What does the "B-F Dynamic" mean to you?

[Strappie]

I'm trying to write something and I'm not a writer as most of you all know. *smirk* So I thought what better place is there?

Also a friend of mine wanted me to explain to her what the Dynamic meant to me. I couldn't really put it into any good words. I told her how I felt but I didn't think I gave it a good representation.

What does it mean to you?

[imperfect_cupcake]

what does the bf dynamic mean to me? kind of a wierd question to answer as it's kinda like me answering what being a lesbian means to me.

personally I don't see it as anything but a sexuality. There isn't any roles in my relationships so I can't speak about that. My partner does what she enjoys and is good at, I do the same, just like any other relationship. She doesn't hold doors for me or take off her hat or anything along those lines. She spoils me in the way I find important, but I would expect every good relationship no matter what the people are in to do that.

I wouldn't be able to answer that because I'm not really very traditional in many ways in our relationship. so, the dynamic is not, for me, who opens doors, who pays the bill, who gets me a beer, who carries the bags - she's not my dogsbody. she does these things on many occations (save the door opening) but no more than I see other lesbian couples doing these things for each other who aren't butch-femme.

so, to me, it's purely about sex.

[UofMfan]

Originally Posted by Strappie

I'm trying to write something and I'm not a writer as most of you all know. *smirk* So I thought what better place is there?

I am curious, does this mean that whatever we write here you will be using for whatever it is you are trying to write? I am not sure if this is what you mean so I am asking for clarification.

FYI, to diminish this dynamic to who opens doors makes my heart ache.

[imperfect_cupcake]

Originally Posted by UofMfan

I am curious, does this mean that whatever we write here you will be using for whatever it is you are trying to write? I am not sure if this is what you mean so I am asking for clarification.

FYI, to diminish this dynamic to who opens doors makes my heart ache.

who did that? ??

[Strappie]

Originally Posted by UofMfan

I am curious, does this mean that whatever we write here you will be using for whatever it is you are trying to write? I am not sure if this is what you mean so I am asking for clarification.

FYI, to diminish this dynamic to who opens doors makes my heart ache.

Not at all UofMfan... I mostly just want to know how you all explain the dynamic.

[amiyesiam]

Originally Posted by honeybarbara

what does the bf dynamic mean to me? kind of a wierd question to answer as it's kinda like me answering what being a lesbian means to me.

personally I don't see it as anything but a sexuality. There isn't any roles in my relationships so I can't speak about that. My partner does what she enjoys and is good at, I do the same, just like any other relationship. She doesn't hold doors for me or take off her hat or anything along those lines. She spoils me in the way I find important, but I would expect every good relationship no matter what the people are in to do that.

I wouldn't be able to answer that because I'm not really very traditional in many ways in our relationship. so, the dynamic is not, for me, who opens doors, who pays the bill, who gets me a beer, who carries the bags - she's not my dogsbody. she does these things on many occations (save the door opening) but no more than I see other lesbian couples doing these things for each other who aren't butch-femme.

so, to me, it's purely about sex.

I have to agree with this. I am who I am, femme is a part of that. I try to be the best me I can be, not the best femme I can be. We as a couple, work together based on what we are good at. We don't assign rolls based on who is butch and who is femme.

I get the concept of the B-F dance
but everyone has to figure out what that means to them.

[UofMfan]

Originally Posted by honeybarbara

...I wouldn't be able to answer that because I'm not really very traditional in many ways in our relationship. so, the dynamic is not, for me, who opens doors, who pays the bill, who gets me a beer, who carries the bags - she's not my dogsbody. she does these things on many occations (save the door opening) but no more than I see other lesbian couples doing these things for each other who aren't butch-femme.

so, to me, it's purely about sex.

You see, this is the same as trying to say that I am butch because my hair is short and I wear masculine clothes. The dynamic, as well as my gender identity run much deeper than that. This is of course, my opinion.

[SuperFemme]

Oddly, I thought HB was saying the same thing as you UofM...

Of course I guess it is open to self interpretation. I think the one point we can all agree on is that the B/F dynamic works in our lives in very individualized ways. Snowflakes. No two are alike. It is always snowing on the Planet, no?

[NJFemmie]

Yeah, so I'm confused because I too thought that was what honeybarbara was trying to impart ... that those particular things don't define the dynamic for her - (but then again, who's to say it doesn't for someone else...)

Interpretation is a slippery little sucker.

[amiyesiam]

Originally Posted by UofMfan

You see, this is the same as trying to say that I am butch because my hair is short and I wear masculine clothes. The dynamic, as well as my gender identity run much deeper than that. This is of course, my opinion.

Not how I took her post. The point is to move away from steriotyping folks.
Just cause of how you dress or do your hair has not a lot to do with how you ID. Have you ever stopped to notice how many straight women wear their hair very short? Jeans and tee shirts are worn by all kinds of people.

who opens doors isn't a butch or femme thing.

