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-   -   Fierce Femmes, Allies and Gender Expectations... (http://www.butchfemmeplanet.com/forum/showthread.php?t=1126)

Apocalipstic 04-05-2010 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by softness (Post 79310)
I have no photos of the Twisted Teddies. .. they left when the romance did....

This makes me sad, maybe you should go into business selling tortured stuffies.

NJFemmie 04-05-2010 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by softness (Post 79310)
I have no photos of the Twisted Teddies. .. they left when the romance did....

I want to send you some "stuffies" so I can see what you do to them.
And, I want pictures.
I. need. them.

lol

Mare and I share a common interest (among the many) with "unusual" (twisted would be a better word) dolls. She has quite a collection of them, actually.

Soft*Silver 04-05-2010 03:08 PM

I would be obliged to do this if you really want me to .... I also am working on "bad butch fairies"...am hoping to have them up for sale by xmas... really disgusting lovable little shits...

Apocalipstic 04-05-2010 03:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by softness (Post 79330)
I would be obliged to do this if you really want me to .... I also am working on "bad butch fairies"...am hoping to have them up for sale by xmas... really disgusting lovable little shits...

Bad Butch Fairies? Yeayyyy!

BullDog 04-05-2010 03:30 PM

Oh somebody made me a butch fairy doll once! The doll's name was Horny! :D

Spirit Dancer 04-05-2010 04:14 PM

See why I love you, ENERGY is so HOT and where we derive our ENERGY can vary. :wolf:whistle

Quote:

Originally Posted by apocalipstic (Post 79301)
I have dated several people who are girlier than I am. They IDed as Lesbians, not as Femmes per se.

When single I wanted to date Femmes sometimes, but they did not want to date Me.

I think both Butch and Femme energy are hot!!!!


AtLast 04-05-2010 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by softness (Post 79330)
I would be obliged to do this if you really want me to .... I also am working on "bad butch fairies"...am hoping to have them up for sale by xmas... really disgusting lovable little shits...

OMG!!! Big trouble ahead...

:sailing: ... away...

imperfect_cupcake 04-05-2010 07:32 PM

thanks martina. I don't use any kind of qualifier. Nor do I use them with anyone else. When I have a gathering of friends, I don't refer to someone as my "femme" friend. or a "butch" buddie. They are my friend. I don't gender, race or sexuality denote/qualify my relationships to others. Why do they need to know what sexuality they are? when talking I don't say "my lesbian friend" or "my femme friend" or "my spanish friend"

Butches and femmes are just people, just like everyone else. just as diverse. I hate people assuming I know what they are talking about just because they have the same gender expression grouping I do. That's like assuming all people who wear the colour blue have x things in common. I don't. and stop assuming they do.

I have a strong thread of androgenous femininity/masculine femininity in me.
I can be completely gender neutral half the time, especially at work.
I don't like to be refered to by my gender(s). Ever. Use my name. And don't assume you know anything about me simply by my sexuality or because you know one of my genders.
I like gender neutral pronouns and she. if someone doesn't know me, if the world was perfect, I'd prefer they refered to me by gender neutral. And I wish this was done at work.
I'm not interested in how "you" see femmes anymore than being interested in how "you" see any group of people en mass.
Make a single joke about "femmes" and how we all can't drive (or whatever) and I'm more than likely to tell you a joke about all the stupid backward bitches like you I've met too. Sure is funny, you stupid backward bitches! but bless, ain't you cute in your own way? And really I love stupid backward bitches and have the utmost respect for them.

Nina 04-06-2010 09:00 AM

it speaks volumes to *me* that the discussion on this thread has woven around to the making and selling of 'bad butch faries' and the few word responses to the afore mentioned farie dolls...

I may well be wrong in my impression, and I may well be wrong in leaving any comment....still, I just find it so telling that when the question of Fierce Femmes and the whole range of self-expressions is on the table, the discussion comes back to butches and dolls

Apocalipstic 04-06-2010 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neen (Post 79814)
it speaks volumes to *me* that the discussion on this thread has woven around to the making and selling of 'bad butch faries' and the few word responses to the afore mentioned farie dolls...

