Gemme, your question makes a lot of sense. And this has been one of my questions. Perhaps I am once again over simplifying things. But why does there have to be additional language? You're Femme. You prefer to be in charge. Therefore, you're a femme who requires being in charge. If you're a femme and you're dominant then you're a dominant femme. And if you're a femme and a natural born leader then you're a femme natural born leader. No additional language needed. It has nothing to do with being masculine. It's still all about being femme.

Now I do recognize that for some to say that they have masculine energy or their male side comes out is an accurate statement. Of course it is! They would know. But that strikes me as separate from the fact that they are in charge or the boss or whatever descriptor is used when talking about Femme led relationships. Help me understand.

It seems that the masculine energy/male side is separate just like BDSM, D/s, M/s, etc. is separate from this conversation. I get that we (human beings) have both male and female within us. But that isn't what makes you the boss right? I know that people describe those characteristics as male when seen but is that really an accurate classification?

Taking a seat to listen and learn. Thanks for letting me be a participant.

Come on now--Aren't they all femme-led?

For me... My dominant energy is neither masculine nore feminine... It simply is energy... For me the closest I can come to putting it into words is.. I AM... I am confident, I am secure, I am certain.... It has nothing to do with gender or how I ID

Ps... thank you for your post Gemmie.. I came back to respond to it, but decided to do a two for one...

but just for the record those attributes of confidence etc can also be found in submissive energy.

No to deny masculine or make it seem less than but there is something divine and sacred about Goddess energy. It encompasses a natural projection of so many things- bitch, lover, mother, whore....dark and light. The women that adopt this, nurture and cultivate are alpha and solicit control. Its part of their fiber. Calling me a dominant woman barely scratches my surface. I am so much more.

Should you (anyone) ever encounter one that could seduce that goddess essence in you it just might chance your life.

I don't have anything "male" in my energy, masculine yes but not male so therefore my Woman led, Femme Led, Domina led relationships are simply that. Woman in charge of it all... My masculinity may be there because it's part of who I am yet it certainly is not the Commander of any of my vessels (heh).

I just am.....

Originally Posted by apretty http://www.butchfemmeplanet.com/foru...s/viewpost.gif

Come on now--Aren't they all femme-led?
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I would like to think we are a Matriarch run world, unfortunately it's not <sad face insert> what I do see is the thought that girl has <insert pronoun> wrapped around her.his.hys.zi's finger. Which to me is different than actually having reigns of the goings on of the relationship.

We can think we own a panther, the reality is that panther can at anytime turn and make us lunch.

I'm not wrapped around no one's finger, if anything I am the one who pulls the strings for every movement...

love this. Exactly how I feel and the reality I wish to create.

I'm finding this thread interesting reading and will post more fully when I've gotten my words in order...but...for now, what June said struck me.

There is nothing whatsoever masculine or male about me. When it comes to the bedroom, there is nothing of a Top about me either.

However, I embrace what I call my "pushy broad".

I am all femme, all female, and all feminine....and I am strong, stubborn, willful, and in charge. I am a planner and a problem solver, as well as creative and intelligent. For a long time, I thought I had to hide those things...and I did. At almost 50 and with a long history of deferring to others who generally fucked it up and I ended up fixing it....I don't anymore.

There's a reason I'm a project manager professionally. I'm damn good at it. I organize people, keep them on track, keep them moving, prod them in the ass when they need it (nicely of course :) ), hold them back when they need that, squelch the ones that need to shut up, encourage the ones that need to speak, and hold their feet to the fire for those that need that, too.

So....think me arrogant if you like...but yes, I generally do have the answer or the vision of what we need to do and how we should get there.

Do I think I'm better or more enlightened than others? No. I am fully aware that other people have skills, knowledge and talents that I don't. And I'm happy to listen, absorb and applaud those things. Professionally, I depend on people having knowledge or skills that I don't....I need them, and I use them, to get the job done.

Personally, it's not that different. I actively encourage the people around me to do their best, develop their gifts, express what they want so we can experience or accomplish that. What I won't do is be a passive partner, sit on my hands, shut my mouth and go along.