[imperfect_cupcake]

Originally Posted by amiyesiam

Not how I took her post. The point is to move away from steriotyping folks.
Just cause of how you dress or do your hair has not a lot to do with how you ID. Have you ever stopped to notice how many straight women wear their hair very short? Jeans and tee shirts are worn by all kinds of people.

who opens doors isn't a butch or femme thing.

thanks yes, that's what I ment. I see many people not into butch-femme dynamic opening doors, paying for meals, cleaning the house etc. Things that are often touted as a "butch-femme dynamic" (aka traditional 50's middle america stuff. That's not judgement by the way for those who dig it). That's not it for me *because* my partner and I don't do gender division of things. Butches take out the trash/femmes wash the dishes. That kind of thing. Nor is it "butch manners" because she doesn't have any. She spoils me, but not in any way that I don't see other couples doing for each other in non-butch-femme ID'd couples.

SO I can't say, for me, that butch-femme dynamic is about anything else but sex.

For someone else, that may be absurd. But since I can't point at my partner and say "oh it's cause she treats me with such care and she's such a gentleman..." cause, y'know, butch-femme doesn't have the corner on that. i've met a ton of non ID's and femmes I enjoy being spoiled and treated sweetly by in a... way that I used to think only butches did.

So I can't nail it to anything but the brass knobs, for me.

[HeartBreak Kid]

Originally Posted by Strappie

I'm trying to write something and I'm not a writer as most of you all know. *smirk* So I thought what better place is there?

Also a friend of mine wanted me to explain to her what the Dynamic meant to me. I couldn't really put it into any good words. I told her how I felt but I didn't think I gave it a good representation.

What does it mean to you?

For me, I LOVE the butch femme dynamic....and it is more to me than the apperance or "duties" that femme/butch implies..
The only way I can explain it is to talk about the connection in terms of "energies" my energy is firery and it seeks out a cooling energy. While I have dated Femme women as well, it seems that I find that "coolness" more often in butches.
For me the dynamic is often spiritual in that I feel like I am balanced regardless of who picks up the check or opens the door. *now I DO enjoy having my doors opened and someone to take out the trash, but thats isnt what I am attracted to in the B-F dynamic.
Now every butch and Femme is diffrent, but there is a unique "swagger" that draws me in like a moth to a flame....
A few years ago there was a song that had a verse that kinda sums up how I feel about the butchh femme dynamic....

I'm a movement by myself.
But I'm a force when we're together
I'm good all by myself.
But baby you, you make me better
~You Make Me Better ft Ne-Yo by Fabolous~

Please excuse all spelling and gramatical errors as im typing while half asleep......

[Jess]

Originally Posted by Strappie

I'm trying to write something and I'm not a writer as most of you all know. *smirk* So I thought what better place is there?

Also a friend of mine wanted me to explain to her what the Dynamic meant to me. I couldn't really put it into any good words. I told her how I felt but I didn't think I gave it a good representation.

What does it mean to you?

Howdy Scrappie! You write just fine! I would love to hear what it means to you as well.

For me, I see it as an attraction dynamic between women whom identify as butch attracted to women whom identify as femme. And vice- versa. Pretty much sums up the simple definition for me.

Now.. that said, I agree with honeybarb and others above in that identifying myself as a butch woman, does not attach itself to any specific "role mechanics" nor do I see femme attached to any specific mechanics. Read: Butch doesn't just take out trash. mow yard ( although this butch enjoys those things) and femme does not mean " keep away from power tools" because my femme mate is handy as hell. it doesn't mean "butch= breadwinner/ femme= homemaker".. because it is exactly the opposite in our home.

I don't apply "butch-femme" to gay men as I have yet to meet any whom have identified with those terms. If I do, then I shall.

I don't apply this term to heterosexual couples because ( for me) it seems redundant or silly.

I don't apply this term to FTM's ( whom have transitioned and claim the id of "man" or "male" ) as they are no longer in (in my opinion) "butch", they are man/ male.

For me, this works best. May not be the same for others.

[Strappie]

Originally Posted by Jess

Howdy Scrappie! You write just fine! I would love to hear what it means to you as well.

For me, I see it as an attraction dynamic between women whom identify as butch attracted to women whom identify as femme. And vice- versa. Pretty much sums up the simple definition for me.

Now.. that said, I agree with honeybarb and others above in that identifying myself as a butch woman, does not attach itself to any specific "role mechanics" nor do I see femme attached to any specific mechanics. Read: Butch doesn't just take out trash. mow yard ( although this butch enjoys those things) and femme does not mean " keep away from power tools" because my femme mate is handy as hell. it doesn't mean "butch= breadwinner/ femme= homemaker".. because it is exactly the opposite in our home.

I don't apply "butch-femme" to gay men as I have yet to meet any whom have identified with those terms. If I do, then I shall.

I don't apply this term to heterosexual couples because ( for me) it seems redundant or silly.

