Young, young and more young, with white privilege "perspective" thrown in for good measure.

I feel for young, searching and questioning kids looking for answers :| on YouTube.

It scares me to death. One day my daughter was watching some You Tube that her friend who was over said was hilarious. Our computer is "public" space so I was right there with them. It was a ninja video with these two boys, late teens, doing ninja style tree and then ninja style lion and then...ninja style faggot (!) with the word floating on the screen! I was appalled and immediately told them that was NOT acceptable and not funny and not to be shared or watched. I could not believe it!

Sorry for the derail. You Tube is scary.

Inanity my dear...

Um
 

So what was the point in posting a you tube that had zero to do with the convo?

please don't call me "dear" we're not homies:) thank you

By the by...for those of you who thought I was intersecting an opinion, I was not. Perhaps my tag should have included a disclaimer. But I thought the speaker so inane that her self-important soliloquy would need no further disaffirmation.

First of all, I did not mean to be disrespectful. That is not who I am. Secondly, your response felt like a slap. Just saying that it felt like being bullied. My perspective. And if that is what this site is about, then I would prefer to step away. There is enough of my life where I'm the one standing alone to protect others when they don't have a voice. Let's say that her opinion had been my opinion or understanding. Isn't there a better way to address it? Sometimes things are interjected into a conversation to begin a dialogue. I do not know you, but neither do you know me.

Oh brother
 

Oh for fucks sake I'm a bully because I'm not empathetic to what some white kid defined Stud as?

Oh please!

Maybe you should read what the thread is about or supposed to be about.

Unbelievable!

I have read the post from the beginning, dissenting opinions and all. And I did not call you a bully. I actually said that I felt I was being bullied by posting something that did not take the turn you projected for the conversation. Why would anyone want to propose a differing opinion from yours when all they would get would be wtf and are you kidding? If you want to dialogue about it, let's dialogue.

For the record, who said anyone was empathetic with the "white kid."

Where do I start?
 

You said you felt like you were bullied, semantics.

The person in the video starts out with


Don't tell me that I'm wrong BEFORE she goes into her descriptors of lesbian, butch, Stud, Femme identities.


Femme-- girls who look entirely straight and girly

Dykes- a whole other level of lesbian



Butch-- buzzed hair no make up over sized clothing



Stud-- All pictures of white kids in between butch or femme, girls with short hair sag from the belt in between a boy or girl. Always short hair wear make up or eye liner


Hence the justifiable WTF, btw I'm not the only one going WTF why you not referring to them as bullyish? Hmm?

Corkey,

Obviously I did not think it through and for that I do apologize. My intent was not to offend.

True, but the thing is, she seems to believe she is and that makes me inclined to feel protective over her as she is, probably only about 18-19 years of age. I think that labels and identities are very changeable based on culture, ethnicity, background, age, experience, etc. This is her limited experience of the world and it is a perspective. That's it. Just one perspective in a slew of perspectives in the world.

I don't believe there is a thing as subjective reality. Reality is the world you've created and observed and experienced. We all gravitate toward others whose understanding of reality is similar to ours. This is what generates the destructive and ever-present "us versus them" mentality on this planet.

Was her video a bit immature? IMO,yes. However, I truly don't think she has an inkling of the butch/femme culture as it originated, which is something I have learned to have great respect for as I've researched and learned my roots, where this dynamic came from, and how sacred it is. I think the younger the generation, the less respectful simply because they have not had to fight for their place like their predecessors have. To them, sexuality has become fluid, almost a "style", instead of an identity.

I might get some flack for this but it's what I've observed. Again, perspective.

Butch-- buzzed hair no make up over sized clothing

I don't fit the buzzed hair look should I buzzz it ----nope don't think so but that's my opinion and the only one that counts right lol?
Everyone has a right to their on opinion but when you try to force it on other people then this is what happens .

With each generation the terminology changes so they can better understand themselves as does the different types of lesbians/gays. Do gay guys have so many labels and different styles as gay women do? But if you push your beliefs on others it will meet with resistance. It's better to be a little more subtle in approach .

You definitely have a point there. Culture ----- civilization, society, mores , background traditions, ethnicity, customs , way of life. Those kids should respect their elders etc. but how many have been taught ---yes I said taught to do that?

Right --raise theirselves making it up as they go along.

LOL I agree with you on that one.

Ask yourself though at that age lol what did you think about people of our age opinions. We can try to lead by example and let them know that kind of attitude isn't really acceptable.

LOL so am I. Was taught to respect my elders also.
I've been around alot of different cultures myself-----almost went into the services ---almost lol. To much of a rebel back then to let someone tell me what to do 24/7. Still can't handle the 24/7 or some of societies rules :D, but if I want to keep my ass out of jail or keep a job I have to abide lol.