For a long time, I felt that the problem I had in relationships is that I needed to find someone stronger than me to be the lead. Now? Not so much.

I'll come back later, after coffee, when I'm more awake. :)

Sometimes I like Grant to be my minion at my every beck and call, that's how it rolls when I'm in the mood, that's the beauty of these power exchange relationships for *me*. I can do, say, act like I want because I have consent and it gets us all off or we just plain like it.

I love this. And, it really resonates with me in terms of my own style of dominance. I really shy away from the "power over" model. My dominance is about care-taking as well as getting the responses that I want from a sub. The care taking is part of what gets me off. That is not to say that I can't at times be a strict disciplinarian, lol. But caring is a significant part of it. Thanks for sharing this! :D

This really isn't a thread about male led relationships drew may I ask why you had to clarify your style of dominance here?

I'd hate to see this thread turn into yet another thread about how butches and transguys lead- can we please respect the topic here which is:

Thank you!!!!! :hk2:

While I would like to think this statement true, the expectation seems to be that the Femme defer in a 50's housewife way to the Butch or Transguy...which can cause relationship friction for someone like me, who likes to run the show for the most part.

It occurs to me that maybe you have been better at finding partners who recognize your power than I have. I have encountered more desire to "break my spirit". It could be the difference in location and age between us?

I find with younger Butches I have had better luck finding Butches not so ready to do the pissing contest thing with me....Not saying older Butches are bad, just that I have not connected with the right one and younger people seem more open minded.

So glad to see this discussion happening again!

Me too Apocalipstic!!! It's a great thread for Femmes Who Lead be' it full time, part time, in D/s not D/s ALL forms to discuss and also it gives the people on the end of The leash (if that's your thing) a place to discuss and share experiences!

You know I love a good leash! :)

Leadership in Our/our house does not always come from a Dominant space. Even if my Ms is sick in bed (probably not feeling to dominant but still a Dominant), i am running this house under Her scheduled direction from Her sick space. i don't have the option to run it my way. That was the deal and i consented to it. i get that She does somethings and i do others because of Our/our individual talents, but She decides all this and directs it. She could very easily assign me to a task that isn't suited for me, something i don't like :), and sit back and watch me suffer. It is up to Her. She has different compartments that run this household and They are all definitely leaders. Lucky me!!!

Hello Sachita and all others reading this thread. My femdom relationship is going well. He is above board in his service to me. He has extensive experience, far beyond anything I could ever imagine, and brings it humbly to me to honor my needs. Being sickly again, his service is needed more in a caretaking role at the moment. I adore him and am grateful for his devotion.

I dont expect anyone to treat me like a Goddess except me. I take that role upon myself. I spoil me and indulge me and meet my own needs, especially if its by finding the right people to be around me. As for foot rubs or having my porch painted, those are negotiable items. I ask for nothing I would not be extremely appreciative of. None of it is ever expected out of foolish whimsical "show me you love me" shit. I dont need to be loved. Seriously. When you love yourself well, like I have discovered to do, you dont need to have anyone prove their love to you. When someone is in my life, they are there because I want them to be there. Very very few people are there for any other reason. And those are mostly non social contacts.

I also see people discussing masculine energy. I use to think I didnt have any. Then I put a cock on. Hah. I am still a femme but something bended around inside me and I got to see how not different I was to the masculined version of humans I am. For a long time after packing for the first time, I would look in the mirrors as I passed them as tho I were seeing myself for the first time. I embrace who I am and dont get caught up in the pronouns of our language. I know I am not the girl I once thought I was...

What June said.

Thanks for understanding Drew:)






Have you any experiences you can share in this dynamic?

Are you a supporter of this dynamic? Do you participate in a Fem Led Relationship now, before, you may want to in the future?

I support the dynamic in that I think femme led relationships are every bit as valid as any other type. I am an egalitarian at heart, although some have misread me to not be so. I have never been in a femme led relationship - that sort just isn't for me, personally. I just really liked what Isadora had to say and it resonated with me.

Thanks for the support, it's appreciated and needed! :)

I understand your point. It's not a question of need for me. Truth is I don't really need anyone and I love myself. It's not proof I require but an expectation or standard I've acquired and it sooooooo enhances the dynamic.

