Living in the land of Dixie and proud of it!
 

the only term I get offended by is: dumb redneck

ahem I am a redneck but I am far from dumb

It upsets me that people say how Florida is no longer a part of the South because of the Hispanic population.

Symbol of racism. I am a 4th generation Floridian. It is a racist flag!! The south has the reputation it does for a reason!!

......laughin...........but ya got to admit there are indeed some rednecks that are not the sharpest pencil in the pile.....and some of them are my relatives.....

Yeah Toughy, I agree with ya, but let me tell ya: There are rednecks all over. It is in no way exclusive to the South. *grin*

The confederate flag is definitely a racist symbol, but there is plenty of legit pride to be found within the region that doesn't require that symbol.

I'm definitely proud of where I come from. And there's a lot more intelligence among us than we get credit for. It's just like Jeff Foxworthy jokes, however: It's the least intelligent among us who end up on TV describing how the tornado sounded as it came through. *grin*

Just my 2 cents.

I just moved from the 'Land of Dixie' after being born and raised there... to Germany the other day. I thought it would be a big culture shock...but upon leaving the Frankfurt airport, I noticed the countryside looks just like all the Southern states, NC, SC, Georgia, even the Florida woods in places.

I made a web page yesterday to show my family how similar the deep South is to Germany so that they wouldn't worry about me:

http://my-stuff-dot-com.com/Heidenhe...heim2index.htm

Wow what an adventure!! Love the pics and yes very similar!! Pizza place looks cool too!!

Hey Kam,

Very nice pictures and thank you for sharing them. I have a friend in Ireland and it is very gorgeous there.

Have a good Christmas,

Zimmy

yeah but classing me with the rest of them doesn't sit well with me, as far as the flag I own one and display it in my bedroom, I do not see it as a racist symbol but a source of pride.

The confederate flag or the "rebel flag" "the navy jack"

The Confederate Navy Jack, also called "The Southern Cross," is a rectangular precursor of the Battle Flag, usually about 5×3 feet. The blue color in the saltire (the diagonal cross) is much lighter than in the Battle Flag, and it was flown only on Confederate ships from 1863 to 1865.

The design was originally made by South Carolina Congressman William Porcher Miles with the intent to be the first national flag, but it was rejected by the Confederate government for looking too much like crossed suspenders. It was used by a few army units, including the Army of Tennessee as their battle flag from 1864-1865. (After General Joseph Johnston took command of the Army of Tennessee from Braxton Bragg, he ordered its army-wide implementation to improve morale and avoid confusion.) Today, it is the most universally recognized symbol of the South, where it is commonly called the rebel or Dixie flag. This flag is often erroneously called "the Confederate Flag". (This Flag is often incorrectly referred to as the Stars and Bars; the actual Stars and Bars is the First National Flag.)


The Confederate Navy Jack, 1861-1863Sometimes, the saltire is described as a "Saint Andrew's Cross." But it is unclear if this was the original intent, since Miles' proposals never mentioned this. "St. Andrew's cross" refers either to the national Flag of Scotland (a white saltire over a blue field), or the naval jack of Russia (a blue saltire on a white field). St. Andrew is said to have been martyred on a diagonal cross and is a patron saint of both Russia and Scotland. A legend dating from medieval times held that Saint Andrew's remains and relics washed up on Scottish shores, after a ship intended to convey them for safe keeping in a remote monastery was lost at sea. Most of the white Southern elite at the time of the War traced their ancestry to Britain, and Southern elites tended to identify their heritage as Anglo-Saxon, although much of the white population were in fact either Scots or Scots-Irish during the 19th century.


What is usually called "The Confederate Flag" or "The Confederate Battle Flag" (actually the Navy Jack as explained above) is still a widely-recognized symbol. The display of the flag is a controversial and very emotional issue, generally because of disagreement over exactly what it symbolizes. To many in the US South it is simply a symbol of their heritage and pride in their ancestors who held out during years of war under terrible odds and sacrifice. Others see it as a symbol of the institution of slavery, or of the Jim Crow laws established by the many Southern states enforcing racial segregation within their borders for almost a century later. As a result, there have been numerous political fights over the use of the Confederate battle flag in Southern state flags, at sporting events at Southern universities, and on public buildings. According to Civil War historian and southerner Shelby Foote, the flag traditionally represented the south's resistance to northern political dominance generally; it became racially charged during the Civil Rights Movement, when protecting segregation suddenly became the focal point of that resistance.