Studs vs Butches
 

In Oakland, California, it's the term the young dykes use to identify themselves. I DO think of horses when I hear it. I prefer the term butch, but as someone mentioned here it has been used in the past to refer to handsome virile young man and I don't think some young people relate it to breeding stock, but maybe some do. Culture and age is truly part of the attraction and reason for certain terms being acceptable.

Deflection is a biatch
 

People, don't like doing their own research when it comes to cultural differences, it's expected that the answers are handed to them quietly. I can't count how many times when cultural differences come up that the bully/silencing deflection comes up when POC refuse to do the leg work for those who want answers. Unless it handed to them(general)
they're not going to learn it on their own. It's not a POC's job to educate not only the white folk out in the real world, here on BFP and certainly not over a video of a white kid from SANTA BARBARA spewing her appropriations. It really isn't yet it's EXPECTED. Do your homework folks, don't expect others to do it for you.

Where (and when) I grew up in the Midwest (different area of the Midwest than I currently live in, back in the early '90s) the term stud was used for a butch who only gave when it came to sex. A stud never received from the person they were 'doing.' In my opinion, it all comes down to where you live and from which generation you are from. The term has changed a lot over the years and varies from region to region.

It does seem like a horse for the definition we used back then in our little town. A stud horse was used for one purpose - to get a mare pregnant. A stud in my community was also used for one purpose - to get the other person off. I was a stud back then, but not anymore! Gimme! LOL

Asking the question is the first step to "doing a little research."
I don't think it's a "bad thing," to suggest the Internet as a resource, but I think the reaction to it depends on the person who asked the question in the first place. For someone shy and new, I can certainly see how it might feel as a shut out answer. From a neutral point of view, I just don't find it very helpful, and as the OP said, she was hoping for a discussion, which did eventually take place. From my own point of view, if I'm looking to connect with my community, I am looking for opinions from my community, not from an Internet search that is going to spit back 85,000,000 results that I have to weed through, not knowing if I'm even on the right track. I haven't tried to Google "why do some butches refer to themselves as studs" so maybe the answer is plain as day, but that still doesn't preclude me from wanting to talk to my own community about it. I trust this community for answers on LGBTQ issues more than I would an Internet search.

In reference to this particular thread, the question wasn't about cultural differences- the OP was looking for the source of the different use in terms. It wasn't until a few of us answered "it's a cultural thing" that it became a discussion about culture. The problem I have with the point of view that people should "educate themselves" is that it presumes people know which sources are "good" sources. Everyone who writes a book thinks its good and real and true information, so how does someone who doesn't know anything about that subject know if they are reading good, real, and true information? Speaking for myself, I'd rather go to someone I know or a community I am familiar with and ask questions than to read articles on the Internet, or books, and try to figure out what's real and what's bullshit. If someone were researching discrimination in education, do you think all of the available research materials would point them in a clear and defined direction that would be in the same direction of people's experiences and opinions of this community? Some would and some woudn't, so that takes them back to square one. I'm for *helping* people become educated; I don't expect them to do it on their own.

Thoughts
 

Sad truth is, that POC aren't running to join BFP or they aren't willing to share their experiences and culture and words they use because of stuff like this. The last You Tube that was posted as a I'm not really sure why is certainly not going to feel welcoming to folks who do identify as these cultural terms. It just isn't. The shame on you for not taking time to educate us more thing gets old. I know I get tired of it, because frankly QoS, we have come in here and helped define, explain and put out there what Studs. Aggressives. Macha culture is. It took one You Tube from some kid from Santa Barbara of all places to turn this back into give the white folk a break, why aren't you educating them. That girl on that video isn't going to be educated, she said it herself, it's how she sees it and fuck the rest of ya'll if you disagree.


What's the point in putting in a shit ton of time explaining over and over what the terms are and the cultural back ground when all of a sudden some white kid comes in and spews all kinds of shit and now we have to stop, educate, and take a step back because she's 18 and young?


That girl isn't going to make room for me as a Woman of Color in the world, why am I having to for her, a person I don't even know, a person like all the other persons out in the real world that I am having to make room for because they aren't educated on cultural terms, people, lives.


That's where I am coming from as in do your damn homework on your own, it's really a waste of time to even type it out because people just don't.


Nobody educated me on other peoples, I took the time and I educated myself on how to maneuver around all the other cultures around me at all times.

Thank you for sharing all of this, and I know it's come up in many threads before. I want to be very clear about one thing though - I am not coming from a "shame on you" place, *at all*. I get what you're saying - frankly there were times I felt the same way about educating people about the queer community, it can be exhausting. But what I'm afraid of is that if we *don't* step up and take the opportunity to educate someone who is asking for answers, he or she will get their "education" from people like we saw in that fucked up video. I agree that some people can never be freed from their ignorance, no matter how hard you try, but there are clearly others who really do want to understand, and I just hate to see those opportunities wasted. I'm not saying we should spoon feed all of the information, but we can at least provide some resources and be a resource ourselves.