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-   -   What is on your mind (http://www.butchfemmeplanet.com/forum/showthread.php?t=147)

Cin 12-17-2020 11:38 AM

This is on my mind.

It seems that many people believe that diversity of opinion inevitably leads to rude interactions and nasty comments. I have never thought that was necessarily a given. Nor have I believed that a polite voice cannot be a dissenting voice. I don't have to be an asshole to disagree with something and to make my opinion understood. Of course there are some people who hear dissenting opinions as nasty comments. And the clearer you are and the more sense you make the more some people hear your words as disagreeable and nasty. There's really nothing that can be done about that. But most people can hear an opposing opinion without crumbling or resorting to mean and angry responses. I agree that it does take more effort to find polite ways to say I don't agree with you at all and here is why than it does to simply say you are wrong and what you're saying is stupid. It takes effort and commitment to find legitimate reasons why you believe someone's opinions are wrong. And it takes a desire to be civil to find ways to express those reasons that don't insinuate the person is stupid or horrible for having a different opinion than you do. I have noticed that some people simply turn a specific comment into something generic and say I read stuff that say that and i think it's stupid. It's an almost polite why of calling you stupid while getting around the TOS. I never believe that calling something stupid is a justification for why it isn't a legitimate opinion. A person should have valid reasons for the opinions they hold. If you are going to disagree with someone you should at least respect them enough as a human being to put a little time and effort into explaining why you disagree and not just say it's stupid.

As far as where all the deep and meaningful conversations have gone here on this site I have no idea. But I don't believe having to express yourself respectfully is the reason these conversations are far and few in between.

Kätzchen 12-17-2020 02:15 PM

I hope no one forgets the past four years of power-grabbing hostile, deranged type personalities who nearly destroyed democracy in America by relentlessly feeding mis/dis-information to people who are willing to believe lies over truth or believe fiction over fact.

And I am forever grateful that there are people out there who invest in the best interest of others.

Bèsame* 12-17-2020 04:44 PM

Looking forward to this...


~ocean 12-17-2020 11:22 PM

thank you Besame ~ good movie :)

clementinefemme 12-17-2020 11:40 PM

Wow visiting my family makes me want a family of my own... why is my biological clock doing this to me in the middle of my master's program while 1000% single lol

GeorgiaMa'am 12-18-2020 12:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clementinefemme (Post 1279188)
Wow visiting my family makes me want a family of my own... why is my biological clock doing this to me in the middle of my master's program while 1000% single lol

As an older friend who was a mother told me when I started feeling this way: "Your biological clock will stop doing this to you in a few years. On the other hand, if you have kids, you will have them for the rest of your life."

I chose to get a tattoo instead of kids.

GeorgiaMa'am 12-18-2020 01:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cin (Post 1279165)
I wonder why people have stopped talking. Maybe all the older folks are all talked out and the younger folks are not interested in interacting in this way. Maybe it's private groups but I haven't found any that are active like this place was at one time. I know the butch/femme dynamic is not celebrated like it once was but there has to be butches and femmes around somewhere. I mean where did they all go? No next generation? We have died out like dinosaurs? Extinct? I mean we don't even have conversations about our imminent extinction and what happened. Where have all the butches gone?

It seems to me that all the women who would have id'ed as butch in the past have now decided that they must be transgender. I don't know what's going on with the femmes - they're probably all wearing lululemons now if they have to go out and wearing pajamas all day with no make up while they work at home. I'm being kind of sarcastic, but . . . not really. My high femme days are few and far between. I think the pandemic is contributing to the demise of the butch/femme community.

I had hoped that the pandemic would actually bring our community closer, trapped in front of our computers as we all are now. But it doesn't seem to have worked out that way.

Wrang1er 12-18-2020 05:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeorgiaMa'am (Post 1279194)
It seems to me that all the women who would have id'ed as butch in the past have now decided that they must be transgender. I don't know what's going on with the femmes - they're probably all wearing lululemons now if they have to go out and wearing pajamas all day with no make up while they work at home. I'm being kind of sarcastic, but . . . not really. My high femme days are few and far between. I think the pandemic is contributing to the demise of the butch/femme community.

I had hoped that the pandemic would actually bring our community closer, trapped in front of our computers as we all are now. But it doesn't seem to have worked out that way.


Still here. Still butch.

