[Chazz]

Originally Posted by Kobi

IMO, it is just another concerted masculine effort to negate women and lesbians from the Butch agenda. It's a pet peeve of mine.

So these days, I identify simply as a lesbian just to take back the power of my womanness - something of which I am very proud. I fought too long and too hard to let a "masculine of any part" think they can tell me who I am or who I have to be.

I don't even understand what "masculine of center people" is supposed to mean. Who are the center people?

I am glad the ousted members will continue to build a womans butch community under the name Butch Nation. I like it. And thanks for the link. I have been looking for something like this.

My entire butch life, I've battled against the Freudian proposition that a butch is a "misbegotten man".

Outside of gender preoccupied enclaves, the overwhelming majority of the straight world still believes that butches are wanna-be-men. In my RT lesbian community, this is most definitely not the case. We eschew terminology/neologisms that reinforce dominant culture stereotypes that have RT consequences for us as butch women.

If you take the female out of female masculinity, what does that leave us with? How does that serve those of us who have fought a lifetime for respect as butch women?

Labeling butches "masculine of center people" (MOC people), wrings womanhood out of the term butch. Sexual orientation is no longer a defining feature of butch - it's been replaced by masculine gender identity.

I'm glad this schism within BUTCH VOICES has happened. It's shone a light on a dimly lit area that needed full exposure to the light of day. This need not be divisive. What's to argue really?

Why does everyone have to be stuffed, some screaming and kicking, under the same big tent?

I'm content with my lesbian butch, feminist tent. I'm content with others having their gender theory tent. Hell, I'm even content with a Christian lesbian tent for people who sometimes vote Republican. I just don't want to have to room with them. I'll meet everyone around the camp fire, if I'm of a mind to do so.

We are not all the same. We don't all identify the same. We don't all think or believe the same.

THIS IS A VERY GOOD THING ! ! ! !

Let's celebrate diversity - we use to do that and it was great fun.