Over time the flag has acquired a wide range of meanings, some apparently contradicting one another. Since the CSA was fighting for independence during the Civil War, much as the United States did during the Revolutionary War, the Confederate Flag has always had connotations of rebellion, patriotism, self-determination, dissent, freedom, and liberty. Since the issues of slavery and, later, segregation, are deeply intertwined with the CSA and the Civil Rights Movement, the Confederate Flag has connotations of racism and slavery. Part of the enduring power and controversy of the flag stems from its symbolization of both liberty and slavery, both freedom and segregation. The United States flag, the "Stars and Stripes", can be seen to stand for similar contradictory symbols as well. Racism has been as much a feature of the North as of the South. The Antebellum slave system depended on financial investment from the North. The Confederate Flag can symbolize treason, yet the American Flag is seen by some to symbolize empire and conquest. But because the Stars and Stripes is the national flag today, it remains relatively free of the kind of controversy that surrounds the Confederate Flag. As John M. Coski put it in his book "The Confederate Battle Flag", the Confederate Flag remains a powerful symbol and is unlikely to go away.

On April 12, 2000, the South Carolina state senate passed a bill to remove the flag of the former Confederate States of America from on top of the statehouse dome by a majority vote of 36 to 7. Placed there in 1962, according to one local news report, "the new bill specified that a more traditional version of the battle flag would be flown in front of the Capitol next to a monument honoring fallen Confederate soldiers." The bill then went to the House, where it encountered some difficulty. But on May 18, 2000, after the bill was modified to ensure that the height of the flag's new pole would be 30 feet, it was passed by a majority of 66 to 43, and Governor Jim Hodges signed the bill five days later. On July 1, the flag was removed from the South Carolina statehouse. Current state law prohibits the flag's removal from the statehouse grounds without additional legislation. Police were placed to guard this flag after several attempts by individuals to remove it. Some regard the flag as easier to see in that location than when it was atop the State House Dome.

More recent studies, however, show changing attitudes toward the Confederate battle flag, particularly among blacks - perhaps due to media reports of the issue stemming from legislative battles regarding the flag's official use in Georgia, Mississippi, and South Carolina. In 2005, two Western Carolina University researchers found that 74% of U.S. African-Americans polled favored removal of the flag from the South Carolina Capitol building. Cooper & Knotts, 2005 As battle lines over the use of the flag have (again) hardened, the NAACP and many civil rights groups have attacked the flag. Other groups such as the Sons of Confederate Veterans have actively protested the use of any Confederate flags by the Ku Klux Klan and other hate groups, stating that the hate groups are blemishing the memory of the ancestors of the SCV.[1] Some members of the SCV have even faced down Klansmen at their rallies and marches, to protest the inappropriate usage of these flags.[1] The NAACP maintains an official boycott of South Carolina, citing its continued use of the battle flag on its Statehouse grounds.


there is a tad bit of education about it, cited from yahoo answers

This is great NSAG but can you find where the info on yahoo answers came from. I am just wondering the source...yahoo answers can't be source....just place you pulled it from.

The confederate flag is a symbol of pain for a very large and relavent group of people. The "pride" associated with it has been the cause of many deaths of innocent people over our country's history. Some symbols and the history behind them are not meant to be worshipped. IMO Only!!

The Confederate battle flag, called the "Southern Cross" or the cross of St. Andrew, has been described variously as a proud emblem of Southern heritage and as a shameful reminder of slavery and segregation. In the past, several Southern states flew the Confederate battle flag along with the U.S. and state flags over their statehouses. Others incorporated the controversial symbol into the design of their state flags. The Confederate battle flag has also been appropriated by the Ku Klux Klan and other racist hate groups. According to the Southern Poverty Law Center, more than 500 extremist groups use the Southern Cross as one of their symbols.