I can only speak for myself but this year has been one big kick in the gut. I sank into myself for a good part of it. I was never a frequent contributor but would pipe up on occasion. It seems that with the disappearance of chat and many of the regular Planeteers the fluff threads are all that remain. Even my dinners have gotten too boring to post about.

easygoingfemme 12-18-2020 07:56 AM

Still here. Still Femme. Still getting dressed for work every day. Except for yesterday's snow day. My partner is as butch as ever which is about 100% max. So that speaks for my two people in the world. I agree, things are blending, a lot of folks transitioning- which- I'm glad they have the opportunity to do so when that's their true self and they can live it. I think a lot of people are "computered out" if they work from home and are on zoom and stuff all day. But we were petering here before covid so.... there's that. In general, communities all over are breaking down/changing/diminishing. We usually have a pretty active GBLTQ meet up group where I live and just looking at that one pocket, not being able to have meet ups, has really liquidated our community.

Cin 12-18-2020 02:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeorgiaMa'am (Post 1279194)
It seems to me that all the women who would have id'ed as butch in the past have now decided that they must be transgender. I don't know what's going on with the femmes - they're probably all wearing lululemons now if they have to go out and wearing pajamas all day with no make up while they work at home. I'm being kind of sarcastic, but . . . not really. My high femme days are few and far between. I think the pandemic is contributing to the demise of the butch/femme community.

I had hoped that the pandemic would actually bring our community closer, trapped in front of our computers as we all are now. But it doesn't seem to have worked out that way.

Yes, I suppose some people given no other option, would have previously identified as butch but now are able to imagine a truer identity for themselves. Over the past few years there has occurred opportunity for deep internal exploration of gender for a lot of people. Gender studies became the darling of universities giving rise to many thought provoking ideas and lots of writing surrounding gender and personal gender expression. Such discourse has allowed a diverse range of people to explore gender and look inward. It's given many people the language to express who they feel they really are inside. People can embrace identities that feel right for them that were not understood twenty years ago. Non binary, third gender and genderqueer are some of the identities that may be a better fit for many. I do think non binary works well for me, although I still claim my identity as a butch woman. Historically I have struggled identifying as either of the gender options recognized by the majority of society. I am not comfortable with either exclusively. I'm not clear what a blended version of both looks like for me. I cannot let go of a female identity because of my feminist ideology and I am never comfortable with identifying as male because of the patriarchy, the misogynistic world view and the privilege inherent in a male identity. So I flounder a lot. Not exactly sure who I am or what fits for me. I have been most comfortable identifying as a butch woman but over the years I've come to the realization that for me it doesn't matter that much. I am comfortable in my skin even if I'm not sure how to name it.

I often thought of myself as transgender because of my experience of being uncomfortable with society's definition of woman and could not see myself reflected there. But my feelings regarding the transgender community is reminiscent of how some people feel about the lesbian community. They would never identify as a lesbian because of their experience with the community. My experience with the transgender community is similar. Many transgender people insist on referring to butches as cisgendered. While some maybe okay with that I have never felt that worked for me. I struggled too long and too hard internally because my sex and gender did not match and my gender incongruence resulted in many negative experiences for me throughout my life. It's like spitting in my face to call me cisgendered. You shouldn't insist on giving people identities that they do not claim for themselves. This turned me off and made me protect my butch identity even more. At this point in my life I no longer give a fat rat's ass. I am a butch woman who is not cisgendered and is comfortable with a non binary identity.

But the interesting question I ponder often is what has become of the butch-femme dynamic in this brave new world. Gender identities are not sexual orientation. So what does new language for gender, new ways of defining oneself, different boundaries for self identification mean for sexual attraction? As a new generation of queers come of age what will define their attractions? Transgender include all types of sexual orientation so there are some queers in there. Non binary as well and third gender and genderqueer. Will there be a similar dynamic with a different name? Like gender, the boundaries of sexual orientation has expanded exponentially. It's a pretty exciting time to be young and exploring sexuality. I am neither but academically speaking it's interesting to consider.

~ocean 12-18-2020 03:33 PM

there will always be B&F in our community ~ everyone has gone on facebook or sites for younger aged people . When it comes to peoples sexual identity ~ I don't wanna know lolol I know who I am and what I like ~ that's all I need to know. ~~ ** wink **

C0LLETTE 12-18-2020 03:45 PM

Re:Cin's post

And THAT is the kind of post we used to have here before we drifted off almost entirely into recipes for cabbage rolls and corn bread.

