Woops you took me the wrong way,that was meant for other butches,not the femmes.

I stand by what I put as my first post. No offence meant.

Yeah I am not a fan of placating. It's oogie and it take away from the convo, I don't need a pat pat soothe from someone cause of their *feelings* as an ally, reading and listening and understanding is enough support for me.

Calling out the isms and crap against us says more to *me* than the pat pat you're so cute admiration.

*shrugs*

Goooooood question Chancie. Hmmmmm....

I guess I assume that straight women are attracted to masculinity and would therefore gravitate towards butches.

Plus, I recall my own experience years ago as a straight-identified woman fascinated and attracted to masculine women.

And I think I've also internalized the whole straight woman/butch thing. You know the one I mean... how butches get hit on by curious straight women all the time and/or how butches are interested in "conquesting" straight women. (This aspect of femme invisibility is actually a very tender spot for me on a personal level). How many threads have we seen about butches and straight women? This is the first I can recall about femmes and straight women.

Anyway... I was surely making big assumptions. Thanks for calling me out on that.

Heart

That.

Whoever said 'Welcome to the world of butch', erm.. welcome to my world and I'm not the slightest bit butch.

All my life I've attracted straight women, men and couples. I don't know what it is but I seem to have 'Fck Me I'm Easy' written all over my forehead. Which is ironic as I'm not into straight women, men or heterosexuals couples.. but they don't get it. The mere fact that I'm breathing means I'm interested, no?

I've also had the horrorhorror. The "oh my god!!! You want to sleep with me don't you? Well you can't! I like CCK! I don't do pussy! Don't come near me, I know you're going to leap on me as soon as I turn my back."

:blink:

Actually I'm not interested in you, you're perfectly safe with me.

"What? You don't think I'm sexy??? How dare you!!!!"

Actually I'm exaggerating. Usually they don't speak to me ever again. They just ensure they keep their back to the wall whenever I'm around, and there's a door nearby :bolt:

I can't believe this just happened to me about three or so weeks ago. I have been trying to put it words.

I am out to only a select few (LIKE TWO) people at work for various reasons.

So, when I came out to my friend about four or five months ago...she seemed to handle it ok. She had been involved in LGBT initiatives in our workplace etc...

About a month ago, I am talking to her about her wedding. She has been WAITING (ahem) for over three years for this dude to propose to her. So, here I am, all getting into it for her--talking about locations, dresses, etc. She really appreciated it b/c many friends were lost during a certain time in her life...enough said on that.

Anyway, we are driving in her car and I just HAPPENED to ask about her fiancee's roommate--I asked nothing except, "Oh, how does she feel about the wedding; did you and your fiancee tell her that she will have to move out? " etc. etc.

OUT OF THE BLUE: She says to me, "Well, I would introduce you to her (I DID NOT ASK TO BE!), but she is ...ummm....pause...."

My mind was at a loss.

Then it hit me.

I said to my friend, "Oh, is she a lesbian?"

Friend: (verbatim practically!): "Yes, and I wouldn't want to be the one who destroyed your marriage."


So..............b/c she found out I was queer, ANY woman was suspect--that I would FALL into bed with them and she would be responsible!

I can't even tell you how I reacted at this point except to say...I DIED. AND TRIED to make her understand...it goes on from there...

yep. as soon as i come out to ONE person, that is what happened. nice.


--------------------------

Sorry you had to experience this from a friend. They are supposed to be the people that you trust, and it obviously backfired! This is ridiculous. From what I have gathered, people get afraid and go into "protection" mode because they do not understand.

I have even done this in my community... specifically with a butch who was into the leather community (something I knew nothing about!). I did some of the same things as stated above, asked stupid questions, was guarded, etc. It wasn't until we talked about it more, understood that she wasn't going to whip me, or force me into some satanic play (lol) that I realized I was just judging her off assumptions. Now, I have met one of the most wonderful, caring, sweet and amazing butches ever!! I am glad she didn't write me off immediately and gave me a chance! Education and conversation are definitely important!!

Just my thought for the day!

LOL!!! love it.. :-D I know the feelings... butches... rawwr... Maybe us femmes can start scaring some butches.... in a good way, of course!! LOL

yuck! That is so gross....

generally, i get the "oh i can see it now" when i come out to people because i am not that feminine. i don't do my nails, wear makeup. When i was thinner, i wore heels, and i do prefer skirts, but i am still very low maintenance. i do pass however.

But when i come out, they accept my identity. i don't get that stuff about something bad happened to me as a child or i just haven't met the right man.

i think there is enough andro in me that their gestalt shifts, and they say, "Ah. i see it now." i have a low voice too.