I personally wouldnt want to be associated with it. I am 100% Southern guy born and raised...There is soooooo much more history in this great region to be proud of. People are not forced to use the flag as a symbol of pride they choose to. In doing so it just makes progressing the attitude towards the south that much harder.

http://www.infoplease.com/spot/confederate1.html

No sources were sited for her entry. Sorry, people pull snips from anywhere and don't cite them.

http://answers.yahoo.com/question/in...0204138AAYMKLx

I notice alot of people look at the negative parts instead of the exact history and the positive parts of it but hey that's their thing, not mine.

Positive is a relative experince. There is a large majority of people that know there is no positive to it. It is an oppressive symbol.

I am sorry you feel it's an oppressive symbol

I see it as pride as to the south fighting against the north during the civil war but hey that's just me and a few of my other comrades out there who fly the rebel flag along side the american flag.

I am sorry you don't

You and your friends may want to understand a little more as to why the south was fighting so hard against the north. Slavery!!

We are aware of that, we have read both sides of the issue. We are not DUMB REDNECKS like some think.

Well if you read the history then you understand the hater stance the south took in order to defend oppression and slavery with that flag as the symbol. You and your friends are either making a conscience decision to defend that or you don't really understand it. Please know I am trying to understand the intent behind defending such a notoriously offensive symbol. What did you and your friends read that brought you to the decision. I know it can't be from that yahoo answers thing you posted.

We understand the hater stance and we understand the stance behind why some folks stand behind the flag.

We have our reasons for why we do stuff, we defend it because our ancestors fought in the civil war and all that it stands for even the negative aspects. Most of us come from a long line of slave owners, some of us are members of certain organizations that y'all find nasty, etc. But this is MY life and MY friends, we will defend what we feel is right, just as you have the right to fight against it.

Noone will ever agree to things and that is fine with me I have no quams, but I will stand behind the rebel flag till I die.

I enjoy alot of the things you say but I am not surprised at your view. Goodluck with that to you and your friends.

Yup no problem.

Just some additional food for thought since we have stumbled onto symbols and how some may find them offensive...

Under the flag of the United States of America do we continue to oppress homosexuals. Any slaughter and removal of Native Americans from their homes after the Flag Resolution of 1777 would have been under the flag of the United States of America.

It has been pointed out that not all history and symbols of our country should be celebrated, yet I am certain that we all have participated in the Pledge of Allegiance, Southerners, Northerners, Midwesterners, West Coasters alike...

Now, please don't assume that I embrace the Confederate Flag and how it has become a symbol of all things ignorant alive and well in the South. I am, however, a proud Southerner. Proud of my family heritage and proud to pass that history, both good and bad, onto future generations.

Being a Southerner encompasses a good deal more than the stigmas of slavery, oppression, conservative Bible-Belt wearing, uneducated, backwardsassness... as someone else mentioned, its usually the two tooth wonder who makes the news and embodies the whole, "Hey Bubba, watch this!"

After all, we have BB King (born on a plantation in Mississippi), Elvis, The Grand Ole Opry, the Parthenon (located in Nashville), Ellen Degeneres, Oprah and Paula Deen... I mean really, what more could you want but some amazing music while you eat something saturated with butter and garnished with bacon waiting for either Ellen or Oprah to come on??

To be honest I do view it as both, it is a part of history - however, knowing what it does symbolize I would never display it.

Weatherboi,

Could you explain what you mean by the sentence in red?

I guess I shouldn't be terribly surprised, but I had actually hoped that this thread would be a place where southerners who are proud can hang. It is interesting though, and I think part of the problem, that just mentioning the South brings up the Confederate flag and rednecks. This is what I am speaking to in terms of stereotypes that really bug me. There are aspects of our history that I am not proud of - of course there are aspects of the entire country's history that I'm not proud of, but since we're talking about the South I won't go there.

As Write14u stated, there are so many things about the South that I am proud of, that I prefer. Our cooking, the beauty of the area, the hospitality, the slower tempo of conversation - SWEET TEA!!!!! So much more than a flag and rednecks.

Let me add that I am not defending slavery in any way, form, or fashion. It is a terrible part of our history, but I wonder why it still defines us today? I can't remember the last time I saw a confederate flag displayed.

So, anyone else proud of who we are???

:goodpost:

Thank you Christie for so eloquently elaborating on what I sorta brushed across - you did it justice. And you rock!