I'm not smart enough or well versed enough to write that kind of post but I sure as hell loved reading it and learned a whole lot about one person's identity journey. Breadcrumbs for my own walk in the woods.

For some, that is reason enough to treasure this site and keep returning.

VintageFemme 12-18-2020 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cin (Post 1279208)
Yes, I suppose some people given no other option, would have previously identified as butch but now are able to imagine a truer identity for themselves. Over the past few years there has occurred opportunity for deep internal exploration of gender for a lot of people. Gender studies became the darling of universities giving rise to many thought provoking ideas and lots of writing surrounding gender and personal gender expression. Such discourse has allowed a diverse range of people to explore gender and look inward. It's given many people the language to express who they feel they really are inside. People can embrace identities that feel right for them that were not understood twenty years ago. Non binary, third gender and genderqueer are some of the identities that may be a better fit for many. I do think non binary works well for me, although I still claim my identity as a butch woman. Historically I have struggled identifying as either of the gender options recognized by the majority of society. I am not comfortable with either exclusively. I'm not clear what a blended version of both looks like for me. I cannot let go of a female identity because of my feminist ideology and I am never comfortable with identifying as male because of the patriarchy, the misogynistic world view and the privilege inherent in a male identity. So I flounder a lot. Not exactly sure who I am or what fits for me. I have been most comfortable identifying as a butch woman but over the years I've come to the realization that for me it doesn't matter that much. I am comfortable in my skin even if I'm not sure how to name it.

I often thought of myself as transgender because of my experience of being uncomfortable with society's definition of woman and could not see myself reflected there. But my feelings regarding the transgender community is reminiscent of how some people feel about the lesbian community. They would never identify as a lesbian because of their experience with the community. My experience with the transgender community is similar. Many transgender people insist on referring to butches as cisgendered. While some maybe okay with that I have never felt that worked for me. I struggled too long and too hard internally because my sex and gender did not match and my gender incongruence resulted in many negative experiences for me throughout my life. It's like spitting in my face to call me cisgendered. You shouldn't insist on giving people identities that they do not claim for themselves. This turned me off and made me protect my butch identity even more. At this point in my life I no longer give a fat rat's ass. I am a butch woman who is not cisgendered and is comfortable with a non binary identity.

But the interesting question I ponder often is what has become of the butch-femme dynamic in this brave new world. Gender identities are not sexual orientation. So what does new language for gender, new ways of defining oneself, different boundaries for self identification mean for sexual attraction? As a new generation of queers come of age what will define their attractions? Transgender include all types of sexual orientation so there are some queers in there. Non binary as well and third gender and genderqueer. Will there be a similar dynamic with a different name? Like gender, the boundaries of sexual orientation has expanded exponentially. It's a pretty exciting time to be young and exploring sexuality. I am neither but academically speaking it's interesting to consider.

Well said.

I have always thought that butches were a third gender. To consider that our entire human race is only two genders, as complex and unique as we are, seems somewhat arrogant and yet simplistic. I do believe we are entering a new generation of discovery where not only will multiple genders be realized but that they may be fluid as well. It is indeed a very exciting time to be young and coming into your own. Biases and pegged genders as well as the gay or straight sexuality trap, are becoming archaic ways of thinking.

Cin 12-22-2020 12:52 PM

Here's what's on my mind today. Way back in the day when I was considering transgender as an identity I really felt like it fit somewhere, somehow for me. When I would look in a mirror there was always a moment of shock while I realized my idea of who I was did not match with the reality. I was always unpleasantly surprised by my breasts. You'd think I would have retained the knowledge of their existence, but I was able to put them out of my mind. Until I saw them. They were so disconcerting. I'd be like what are these things doing there.