I may well be wrong in my impression, and I may well be wrong in leaving any comment....still, I just find it so telling that when the question of Fierce Femmes and the whole range of self-expressions is on the table, the discussion comes back to butches and dolls

Lmao! Sorry I have my life in the evenings and have not been back to post anything more heavy. But no I did not plan to end up talking about Butches and dolls, but I must admit to being amused my my own mental pictures of stuffed animals with backwards heads.

Apocalipstic 04-06-2010 09:45 AM

I actually do sometimes use Femme qualifiers because I am so excited to have Femme friends. I knew zero other Femmes before finding the Internets (heh) and it still makes me happy to be able to say "my Femme friend________". I think those of us who do not live in cities with millions of people and have less opportunity to see and meet other Femmes are maybe even a little star struck by other Femmes.

Also for me, the word "She" holds great power. Maybe because my mother died when I was a kid and Women have always been these mystical elusive creatures to me. I feel honored to be a She, while at the same time having a piggish teen aged boy/James Bond thing going on in my head.

As a child I wanted to be a boy about half of the time. I am not into sports either, not do I work on cars, though I can to a degree work on older cars(due to having owned some doozies in the past). I like books, art, music, theater, history and things of that nature.

I always rebelled at the thought that boys and girls had a completely different set of rules on how to act....which now gets carried over to Butch-Femme to quite an extent.

Except.

I love the transgressive feeling I get after work reading the newspaper while my big tattooed BullDyke G/F fixes dinner for me. It's HOT.

Apocalipstic 04-06-2010 09:47 AM

Oh and, yeah, my driving record is perfect.

AshenLady 04-06-2010 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apocalipstic (Post 79207)
I have been thinking about starting this tread for weeks, and I keep putting it off for lack of a catchy name.....:)

So glad you came up with a catchy name. Thank you for this thread - what a breath of fresh air ...

I am femme, no doubt about it :spruceup: but if something needs fixin' or there's hard work to be done or something needs drivin' - I'm on it, and don't you dare try to belittle or redefine me. :pirate-steer:

Apocalipstic 04-06-2010 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AshenLady (Post 79862)
So glad you came up with a catchy name. Thank you for this thread - what a breath of fresh air ...

I am femme, no doubt about it :spruceup: but if something needs fixin' or there's hard work to be done or something needs drivin' - I'm on it, and don't you dare try to belittle or redefine me. :pirate-steer:

I used to enjoy driving the big trucks at work back before they got so picky about CDL's and all.

I went by Big Rig Jenny! :)

Martina 04-06-2010 01:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apocalipstic (Post 79841)
Also for me, the word "She" holds great power. Maybe because my mother died when I was a kid and Women have always been these mystical elusive creatures to me. I feel honored to be a She, while at the same time having a piggish teen aged boy/James Bond thing going on in my head.

i loved this post so much i had to quote part of it back.

Jess 04-09-2010 06:57 AM

Let's not forget MOMMY can be totally fierce!!!

ADULT LANGUAGE IN USE: YOU BE WARNED!

[nomedia="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oAk1dt13yLA"]YouTube- Missy Elliott - Mommy[/nomedia]

Gemme 04-09-2010 10:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jess (Post 81758)
Let's not forget MOMMY can be totally fierce!!!

ADULT LANGUAGE IN USE: YOU BE WARNED!

YouTube- Missy Elliott - Mommy

This is one of my FAVES by Missy Elliott and I think exemplifies the strength I've seen shown in here.

Count me in as a strong ally.

Soon 04-14-2010 07:01 PM

To all of the kick ass, beautiful fierce femmes out there...