Just 'cause I needed to see if I could actually post a youtube:

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2AZLUohDCGo"]YouTube- Jason Aldean - She's Country[/ame]

Hey there Wicket!!

The south has the reputation it does because it is still deeply influenced by generations of a region of people that were brought up to think it is ok to oppress. I see it influence in my nieces. I hear the "n" word used by ingnorant southern guys and gals constantly that surround my everyday life through work. Like it is no big deal. The south has always been the slowest part of the country to progress since the beginning of this country. It is in our history. This is what I meant by that statement. Hope this helps!!


Ohhh BTW I am proud of my southern heritage. I just dont feel a need to address it. I do feel a need to address the flag and people who feel a need to defend it. I think it makes the south look bad and goes against the progression of the region.

an outsider's observation
 

I have lived my entire life in Connecticut and am a proud New Englander. But I have to say that I have loved the people I've met in the South. When we were young we used to pile into the station wagon and head south to visit our grandma in Florida. Even as kids we noticed that people are much more open and friendly in the southern states. The food is better too!

We have plenty of people up here who would be called rednecks if they lived elsewhere. There are a lot of politically correct types here and I find that most people don't say how they really feel about things. I don't think that's good. It might look nice on the surface but there's still plenty of racism and intolerance here too, it's just that most of it is hidden.

My point? I've always liked Southerners and think that they have the right idea about a lot of things in life, so keep doing your thing, Dixieland!

Plus they don't have two feet of snow in their yards right now (I hope) :)

Wow -
 

I believe we have a deep heartfelt connection from where we are from, regionally. Most of us!

The "SOUTH" is beautiful is so many ways. To deny the racist history behind it and ongoing hateful sentiments are a problem though, IMHO. (Think Katrina and the government's lack of response - again, just MY OPINION here.)

I love the southern accents, the wonderful food, mixed cultures, actually a great deal of the history and if I was from there I would want to be proud of my heritage - just as I am from being raised here in the north.
__

When I moved (years back) to Houston from PA, I was stuck in a traffic jam with my partner then... and across the radio came this DJ saying "All of the GOD DAMN YANKEES here are screwing things up and we should do something about it"! I still had PA plates on. We had moved there during the job crunch back here in the north, and it was BOOMING there in that area at that time - for expansion.

Although, the "illegal" immigrants were being hired the most for construction and the new influx/building of the city jobs - as they could be hired for under minimum wage - and off the books. And "no insurance" coverage...

Anyway, my lover and I slowly looked the the left and then to the right in our car - to see if "maybe" anyone happened to be on the same radio station and see our plates. Let me tell you, I will never forget that. (Now please this isn't about "Texas", only one experience of southern FEAR and bigotry.) My one friend was beat up too, being pulled over by the police - as she had queer women's bumper stickers on her truck.

And I was politically active then, when I went there - meeting up with folks who had moved there from New York. We demonstrated against the KKK affiliated police who had gone into a housing project and beat up Eleanore Bumpers - just a sweet elderly woman, minding her own, but was used as a message by the KKK! (I think I have the name right here, this was back in the very early '80's.)

And then HERE... in my area. There are a "couple" of young guys (primarily young - maybe a few older guys) who have a confederate flag in the back of their big trucks - who really don't understand what it means. (They think it is about guns and the wild west and stuff like that.) However, they also happen to be racist in attitude, against queers, Jews, etc... anyone, but white straight males.

Also, folks are called "redneck" here too. It is not just a southern expression. I don't think that is fair that that expression is derived from the south and their "history".

Now, having said THAT... folks around here are clearly uncomfortable with that flag otherwise. But, I am uncomfortable with the American flag - for I do feel the Native Indians were here first. So, yes... when I go to the post office for stamps - I say, "anything but the flag". That is not that I don't love this country, that I don't support the folks fighting for us in other counties (in the military), etc... That is JUST "my expression" through a simple choice.

But, if you are from the south, I believe you should be proud. I don't believe you should feel shame and guilt for what happened before us. I don't with the Native Indians and African Americans here (I did when I was younger and first learned about this all, that our history books were NOT quite "accurate" about) - but, I DO feel terrible that white folks DID these atrocities to other living human beings and I feel a certain responsibility and obligation, even IF only to stand up against such symbols used in the most inappropriate ways. (Meaning fear inducing and such - to "keep folks in their place", such as the misuse of that flag.) Pride? IF you are standing behind a horrible part of history with your beliefs? That is not the good side of the south to be proud of, IMHO.