I'm happy for you. You totally deserve it

Can I just say I am really enjoying this thread? Ok, good.
I am enjoying this thread. :glasses: Makes you think. And critical thinking, contrary to popular belief is a good thing.

But doncha just love it when you can make Her feel like a god?

i am in a femme-led poly D/s relationship. i like it that i am the only one in Her life who can help Her feel THAT particular way.

I've been mulling over this post Yellow Band because when I read it, I literally laughed out loud.

I'm a pushy leader....but most of what I do (professionally and in relationships) is actually for the others around me. In an odd way, I serve from the front.

Hard to explain....but....in a relationship I will annoy the hell out of any partner who wants to passively sit and do nothing...who has no goals...who has no vision for their life. I would drive them nuts (and vice versa) because I am all about "who are you? what do you want? where are you going? what do you dream about doing? what will make you happy?"....and then I will kick your ass to get you there.

It isn't for me. It isn't about me. It's about the other....and I have this compelling need to drag, push or pull them (if necessary) to their joy.

Make sense?

My son just turned 14...and he'll tell you that he wants to form his own company, design computer games, possibly get his PhD and teach (and have his interns work for free on his projects)....ahhhh....he's his mother's son. :) He wants to learn Mandarin Chinese (he's already learning Spanish); wants to live overseas at some point; wants to travel all over the world. He's had a lifetime of my influence, and it shows. He has goals. He has ambition. He wants to accomplish big things.

It isn't that we have to always be doing and busy. We don't. We have "pajama days" when we do nothing at all (including getting dressed). I see nothing wrong with enjoying a TV show, or floating in the pool, or playing with the animals.

I just don't want his, or my, or your (if we're in a relationship) life to be only that. I won't settle, and I'm not comfortable letting the people around me settle either.

My daughter Ria says I'm the head of the Octopus and the rest of the pack are the tentacles together we work as one!!! I'm a micormanager so being involved for me works, it may seem I'm to demanding, harsh, not mushy enough but our end results are great and we're all happy and things run smoothly on all fronts!

See... I wouldn't have described submissive energy with those words.... For me submissive feels , still, empty, waiting, open....

Using energy... I am the current, she is the recepticle

I understand what you mean about goddess essence/energy but for me it's different... It's more natural/ animalistic... There is no good or bad, no dark or light... It simply is..

Primal.... Yes, I like it primal till I don't!

WOOF

Many thoughts on my mind lately about femme led relationships. I think I am misunderstood most of the time. Or perhaps I confuse people. I'm a playful woman and sometimes a bit of a flirt. If I want you you'll be the first to know. lol

I posted something in the Listening to Each Other thread about someone telling me they "liked" me but heard "bad" stories about me being a dom. At first I rolled my eyes and laughed just at the sheer absurdity of the statement. This drama rumor crap is just something I will never wrap my head around.

I hate labels. I don't want to be called a dom or anything else. I am woman who is sexually and spiritually mature. I am alpha, I enjoy control but it doesn't always mean the same thing. Why do people automatically think that I want you as a wet rag, groveling at my feet with no opinions of your own? Why can't I just be an intelligent, strong woman who enjoys being treated well?

Each relationship is different as it forms into a dynamic. I don't care who you are, if there's any kind of chemistry you'll find what fits you. This might manifest many different ways and some may be extreme. My relationship with Wanton Boi continues to evolve and is always changing. We are friends but not always lovers but we always love. Its nice to be real enough with someone to say "I'm feeling needy today and need some pampering." hys reply would be "I'd love to be your bitch today." No drama, no games, just two people comforting one another. At the same time I don't close doors because hy needs something different.

Perhaps I could fall in love with another alpha and I have. I just need to be respected for the woman I am and not engage in power struggles because someone is threatened. Let's find how we best fit and enjoy the places we are compatible.

Oh and the primal thing.... I love tapping that but admit it doesn't come around often enough. It's rare to share space with another human who can leave all the outside shit outside and get get down to the essence of sexual energy.

great thread!

