was not given out lightly. But if given out, lord help you, you deserved it and the family stood behind her. She often had whiskers on her top lip and if you didnt like it and mentioned it, you might lose your psyche balls from the star she would do in response to your lack of charm. Babies were placed in her arms to kiss...a blessing like no other. She ate unfamiliar strange things..like cow tongue and brains. You couldnt convince her to pay $20 for a meal for one person. She kept her money tied and pinned inside her "brassiere"...at least the money you knew about. She had stashes of it and if you really needed it AND you deserved it, she would skirt away and come back with the exact amount you needed. She never wanted paid back. If she gave, she gave without strings. If she judged you, and she was the one in the family who could, she was always right...

there arent too many Bubas left. I step into that role...as does my sister ..but we are both intimidated by the sacredness of that role. We dont feel like we are deserving of it. Somehow, between now and later, we will transform into Her. Its not like we get voted in, or can go out and buy the right clothes to make ourselves one. It just happens if we are deserving of it.

U have described my sainted grandmother to a T.She was catholic to the core but so much a pagen as well..her gypsy blood always kept her strong as well as knowing everything.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AtLastHome (Post 71792)

It is very much a term of respect and high regard for elders outside of Wiccan ideology as well. Take a look at Native American thought for one. Oh, and Iconsider myself to be a butch crone.

I hadn't thought about Native American cultures. Do you know if, in general, Native American beliefs honor elders (and more specifically women) more than our society in general does?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Martina (Post 71905)

i do consider myself old though, and i am proud of that. i like it. i do not like having even more of a struggle with my weight. i do not like arthritis. i like most of it though. i even would have plastic surgery if the opportunity presented itself. That does not mean i do not claim my age and that i am not happy and proud to be here. i am.

It has its moments of aggravation, especially physically, but I to am enjoying it.

Quote:

Originally Posted by EzeeTiger (Post 71916)

No. I prefer grumpy old guy.

I always like the term Curmudgeon, does that work?

Quote:

Originally Posted by softness (Post 71923)

in my family, which has always been matriarchal here and in the old country, use the term Buba for crone women. Not Bubba which often means an overly done male with low wit and intelligence. Buba is the highest honor. Old Wise Woman. In the past, they wore hairnets and thick dark stockings that they rubber banded beneath their knees. Their laps spread and their breasts fell as they sat down. Their hands were worn and knobby from years of work. They wore the Buba uniform..the bubushka..and it came in many colors and brilliant designs. They were brought to family functions and placed in a comforting place for them and one by one, younger members would go to say their regards. A kiss for the bride at her wedding reception was a HUGE event. This woman canned enough from her garden to feed the neighborhood. And when she made her breads, people showed up that hadnt visited for months. She swatted with wooden spoons..or her hand if you were bad and close enough. Shame was not given out lightly. But if given out, lord help you, you deserved it and the family stood behind her. She often had whiskers on her top lip and if you didnt like it and mentioned it, you might lose your psyche balls from the star she would do in response to your lack of charm. Babies were placed in her arms to kiss...a blessing like no other. She ate unfamiliar strange things..like cow tongue and brains. You couldnt convince her to pay $20 for a meal for one person. She kept her money tied and pinned inside her "brassiere"...at least the money you knew about. She had stashes of it and if you really needed it AND you deserved it, she would skirt away and come back with the exact amount you needed. She never wanted paid back. If she gave, she gave without strings. If she judged you, and she was the one in the family who could, she was always right...

I can totally picture her from your words.