Over time I decided I was not interested in transitioning but I spent a bit of time considering it and what I understood for myself was my attraction to femmes were/are a part of a transgender/transgressive sexual orientation. I am not transgender in the way that I feel my sex is male but I feel butch as a sort of transgender identity much more than I feel it to be a transgressive identity. I understand femme as a more transgressive one. Both are subversive in my mind. So I understand butch and femme attraction as a transgender/transgressive attraction. A yin/yang attraction to a degree. Which I think can be duplicated in other non binary identities and sexual attractions and orientations. Maybe

clay 12-22-2020 04:54 PM

RIP KT Oslin
 
Just read that KT Oslin passed away. She was 78! I saw her in HotLanta years ago...when she first began her career. She wore a silk brocade gold jacket, sleeves rolled up and long, black gloves, up to her elbow. When asked about them, she told the crowd, an older lady friend of mine gave me these, said it will be your trademark. I LOVED 80's Ladies of hers!! I have all of music on CD's a friend recorded for me.

RIP KT...the lovely gloved one!!

Kätzchen 12-24-2020 07:34 PM

On my mind is how awesome it is that President-Elect Joe Biden is appointing exceptionally competent people from the LGBTQ community to posts in the Biden-Harris administration.

You can read about the latest news, over @ The Advocate.

Orema 12-25-2020 07:03 AM

My family. I seldom get homesick, but I’m really missing them this holiday season.

Gemme 12-25-2020 03:21 PM

I had a nice chat with my dad today. It's been good to reconnect.

Stone-Butch 12-25-2020 07:05 PM

On your mind
 
I am so sorry to hear of K.T.s passing. I met that lovely woman five times and each time I gave her a boomerang (I'll always come back as in her song). Each time I wrote when and where on it and she said she hung them in her hallway in her home. I saw her three times in concert, twice in Canada and have lots of her posters and autographs. She was such a nice person and I know her health was failing but did not know she had passes. RIP K.T. you are among the stars and have found your place, sing to the angels.

Orema 01-14-2021 06:23 AM

Sight unseen
 
Am probably going to purchase my next home sight unseen.

Found a condo I like, my offer has been accepted, but there’s no way I will make it there in time for the home inspection early next week.

I have a relative who can view it, but that’s not the same. I trust my realtor, but not to the extent of choosing my home.

With the inauguration next week, it would be my luck to fly there this weekend and run into some MAGA fucktards in the airport or on the plane. This is what I’m most concerned about because the inauguration is next Wednesday.

Thought of flying first class (smaller cabin, less people, less chance for COVID?) but I could end up dealing with MAGA haters because they fly first class, too. There will probably be more undercover Marshals on the plane than usual, but I DON’T TRUST ANYONE TO PROTECT ME if I’m caught up in some MAGA shit on a plane or in an airport.

I might travel there the following week (after the inauguration), but by then I would have approved the deal. Still, I’d get a chance to see the condo and could still pull out of the deal, but would lose my deposit. Maybe that’s the price I’ll have to pay to buy a condo during a pandemic and political upheaval.

I’m researching “buying a home sight unseen,” am speaking with people, using technology (Google Maps street views), and am writing a list of questions and concerns for the home inspector and realtor.

I’ve been lucky with finding places to live. Have loved most homes I’ve lived in.

Here’s hoping the condo Gods aren’t laughing at me.

FireSignFemme 01-14-2021 03:48 PM

I'm wondering when or if Walmart grocery items coming through the mail will arrive. My most recent food delivery order placed with them was hell. I've had so many issues ordering food online from our local store I'm not going to anymore, or recommend anyone else take that risk either, it's just not worth it. However, I've always had good luck buying both food and grocery items through Walmart and having them shipped direct to my home from the manufacturer, wholesaler, non-Walmart retailer and so on. So here's to hoping.

GeorgiaMa'am 01-14-2021 10:09 PM

I'm thinking how much trouble it is breaking in a new phone and getting it set up the way I want. I was not even able to answer calls on my new phone, until I chatted with tech support and was told what to change in my settings. Who would think that being able to turn off answering your phone would even be a valid choice? It's a phone, for Pete's sake.

homoe 01-15-2021 04:08 AM

~~
A doctor's appointment in Tacoma on Monday...:|

Bèsame* 01-15-2021 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by homoe (Post 1280194)
~~
A doctor's appointment in Tacoma on Monday...:|

Lol..I have one on Tues following a liquid diet..😮😨😟

Then the following week another boob smash!!!🤨

Orema 01-17-2021 02:50 AM

Food
 
Getting my appetite under control. Have been eating like a mad woman lately. Have been eating the right (for me) foods, haven’t gained weight, but haven’t loss any either.