Anyway, you all online may find this hard to believe, but people tend to like me. And i do see people sort of grieve the person they thought i was. Usually i come out pretty fast, but sometimes for whatever reason, i get to know someone a litte before she learns i am gay. It's weird sometimes witnessing that sense of loss. i guess they can't be friends with a lesbian. Or drop their guard enough for whatever reason to be comfortable around one.

On the other hand, i have a great straight woman friend. She has other lesbian friends. i also have a good friend whose wife's best friend is a dyke. i feel super comfortable around her. i like the company of women. It's sad to feel cut off from that when they can't deal with the fact that i am a dyke.

I am totally game!! lol :police:

One of the funniest/saddest straight moments for me was when I accidentally came out to a friend of mine. We weren't super close friends, but we're okay. You know, wouldn't invite her over for movie night, but we hang together sometimes when we see each other at work functions and friend's parties and such. I was out with a couple of my gay male friends and went to a drag queen show at a gay bar. When we left the bar and were walking down the street the car, I hear "Swan! Hey Swanee! Hey Swan!" and I look up and here she comes.

She hugs me, gets all gushy and then she says "I wasn't sure it was you because I saw you come come out of That Bar with the guys!" I introduced her around and she realized all the men in the group were queer.

The next day at work, she says "It was weird seeing you with all the gay dudes, how come they let you hang with them?" I said "well, I checked "other" in the Penis box on my application and they let me in. They don't care, as long as you're still queer."

She looks me up and down and says "But you look like a girl! I would've never guessed you're a lesbian."

:glasses:

Really? Girly girls can't be gay unless they're Femmy Gay Men? We have to all be KD Lang or Ellen types?

She's nice enough and not intentionallly offensive, just kind of ignorant and she has a faulty brain/mouth filter, so she asks the most outrageously funny/weird/sad questions about "What it's like to be one of you". I find myself avoiding her sometimes because I find it difficult to deal with her when I have to be the Tour Guide on the Gay Safari Tour of Planet Gay. I wish she'd just forget about my sexuality and go back to being her ditzy clueless self. When she realized I was avoiding her, her feelings were hurt. She couldn't decide if it was because I wanted to date her or not. When I explained to her that I generally don't go for the Girly Girls, and I NEVER go for straight ones, she wasn't offended or anything. She just said "yeah, it's easier to get a date when you stick with your own kind." Again, not intentionally offensive but I couldn't believe that came out of her mouth. She's one of those people who's going to be a teenager until she's 80.

I think the scariest moment to me was when I told my best friend at that time I was Queer. She seemed completely okay... til she realized what it meant. You would have thought I saw I slapped her mother how she acted. Now I realize it was fear, for her to not know anything and never be around anyone other than straight friends she had no idea how to handle what I said. Now when I tell someone, I am sure to explain anything so we both don't freak out.

I get this all the time! But you look so 'normal'. I do my nails, have long hair, often wear make-up, and dresses... I am normal, I just happen to normally like butches!

Note: this was not intended as a slam towards KD Lang or Ellen, or their "types"... I happen to think they're all Hottie McHottersons...

ugh god. this has happened plenty of times. Though I'm pretty vocal about being a big ol queer, I still have people suddenly reacting like "WHAT? you... omg." and getting angry about because I snuck past their radar for five minutes. Like I invaded some inner sanctum as a destructive spy. The other part is when later, they come on to you after a few drinks. gosh, that's fun.

Tbh, I get more comming onto me that being horrified. But they get really insulted when you aren't interested. Though one friend when she grabbed me in an alleyway and snogged the hell out of me (????!!! eh. ok. I'll wait for it to stop) when she finished I couldn't help but burst out laughing. She got a little indignant and said "WHAT?"
"oh c'mon, s, this is completely ridiculous, don't be silly. lets go back in and get another beer."

I think by far the worst has been when I was in some cabins when I was doing field research. I was in a room with 7 other girls. One was a navy gal who was serving part time and doing part time studies. When she found out I was lesbian (not like I *hid it* I openly talked about my partner at the time) she refused to get changed around me. To their benefit most of the other girls just rolled their eyes at her but some took up the same vigilant stance.

I came in once, to hose off after being in the mangrove swamp and she was in her jungle stained cotton sweaty knickers and she covered herself and *screamed*. I recall yelling "oh for god's sake. you wouldn't be my type if you were the last one alive" and sat down. She got all upset I was still there and went into the bathroom.

I left and I went into the court yard and bitched about it to one of my colleagues I was getting along with who stayed in a small two floor cabin. four guys on the bottom, four girls on the top. She said "oh. well that sucks. why don't you come and stay in our cabin? We're the naked bisexual cabin. we don't give a shit." That was SO nice. So I went and stayed with them. :D

and I became very good mates with the guys downstairs. it was a very happy ending indeed.