Medusa 04-14-2010 07:40 PM

My Femme laughs at fart jokes, likes porn, and drives too slow - AND is a Feminist. :)

Spirit Dancer 04-14-2010 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Medusa (Post 85583)
My Femme laughs at fart jokes, likes porn, and drives too slow - AND is a Feminist. :)

Jack are you posting as Dusa?:cheer:

redrose 05-03-2010 07:45 AM

i am femme,,,
i am submissive,,,
but since my butch was super quiet, i was the one who will always fight for her, but she was very protective of me,,, :|
i guess we're different from the others because we both don't believe in toys, i mean, strap ons, vibrators, plastic cocks, dildos, etc...
:thumbsup:

apretty 05-03-2010 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apocalipstic (Post 79841)
I actually do sometimes use Femme qualifiers because I am so excited to have Femme friends. I knew zero other Femmes before finding the Internets (heh) and it still makes me happy to be able to say "my Femme friend________". I think those of us who do not live in cities with millions of people and have less opportunity to see and meet other Femmes are maybe even a little star struck by other Femmes.
...

I love the transgressive feeling I get after work reading the newspaper while my big tattooed BullDyke G/F fixes dinner for me. It's HOT.

i love all of this! yes yes and yes!

i have said 'femme friend' because it's short-hand for 'she who gets a MAJOR part of my life without explanation, above all others' additionally, why not use the title (qualifier, if you must) for what it is, a title of respect?

<3

Apocalipstic 05-03-2010 08:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apretty (Post 97656)
i love all of this! yes yes and yes!

i have said 'femme friend' because it's short-hand for 'she who gets a MAJOR part of my life without explanation, above all others' additionally, why not use the title (qualifier, if you must) for what it is, a title of respect?

<3


So glad I am not the only one to proudly say...this is My Femme Friend! :)

Spirit Dancer 05-03-2010 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apocalipstic (Post 97672)
So glad I am not the only one to proudly say...this is My Femme Friend! :)

My fiesty fierce femme friend you ROCK:batman:
where is a cat woman icon pfft

waxnrope 05-03-2010 06:21 PM

just droppin' in to ask:
:wtf: is a "bad butch fairy"?

The_Lady_Snow 05-03-2010 06:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waxnrope (Post 98113)
just droppin' in to ask:
:wtf: is a "bad butch fairy"?


So as an ally all you got out of the convos was this???

waxnrope 05-03-2010 07:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow (Post 98116)
So as an ally all you got out of the convos was this???

um, no. but it is the one question that continues to tickle my grey matter ... so far. :watereyes:

The_Lady_Snow 05-03-2010 07:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by waxnrope (Post 98145)
um, no. but it is the one question that continues to tickle my grey matter ... so far. :watereyes:

This is the only Fairy Butch I know of

Is he bad?

I can't really say, rumor has it hy maybe a lil wicked...

Nat 05-03-2010 08:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apocalipstic (Post 79227)
I do not always behave or even sit like a lady....

Do you?

Baby and wedding showers? Can't do it.

and you better remind me when your birthday is if you expect me to remember.

I think if I die and go to hell, it will be a baby shower that never ends.

This is a great thread - thanks for starting it.

I'm a femme whose ID has morphed a lot since I came out 4 and a half years ago. I guess I'm not a baby-femme anymore, but I understand now more than in the past that I am still discovering who I am and what I enjoy and/or will enjoy in the future. I suspect it may be my fate in life to continually be going through some sea change, and that's alright I guess.

I don't think of myself as fierce, but I'm glad there are fierce femmes here. I feel like a guy a lot of the time, but I live in the femme. Both elements seem to me to be my nature.

Lately I have decided that for me all lines that separate one thing from another need to be dotted, permeable. Like the walls of a cell, I guess.

Several of you in this thread have helped me understand myself better by sharing your lives and experiences and that means a great deal. So thanks.

Apocalipstic 05-05-2010 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Nat (Post 98267)
I think if I die and go to hell, it will be a baby shower that never ends.

This is a great thread - thanks for starting it.