Am having inspections left and right and waiting for any kind of approval creates a stress in me that’s eased by food. At the same time I need to eat food in the pantry and fridge so I don’t have to toss any food out when it’s time to move.

akiza 01-17-2021 01:26 PM

School it starts in february so i'm so happy to be back in noiselandia 😅 and how i'll like to transform the person who hurts mom and my aunt in little pea with a baseball batte that rat should have a taste of her own medicine! 😑

Orema 01-23-2021 10:56 AM

Showers
 
I'm going to convert my tub to a shower. Have done this before with really good results.

The top two showers use lighter tiles than what I want, but I like the low-key patterns of the tile and the overall design.

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/17...g?v=1501071962

https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/17...g?v=1501072833

I like the one below a lot but would use different hardware. Will probably go with these colors.

https://vintagemoderndesignbuild.com...8532689351.jpg

Not sure any of these will fit into my budget. Will find out once I get some quotes.

Will do the shower conversion after I move in, but will get new flooring and a paint job before I move in.

It's not a done deal yet, but we're getting there. Expecting to close the second and third week of February. And I expect to be in the mitten by March 1.

Lucky me.

:bow:

GeorgiaMa'am 01-23-2021 01:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Orema (Post 1280485)
I'm going to convert my tub to a shower. Have done this before with really good results.

The top two showers use lighter tiles than what I want, but I like the low-key patterns of the tile and the overall design.
. . .
Expecting to close the second and third week of February. And I expect to be in the mitten by March 1.

Very nice! Good luck with your closing.

I really like the contrasting tile in the recessed shelf area in the top photo. The contrasting floor might be a bit much for me, though - I think I like the 3rd one better for the floor.

Excellent to have a grown-up shower! I know that's what people want now. Personally, I don't think I could live without a soaking tub, though.

Orema 01-23-2021 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GeorgiaMa'am (Post 1280488)
Very nice! Good luck with your closing.

I really like the contrasting tile in the recessed shelf area in the top photo. The contrasting floor might be a bit much for me, though - I think I like the 3rd one better for the floor.

Excellent to have a grown-up shower! I know that's what people want now. Personally, I don't think I could live without a soaking tub, though.

Thank you, GeorgiaMa’am. Things are going smoothly on both ends.

I’m drawn to the earth tones, but want something different than what I’m normally drawn toward. Though I may need to get a prefab. As long as it’s a walk in shower with seating it will work.

Orema 01-27-2021 01:55 PM

Therapy
 
It's time to get back into therapy.

Have been holding onto some bad and negative feelings. One area I've been holding onto since childhood—months or years can go by without it crossing my mind and then something reminds me of it and BAM, there it is, like a concrete block obscuring or distorting everything. I have another area of bad and negative feelings that came about in the last 7 or so years. It's more controllable, but it's something I need to address. Luckily, neither of these problems involve sexual abuse.

I had much success with a therapist a few years ago who helped me after my car accident and with a sexual abuse issue I had. But I had to stop seeing her after she downplayed my fear of Trump. I didn't even want to discuss it with her. I just wanted to do my hypnotherapy for driving, but she pushed it wanting to know how I felt. I told her and she poo-pooed and downplayed the importance of my fear. She just didn't get it. I had hoped that she could help me in other areas but we never got that far. Anyway, I do well with cognitive therapy when focusing on specific areas and problems. I'll get back into therapy once I'm in the midwest.

Orema 02-21-2021 10:36 AM

My wrist is on my mind. It was two years ago this week when I accidentally cut my wrist. It’s healed really well, but it’s a little numb and isn’t as strong as my left wrist. I notice the weakness when I do (or did) my curls.

Exercising and weight gain is on my mind too. I miss my bike and will start ridding again once I’m in the condo. I think I’ve gained a couple pounds. Hopefully not more than a few. We’ll see soon enough.

:bow:

GeorgiaMa'am 02-22-2021 09:40 AM

Texas
 
The situation in Texas with the electricity is on my mind right now. Apparently, almost all of Texas has its own power grid which is not connected to either the Eastern or Western U.S. power grid. This is why so many Texans were without power during the storm last week.