This is kind of rambly... I want to state that I wouldn't come into this thread and post, "me and by friends are in groups that you all wouldn't be too happy about". How do you think that makes ANY person, NOT into "what you are possibly inferring" here, (that you would state that you canNOT even write about it) feel regarding "safety" in being part of this community then?

If one is talking KKK or Neo-Nazi/skinheads... remember they HATE all of us, queers included.

Really. Just think about it. Please. Thank you.

WILDCAT

I don't think any evolved Southerner disputes that racism is alive and well - and as others have pointed out, its not indigenous to the South. Perhaps the issue is that Southern folks tend to speak their minds and wear their "isms" as a badge of honor.

My family, while not officially affiliated with any of the groups who think that 400tc sheets are better costumes than bed linens, is racist. Its not just against African Americans, but against anyone who isn't Caucasian, Baptist, Heterosexual, and Conservative. Imagine their dismay when I use the outspokenness taught at their knee and my very existence forces them to be silent about the "queers, fags, dykes (insert any other derogatory term here)."

My brotherinlaw (Jess's brother) proudly displays his confederate flag and it IS his symbol of racism and oppression. I thought that for Christmas we might give him a rainbow flag to run up along side of it... LOL

I don't think that the use of "illegal" aliens in the workforce is a Southern issue. I am sure the practice is a national issue...

Back to the all good things Southern... food... now there is something to celebrate! Nothing better than a slab of Memphis-style dry ribs washed down with the "house wine of the south"... iced tea so sweet its like instant diabetes! Kentucky bourbon... don't even get me started on my ongoing affair with Jim Beam backed by Sundrop soda :toast: (If you aren't familiar with Sundrop, lemme know and I will be glad to educate you!)

Southern women... my oh my... who else but Dixie Carter as Julia Sugarbaker could tell you that you are the most ignorant fucktard on the face of the planet in that melodic southern drawl while dressed in a lovely powersuit and make you LIKE it??!?!?!? :thud: Anyone who knows me in real life, knows that I have that drawl and it seems to disguise the sharp tongue and makes the everpresent sarcasm more palatable... I like to think of it as camouflage.

I'm sure that there are many things that are associated Southern that we should not be proud of... but like with everything else, I don't get to pick only the parts that I like... being Southern, to me, means that I take the good and the bad and try to live my truth. Southern is just another descriptor to me... and one I wear proudly.

Christie

You know, it is very funny to me. I live and have lived in Georgia for nearly 25 years, have been a very out gay person, and have never once had anyone give me any problems about it. Matter of fact, the only time I have ever been given a problem was up in Ohio. Most of my friends are straight, biker types. I don't know if that is the difference or not.

My sister lives in San Fran, and everytime I go out there, her friends do anything they can to get me to talk. Guess they like the accent or something. I find the people around here have a great sense of humor about the perception others have of Southerners. I am looking for a t-shirt to send my sister. I live not too far from where the movie Deliverance was filmed. There is a t-shirt that says "Paddle faster, I hear banjo music!" I really need to find that one to send her. rofl

No, I wasn't intending to imply that hiring illegal immigrants was a "southern" thing. Not at all.

I was simply stating why I went to Texas then, and had difficulty finding work. I believe the immigrants were used in the worst kind of way at that time - there. Then. My experience.

This same practice is going on in the north too, right now...

(Texas is a major Mexican boarder state of course. It was "win/win" for the condo and complex contruction corporations/businesses during that time.)

Yep, there are bigots everywhere. Ohio included. PA for sure. And on and on... it sadly goes. Regarding the flag and southern pride (?) Please, continue on.

And I'll bow out here...


PEACE

Personally, I could care less if someone wants to fly that darned rag (er, flag), to me it just gives everyone a warning that a dumbass lives here. All they get from me is an eyeroll.

As far as living in the south? I live here cause I love it. Some on the best areas in the country to ride motorcycles. It fits me right down to the ground. Low speed, high drag. :motorbike:

Your reasons would be what exactly?
Even the negative aspects to me means you are all about white power.