I'm a femme whose ID has morphed a lot since I came out 4 and a half years ago. I guess I'm not a baby-femme anymore, but I understand now more than in the past that I am still discovering who I am and what I enjoy and/or will enjoy in the future. I suspect it may be my fate in life to continually be going through some sea change, and that's alright I guess.

I don't think of myself as fierce, but I'm glad there are fierce femmes here. I feel like a guy a lot of the time, but I live in the femme. Both elements seem to me to be my nature.

Lately I have decided that for me all lines that separate one thing from another need to be dotted, permeable. Like the walls of a cell, I guess.

Several of you in this thread have helped me understand myself better by sharing your lives and experiences and that means a great deal. So thanks.


I totally feel like a guy most of the time. Some can see it, some can't.

Those who do see it are most dear to me!

4 and 1/2 years? Man time flies! xoxooxox

Medusa 05-11-2010 07:22 AM

Apoc! Im with you on the whole baby-shower thing.

Jack and I had to attend one about a week ago for my little cousin and both of us were in excrutiating grossness with all the shower games and "ooh-ing" and "aah-ing".
No, I do NOT want to try to draw a baby on a paper plate with my eyes closed but I will oblige for the sake of my beloved cousin.

Im always really amused too at how other (mostly straight) women shriek in horror when I tell them I don't really like kids and never want to have any of my own. Sometimes I feel like I have just told them that my uterus is made of acid and Im not really human by their reactions.

On some level, I think its the whole expectation for some that woman=Mother=nurturer. Have a big fat bitch tell you that she hates kids and the little bubble of "Stepford Pussy" is popped rather easily.

Fantastic thread!

Apocalipstic 05-18-2011 09:32 AM

So it's been a year and much has changed.

Still Femme

Still fierce

Discovering my Momi side. Learning to accept sweetness in my life and that gentle kisses and cuddling do not make me weak.

LOveee "Stepford Pussy"! lmaorof

Still hate baby showers

Sending out a big hello to all my Fierce Femme Sisters and Allies!

EnderD_503 05-18-2011 09:40 AM

Just wondering how different femmes here at BFP participate in creating more visibility for femmes at queer events like Pride, or if you've ever partaken in any kind of femme event of some sort.

Also, do you see an effort to create more visibility for femmes within the queer community where you live? How about at Pride events where you live? Is that something you actively try to create more of, and if so how do you go about it?

The_Lady_Snow 05-18-2011 10:08 AM

When we were younger the Ohio femme population would place "Femme" stickers on our asses, we'd all walk around and clearly as diverse you could see we were a force to reckon with. As older femmes we now gather at one place and wear our femme pride without needing that sticker, once you meet a femme, well we are hard to forget. We attend events the younger crowds now put on and support and still have our phone tree:).

Here in Florida I've yet to find Femme companions, which is kinda sad.

As a Femme ally, what do you Ender do to help keep our visibility out there?

Sparkle 05-18-2011 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EnderD_503 (Post 341199)
Just wondering how different femmes here at BFP participate in creating more visibility for femmes at queer events like Pride, or if you've ever partaken in any kind of femme event of some sort.

Also, do you see an effort to create more visibility for femmes within the queer community where you live? How about at Pride events where you live? Is that something you actively try to create more of, and if so how do you go about it?

Great questions.

The town I live in often has a Femme contingent in the Pride Parade.
I must admit I've not joined it, my lack of participation isn't out of apathy, but because I enjoy watching the whole parade. Also, I live in a town that has a very high % of queer families and is an ultra-liberal bubble. Its easy to take visibility/acceptance for granted here.

But that wasn't always the case. When I was younger Femme visibility was really important to me because I felt invisible to everyone (queer & heterosexual). I spent a lot of time empowering myself and my peers - to be out and loud and fierce.

But now I am older, self-confident and I am blessed to have some fabulous Femme friends who live right here and that I spend time with. So, I've not felt the need to join a specific Femme group.