Also, it seems that one of the electric plans that's available to Texans is a variable rate plan. This allows their bills to be low - most of the time. But in a situation like last week where demand far outstripped availability, the rates went sky high - I have heard two examples so far, one family with a bill over $10,000, and another with a bill over $5,000. Also, the ranchers racked up huge bills because they were trying to keep all of their farm animals warm and alive. Some of these ranchers are family businesses, who have all of their money tied up in their livestock - if the livestock dies, the ranchers go bankrupt and could even lose their homes.

Their state legislature is working now to do something; like for instance, the electric utility has been prevented from sending out any more bills for the moment, and they can't disconnect people's electricity. But I suspect the Texas government is spending a lot of time playing the blame game, and it will all be tied up in politics. In the meantime, the electric bills keep ticking their way upward.

I haven't heard any statistics or news stories about how many people died or how much livestock died during the storm, but surely there must have been some. I'm sure the homeless people were hit hard. Also, I know people were melting ice and snow to get water; but in Georgia, whenever it snows, we have always been warned not to drink or eat the snow. It's full of pollution from the upper atmosphere, and can be harmful. I wonder what the repercussions of millions of people drinking this stuff will be for years to come?

I know several of our own BFPers live in Texas. I hope they are all doing well; my heart goes out to them.

FireSignFemme 02-22-2021 03:14 PM

Now that GeorgiaMa'am mentioned it, it's got me thinking too about how the power outage in certain parts of the state coupled with the COVID crisis is affecting people down there, particularly in some of the harder hit areas, especially members of our most vunerable populations.

Stone-Butch 02-22-2021 05:05 PM

On your mind
 
Up here in Canada we have had tons of snow but we have not run into the problems that you have down there particularly in Texas. Even though we are separate countries we are all together on BFP to wish each other safe journey. We hope you can get some relief for Texas and all other affected states. Yes we do think of you and wish you well.

homoe 02-23-2021 10:05 AM

~~
Spring......

Reach *BANNED* 02-23-2021 03:20 PM

That losing my Mom has been the most devastating event of my entire life, and it has been only a little over a month since she passed. I cannot imagine a feeling of comparative heartbreak.

For those that still have their Mom- call her and tell her how much you love her.

nina03 02-23-2021 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Reach (Post 1281408)
That losing my Mom has been the most devastating event of my entire life, and it has been only a little over a month since she passed. I cannot imagine a feeling of comparative heartbreak.

For those that still have their Mom- call her and tell her how much you love her.

I'm so sorry for your loss. A month for that kind of loss is like a minute. You'll need so much more time for grieving and healing. I hope you're surrounded by love and support right now.

MrSunshine 02-23-2021 06:34 PM

All on my mind
 
I was just sitting here thinking about this girl, actually. I’ve thought about her a lot. I almost hurt myself counting back the years trying to figure out how long it’s been since I met her, online. I’ve always thought about her like “the one that got away.”
We talked forever and became really good friends but I always felt another connection there. She had reservations I guess because I was a wild asshole. I’m not sure about that one but if I had to guess.
Anyway, fast forward almost 20 years which I cannot believe myself and now I’m just an old, calm, ass hole.
She’s strong and honest and bold and sexy as hell. Did I mention just a big hearted amazing person? I’m not sure if she didn’t believe me or didn’t believe all that about herself. I’m pretty sure she does now.
If you see her around...

homoe 02-24-2021 03:33 PM

~~
Chicago........:praying:

Orema 02-24-2021 04:54 PM

SNOW
The snow is melting in my neck of the woods and I’ve been out and about. Got a car wash, gas, checking out the neighborhood, not using cabs (for now), feelin’ good behind the wheel. Got a notification on my car while driving that I might be driving on ice—thank goodness I wasn’t. Didn’’t know I had a warning like that. Very cool. I need to re-read my user manual. Will do that soon.

RENOVATIONS
Met a contractor yesteray that didn’t want to give me a written estimate on a tub-to-shower conversion (!) and only offered a discount if I gave him an answer right then and there, on the spot (as if).

Met a contractor today who’ll give me a 12% discount on the conversion if I choose them in 30 days and will throw in a nice shower head/hand held thingy if I go with them in 7 days. They’ve been in business for 28 years. They pretty much offer the same as the guy from yesterday, but a few more bells and whistles that I like. I’m really digging the contractor I met today. Will meet another contractor tomorrow and they will have to come strong and be really good to impress me more than the guy I met today.


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