You say slave owners with such an ease it feels to me like your proud of that.

What are you defending that feels sooo right?
The right to fly your flag in your bedroom?
To feel proud of your white roots?

Why not hang it in the back window of your pickup or front window of your apt. if
your so proud of your stance?
Have you lost any friends or dates after they saw your symbol of hate?

Would you really die for what your flag represents to a
black person?

I’ve been watching this thread with a lot of interest, and there’s been a lot of ‘thangs to chew on’ :-)

I want to get this out of the way: As for the ‘rebel flag,’ it does make me uneasy to see it actively embraced when it is used to represent hatred and human exploitation. Recently, when I was traveling across the South, I saw a huge Confederate flag at a local business; I honestly did not feel safe in stopping there alone (and with a rainbow-oriented tattoo on my wrist). That’s just how I feel.

Born in Alabama, and transplanted to Florida, I’ve lived in the 'deep' South most of my life. And, I’ve finally gotten to the place where I do embrace being a Southerner—for the reasons that several posters (Christie, Wicket, Write) have mentioned. I love (and try to embody) some of the good stuff: the hospitality, the accent (when it suits my purposes--it's a-m-az-ing what a southern drawl can getcha sometimes), opening doors for others, the home-cookin’, and even the silly lil way we banter together [an example is you-tubed below].

I feel at home in the South and I would prefer to live here; I simply adore the charms of Southern ladies and butches (nodoubtaboutit). That being said, I know there is hatred and blatant ignorance still thriving here; but, this is not regulated to one region or type of person.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zno0xeap0hU"]YouTube- Steel Magnolias "He is a boil on the butt of humanity!"[/ame]

Yes I would

I am confederate states of america member, its a small group of my friends who get together to discuss things and beliefs. It does no harm to anyone because we do not take it outside of our own homes.

*Disclaimer there maybe use of era related terminology in the attached links if this offends you my apologies. However, if you pick up any history book about the American Civil War you will read the “politically incorrect” rhetoric of the day. *

*I do not typically post in controversial threads because my words I feel are better spoken on topics I may or may not agree with. But it has come to my attention through my friends here on this site that my words are needed in something that is not all “fun and fluff.” *

Oh wow, where do I start (this thread is a bummer and has unnecessary dramatics)... though I do have to say as a historian I am really appalled by the so called teachings of American students, being the product of the public school systems hell even I am not happy with all of my education but that is neither here nor there. I wish personally that people would first think about what they are saying and how they say it instead of just speaking out of pure hatred and anger towards another human being regardless of their beliefs. Just because someone does not agree with you doesn’t mean that pressing your opinion of the matter on them will get them to change their minds. It is hard to change 200+ years of personal and familial history with one post.

The battle flag of northern Virginia vs the confederate flag:

http://www.civilwarhome.com/battleflag.htm
http://www.civilwarhome.com/confederateflags.htm
http://xroads.virginia.edu/~CLASS/AM...att/intro.html

since this is a web thread I will all assume if you want to learn you will read and learn if not that’s cool too I am just trying to clarify this is a learning experience for all of us.

It is easy to use any kind of symbol to define your belief system. The cross is something some Christians use to define their belief. The pentagram is a symbol of belief for some pagans. The American flag is something to define the beliefs of a nation. The rainbow pride flag is the belief that no matter with color, creed, nationality or sexual desire your belief in it gives you hope. The swastika was something the Nazis used to define their belief. A Starbucks cup is defined as the belief that coffee will make your day right. An African American fist in the air is defined as a Black Panther movement. Two fingers in the air making a “V,” defines the belief in peace.

Symbols became that way for a reason. Someone somewhere believed in them. So take your own beliefs and learn from others. It doesn’t matter what color or creed you come from just know that WE are a community here and need to embrace others opinions. We do not have to enjoy them or even like them but we should open our minds to them…

Besides I thought this was a thread about being a proud southerner… and where and how I am going to have my first real southern cooked food (sure stereo typical but the south to me means AMAZING FOOD, warm hospitality and a slowed down pace of living.) I still have not had homemade grits, collard greens with bacon, fried chicken with biscuts and gravy with a side of mac and cheese.

Smiles :frog:

*just my dollars worth hate me if you want*

peace