I'm politically active, but I choose carefully which queer political battles I get involved in and I direct my energy and resources in those directions. Femme visibility, while important, is not a high priority politically *for me*.

All that said, I've seen a rise in the number of Femme visibility and coalition building groups in some of the nearby big cities like New York and Boston in recent years. And I think it is GREAT! especially for young or just coming out Femmes.

Apocalipstic 05-18-2011 12:34 PM

Great posts!

To be honest, I have not gone to Pride the past few years or participated much in Queer events locally and that needs to change! I was in a relationship and my G/F was a home body and we just did not go.

But Ender your post really made me re-think....I do need to get involved in more Femme stuff and making ourselves more visible...htough it does seem with the younger Lesbians, being Femme or Lipstick is WAY more accepted than back in the 80's.

So I guess I need to look up when Pride is this year and go.

Jess 05-18-2011 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apocalipstic (Post 341280)
Great posts!

To be honest, I have not gone to Pride the past few years or participated much in Queer events locally and that needs to change! I was in a relationship and my G/F was a home body and we just did not go.

But Ender your post really made me re-think....I do need to get involved in more Femme stuff and making ourselves more visible...htough it does seem with the younger Lesbians, being Femme or Lipstick is WAY more accepted than back in the 80's.

So I guess I need to look up when Pride is this year and go.

I think Christie is wanting to come down for Nash Pride. Last time it was on the riverfront and she came close to heat stroke.. ack.. Hoping they move it back to the park, much nicer/ roomy and more places to escape the heat! Hope to see you :)

AtLast 05-19-2011 06:50 AM

I really like the use of "fierce" and femme together! Just do.

christie 05-24-2011 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by apocalipstic (Post 341280)
Great posts!

To be honest, I have not gone to Pride the past few years or participated much in Queer events locally and that needs to change! I was in a relationship and my G/F was a home body and we just did not go.

But Ender your post really made me re-think....I do need to get involved in more Femme stuff and making ourselves more visible...htough it does seem with the younger Lesbians, being Femme or Lipstick is WAY more accepted than back in the 80's.

So I guess I need to look up when Pride is this year and go.

You betch'er glittery fierce femme self needs to go to Pride this year! We will be there, avoiding heat stroke, and honestly, I've not experienced much of being unaccepted - in fact, most of the "kinder queers" (younger crowd) I've known in Nashville actually love that I am comfortable embracing femme.

LaneyDoll 05-24-2011 11:51 AM

I tell everyone I am an enigma. So, if any of these sound stereotypical or offensive, I apologize-this is simply what I have encountered in my time...

I CAN take 3 hours to get ready BUT that is start to finish (shower, shave, shampoo etc etc etc).

However, if you tell me that I have 30 mins to get ready, I can-assuming I am already clean or can go with damp hair.

I am a disaster in the kitchen but can bake fairly well.

I know nothing about tools but can repair my costume jewelery when need be. AND, can make my own floggers (which would be in high demand if I would actually sell them.)

I cannot do anything to maintain my car and prefer to pay someone else to change the oil, detail it etc. I love to drive though and I love to drive fast!

I love to get dirty & sweaty when I work outside.

I do not bemoan a broken nail or a bad hair day.

I love to be waited on but do not expect it.

I will pay the check if you let me. I will always offer to, unless I tell you I am broke and cannot afford to go out and you offer to treat.

I do not maintain a manicure. I keep my nails short and neat but polish free. My toes ALWAYS have a pedicure-even in winter.

Do not dare to suggest I cannot do something I want to do. Just let me succeed or fail on my own.

Please do not ask me to be in a wedding-especially if you want me to be a server. If we are related, I will gladly help though. Do not ask me to host a shower. I will maybe attend, I WILL send a gift but I am not comfy chatting about most things discussed at those events.

Yes, I am approachable but am rarely approached. But, few people actually make the first move. I have had people tell me I am intimidating but I am really not.


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