If someone were to ask - I'd say I was a switch (both D/s and S/M), however my soul for lack of a better word - is firmly rooted in the submission and masochism part of the equation.

I absolutely love taking care of the wife, pampering her, spoiling her, following her agenda, itinerary, rules, regulations, whims... you name it. And don't get me started on masochism ;)

It's been good reading through this thread though it's also been a sobering wake up call.

Trying to figure out how to word this.

Gillian and I just are how we are in person. I am naturally submissive to her and it's pretty damn hard not to notice it. I get no flack from people in real life and I honestly don't know if they think less of me - but if they do they don't have the stupidity to approach me about it... so good for them! lol

I was in SL for a bit - and it wasn't a problem there either, but that may be because for some odd reason (not intentional by any means) the people we hung around had either a similar mindset, or they didn't give a rats ass about it.

I haven't since I've been here read anything that was derogatory as far as someone being butch and submissive... I have read some "ooook" statements about femmes and cocks though..

But anyway - this thread has both been fun, and a reminder that there are idiots out there and that apparently I've surrounded myself with a great group of people that have allowed me to pretty much forget the idiocity of others in regards to this situation.

Not sure if this is the right place for this, but since I've been more and more active on the Planet I've noticed something and it perplexed me.

All the hating on Femme Cocks, Femme Dominance/Leadership... and I'll take everyone's word for it, Butch bottoms and by association with the Femme cock - Butches who take cock.

I was trying to figure out why this was such a wake up call for me and I think I may have figured it out.

I left the online "GLBTQI" community in favor of the BDSM community.

I remember back in the MSN chat room days - we had to fight like dogs to be able to discuss BDSM in the open room while in gay chat rooms. Then there was the ostracism of the B&Fs, and those who didn't call themselves Lesbian.. those who weren't born female.. and literally anything else under the sun that the lesbian police could think of to bully you about.

And it didn't stop online - the bars I went to were full of the same looking people. No one too butch and no one too femme, and if you were then by golly you were sitting at the bar by yourself and chances are you were getting some serious ass stares.

My response? I went to a BDSM bar/club (and forums online). holy shit was that an eye opener. Every single body type, orientation, hell you think of it and it was there. And no one gave a single fucking damn. As long as you followed the protocol and the rules... who gave a shit.

It didn't matter if you were a butch bottom, if you took cock.. if you took cock up the ass.. hell if you took an arm up the ass.. who the fuck cares!! As long as it was consensual (and safe) for both people.

And I admit it - I got used to being in that atmosphere. I forgot about the hating of people who were different than you.

So yeah.. here I am... being reminded. Wow.

Snow - you may not even know it but I owe you an apology. When I first started reading threads I was just blown away (not in a happy fuzzy way lol) at how assertive and aggressive you seemed to be about Femme Cock... I had no idea the bullshit you put up with. You have my apologies.

Thoughts
 

Tawse,

I too like you found my comfort in the Leather/BDSM world when it came to my gender, who I am, what I am, my sex and kinks. When I hang around my butch,trans,male,women and femme peers amongst this community I don't get shamed or eeewed because I happen to be a Femme Top or because I am proud of my Femme Cock.


Not once have my boys or girl been shamed, dismissed, looked upon as less, criticized, eeewwed because their Ms has a cock.

(BTW there are people here who been incredibly accepting, it's few but they exist and I heart them)

Misogyny, sexism, and machismo are so deeply enrooted in some people that it has leaked into our very own community I find that to be this online community more than the world I live in everyday. I don't know why so many people cling to the binary and heteronormative thinking of what masculine, feminine, cock, femme, butch should be, act like or look like. I don't know why a Femme cock is feared, laughed at, seen as entertainment, riduculed.

Wait, I do know why.. It's continued super imposed heirarchy that continues to be imposed over and over because sex= femme is the receiver only. NO MAS!!!

My aggressiveness and assertiveness is my passion and my fight that I have been doing on these boards for a long time won't end. It's funny how a Femme who is not of a quiet demeanor is viewed this way when protecting or fighthing for her right to also have desires and wants and to be able to freely express them like the butches and ftms on the boards.