That. It usually takes a while for whatever office I'm working in (I temp a lot) for it to trickle round the office I'm a gayer. English people are pretty good at not letting a beat pass between "... my wife...." and the next sentence. It's a relief to not have to deal with the facial reactions any more. However, the subtle change of behaviour is sometimes a bit sad (if I care enough to notice). I do get some strange expressions of suprise when I talk about my wigs and my sky scraper heels and pictures on my phone of my wedding etc. I usually just laugh it off with "oh I'm really just a big ol drag queen inside." that either confuses them enough to never ever ask again or a light bulb goes on in some bizzare way. The straight girls who do get it are a hoot though.

I always speak for myself when I post: I have had this happen so many times! Because I am femme and "pass"-they always assume I am straight. When I correct that assumption, straight girls either act like somehow I betrayed them because of their assumption or it changes the dynamic of the friend relationship because they assume I am then looking @ them sexually. Maybe I should make a pin to wear: I am a lesbian & only attracted sexually to butches! Femmes are my buddies, chat, gossip,go shopping with.,etc; not to bed!

This is so funny! I just laughed outloud @ work! Love it!

What an experience you had. I have never been in that situation...but I have had the other possibilty happen. Straight women who suddenly want to know what it would be like to kiss or mess around with a lesbian. lol

I completely understand many aspects of the bolded part. I was VERY tomboy in my relationships with men. I even dressed several of them up like girls, strapped on and screwed the hell out of them (fun though! :D I can't help but like a little forced feminization once in a while in terms of consentual play. heh.) and my dad hated me to be feminine. He always told me I would never be taken seriously if I was too feminine.

And same with me, it wasn't until I left bisexuality and male partners that I felt able to be vunerable enough to celebrate my femininity. I feel like a fabulous drag queen at times and a pretty but strong woman at others. I still do most of the DYI cause I enjoy it (inki fixes the bikes, she much better at it) and my dad taught me everything he knows where as my partner's father hired people to do the fixing of things, so she never learned.

I love the dirt and camping and reptiles and fascinating bugs and getting sweaty and I used to be a complete jock (getting back into it). One femme friend I have is taking gladiator training (roman stylee!) and I'm so jealous. She's a real amazon that girl.

But it's so nice to be able to have these people who self ID as butches who see the vunerable bits and not mock them but love them and admire them. I think that's why I get so pissed off when femme jokes get made. It hurts the places that have been hidden for a long time for fear of being mocked.

THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!


I was very masculine in college and loved fixing my car, rescuing damsels in distress and being the protector of many of my female friends (it didn't hurt that it helped me meet a lot of ladies, either).

These days I find myself reluctant to mention those aspects of myself because I feel it invalidates my femme identity. Does fixing a flat tire in heels make me less of a femme? I'm not sure, but I am certainly insecure about it. It's just another thing that causes some of my hetero friends to be reminded that I am "other" than them.

I've always hated it when straight women find out, and then they start flirting with you, or want to experiment with you, as if that would even be an option.

I don't mind it that much. Roflol.

I so agree! I think their thinking is we have no standards or morales and we'd jump at the chance to sleep with them! Thank you very much, but straight girls keep moving right along!

I got outed in high school, so I've dealt with this much of my life, Oklahoma is a pretty conservative place.

Mostly I just make a joke out of it and tell women they have a really big head if they think every lesbian likes them. (I don't even try to explain why I ID as queer, not lez) If they don't get this, I start pointing at traditionally unattractive guys, and say something like, "You're straight, you like him, right? And him too, right? And him?"

And then I tell them I don't date women who wear makeup and heels, which inevitably leads to the "why don't you just date a man?" conversation (again, not going to approach the fact that I like trans guys too; it could blow their little minds), to which I've just come up with the simple reply of "They smell gross and have too much body hair. It icks me out." It's a gross oversimplification, but it shuts them up. Sometimes you have to consider your audience and tailor your answer to something they can understand.

OH my Lawd, this creeps me the hell out when women do this! It's only happened a few times, and I try to be sensitive (in my experience, they tend to be the girls with lower self-esteems, or higher blood-alcohol levels!), but explain I don't just mess around (period), and that coming out of the closet is a prerequisite to even kissing me.

What bothers me is when they figure me out , and start rounding up their kids. Like if I'm in target or something. "Tommy, Susan, get over here, stay right here by me". I want to say in a fake cartoon evil voice, "Yeah the big bad butch might get you." Lol

Oh God, that's the worst! Makes you want to say, "That toddler is nice and plump. I ate one just like him for breakfast this morning. Took forever to bake."

Ah, bigots. Some are entertaining, some make you want to puke, but everywhere you look in Oklahoma, there's another one.

*chuckle*

Yeah....why doesn't that suprise me, Jagg? :sunglass:

Because you're smart like that ! I can't sneak anything by you. =)

E-X-A-C-T-L-E-Y....