We exist, Femme Tops, Bossy girls, Femme's who can rock a cock longer and stronger and sweeter than most, we are here within all the other expressions, desires and kinks that run amok freely without judgement and shame.

Thank you for apologizing and *seeing* that it's not anger, agression that I speak with, it's passion, frustration and WANT that you hear in my voice (words) because damn it my status, my dominance and my cock is just as valid it is not less than just because it's on me a Femme.


PS

I can't even go into how shitty butches, trans guys, boys, bois are treated, it angers me because NOT ONCE is a submissive girl dismissed in the demeanor the boys/bois are. It's just gross homophobic and rude

I'm feeling a bit isolated these days. I spent a few days away from the farm while Wanton Boi looked after things. To be honest I was feeling pretty predatory (word stolen from a recent conversation with a friend) and needed to project my dominance. Wanton couldn't wait for me to get home so hy could go home and escape the work "I am". Hys words were "I need a few days off." Ok thats cool. But in I was still disappointed. It seems that hy is submissive to me when it suits hym and I've allowed this to happen because it's more then what I had before. These deep feelings in me have awoke and nothing else compares. To be honest I'm a little sad under all that hotness.

Many many moons ago although I did feel comfort in the BDSM community female domination was still frowned upon. My style was spiritual, nurturing and more of an emotional dynamic then physical BDSM play. I had this very strict protocol and it truly was "My way or the highway". I didn't have safewords and my relationships 24/7. Even BDSM'ers found my style a bit unrealistic and concluded that I was full of myself. I enjoy female supremacy as part of my sexual/spiritual scene. I don't really feel that I am superior to everyone else. I just enjoy that whole dynamic with someone. There were few circles I really felt comfortable even within BDSM.

Anyhow I need to sort some things out and was hoping I could share some things here and of course get some feedback. My life, for all intent and purposes, is great! I struggled with a lot of conflict, had a few butch-femme relationships and feel, for the most part, that I know what I want. Still looming is some conflict and fear wondering if what I want truly does exist.

I miss my old life. Especially now with the little dabblings from Wanton Boi. Many parts of me are the same, however I have evolved into a truly multifaceted woman. One who is truly with me needs to be flexible and secure. This is something Wanton is not. I'd like to find something in the middle, if that makes sense. Someone who feels comfortable with me leading and not threatened by it. I love butch boi's but I don't think I can do the stone thing. At the same time I don't always feel the need to wear cock and fuck someone, I prefer being fucked, but if that mood strikes (and it does!) I want them to be receptive.

One of Wanton's biggest complaints about me is that I am often aloof and hard to read. I often am focused on work and I might completely ignore you without thinking about it. I've heard this from others that have served me or been in relationships with. I enjoy my space a lone but I really enjoy someone in the background attending to me. Someone that truly is at my beck and call and enjoys it. Is this selfish?

There are times when I feel a poly relationship, myself and several bottoms, would work best for me. The only problem with this is that I need to "feel" primary and be totally in charge. It doesnt work for me any other way. I don't have jealousy and insecurity like some. It's more of a possession and ownership. Does this make sense?

Finally, I want to explore more of these types of relationships even if they are on a limited basis. Living in the country makes dating so hard as it is. I truly am a subculture within a subculture. Where do you feel is the best place to explore and find others of like mind? Is it me or is it hard finding femme lead folks in the queer community? I would also enjoy a more private venue. I dislike that anyone can come here and read the forums without being registered. Its not that I have anything to hide but prefer my private stuff private.

why not just get a part time service boi or girl without an expectation since you can't commit 100%? Perhaps there is a boy or girl out there that is willing to be around when the mood strikes you and can make themselves available with little maintenance and with the same aloofness you have. It is possible to have this, a boi or girl without a lot of hands on time or grooming time put into them, it can be negotiated as such. Fet life is a good place to look if you are unwilling to do your local BDSM scene. I would have some references ready in case something comes of your search.

I read your thoughts on how the boi you are doing stuff with left after taking care of your place while you vacationed and you were unable to project your dominance on them, I would have to guess it's because maybe hy.he was tired and figured his duties were done and he too needed something which may have been rest.

Have you tried negotiating with present person in your life??