I don't apply this term to FTM's ( whom have transitioned and claim the id of "man" or "male" ) as they are no longer in (in my opinion) "butch", they are man/ male.

For me, this works best. May not be the same for others.

Thanks Jess,

I do identify as Butch but I haven't given up my woman card either. I guess I am still a woman that's Butch. Some of my friends just don't understand the B-F Dynamic. I have so many Fem on Fem friends it's hard for them to see this. They ask questions without assaulting me and sometimes I just don't have the answers I feel as though is a good representation.

So I guess I'm just trying to listen and hear others explanations.

I will give you my explanation of it in a few.. Biggest Loser is on... lol

[Gemme]

Originally Posted by HeartBreak Kid

For me, I LOVE the butch femme dynamic....and it is more to me than the apperance or "duties" that femme/butch implies..
The only way I can explain it is to talk about the connection in terms of "energies" my energy is firery and it seeks out a cooling energy. While I have dated Femme women as well, it seems that I find that "coolness" more often in butches.
For me the dynamic is often spiritual in that I feel like I am balanced regardless of who picks up the check or opens the door. *now I DO enjoy having my doors opened and someone to take out the trash, but thats isnt what I am attracted to in the B-F dynamic.
Now every butch and Femme is diffrent, but there is a unique "swagger" that draws me in like a moth to a flame....
A few years ago there was a song that had a verse that kinda sums up how I feel about the butchh femme dynamic....

I'm a movement by myself.
But I'm a force when we're together
I'm good all by myself.
But baby you, you make me better
~You Make Me Better ft Ne-Yo by Fabolous~

Please excuse all spelling and gramatical errors as im typing while half asleep......

Energy is probably the best identifier for this dynamic for me as well. Through the years, terms and phrases and words have floated around to describe the B-F dynamic....yin/yang.....the dance....complementary energies....etc.

I think they are all correct. Each partnering is individual and rarely follows the exact same parameters. I know I have it when I feel it. It's like a strong wind blowing through a valley of trees. Some days I'm the trees. Some days I'm the wind. But there is always that syncopation; that rhythm of movement.

[Strappie]

Originally Posted by Gemme

Energy is probably the best identifier for this dynamic for me as well. Through the years, terms and phrases and words have floated around to describe the B-F dynamic....yin/yang.....the dance....complementary energies....etc.

I think they are all correct. Each partnering is individual and rarely follows the exact same parameters. I know I have it when I feel it. It's like a strong wind blowing through a valley of trees. Some days I'm the trees. Some days I'm the wind. But there is always that syncopation; that rhythm of movement.

Heartbreak Kid and Gemmie,
thank you to me this is what I was looking for. Gemmie I have to agree about some days I'm this and some days I'm that... But there is always that syncopation; that rhythm of movement.Thank you!!

HB...

Hi btw it's been a long time since I've seen you around. It's good to see you!! I don't disagree with your explanation at all either I believe that we are who we are with each person that comes along.

[imperfect_cupcake]

Hi straps!

I think so too.

I'm really thinking about this. of course I can't answer for anyone else... only me and my expereinces.

every relationship, including butch-butch, femme-femme, non-ID-trans, kitchensink-genderqueer, is going to have a type of ying/yang, back-forth, tidal, mixing and moving of "energies."

I still am of the opinion that it's because of what/whom I'm attracted to, not the actual relationship dance, that's the distinction.

answer something for me straps... why do the femme-femme friends of yours "not get" your relationship? what's "not to get?" it's a relationship between people who care about each other.

Are they questioning your attractions? what exactly are they not "getting." I have plenty of non-butch-femme couple friends and it's not that they "don't get it" in that they don't understand my relationships... it's that they "don't give a shit" to most of a degree what my relationships are and that they "don't get" why I want only one kind (to them) partner. they don't care mind you, it's just not within their realm of expereince and they don't care enough to ask me about it - mostly.

when explaining it, it hasn't been me explaining the "butch-femme dynamic" as I don't think it's a universal, so why bother. However, it *has* been me explaining that my primary attraction is for X with a choice of varients in 1 through 600 different possibilites.

To be super honest, the only people I've run into in the past 7 years interested in the whys of butch-femme or even a particular ID has beeen those within the group in question.

Or newly out/very young

what exactly did they say to you that made you feel you wanted to explain your relationship dynamics with your girlfriends to them? (not an attack, just a wonder/sincere curiosity)

Nice to see you!!

[SuperFemme]

I agree with the energy qualifier. Some energies compliment each other and draw out that ying/yang thing that poets keep trying to describe. There are not words that can nail it quite right.

Intellectual intercourse, is first for me. The dance of the b/f dynamic can vary and evolve for me, because it is always a new and different thing. Swagger...somebody mentioned it. I cannot capture the essence of that swgger but I know it when I see it. Cocked eyebrow, eyes that have conversations with my soul without ever uttering a word. Oh. Yum.

I don't care for the stereotypes that some attribute to the b/f dynamic. It is crazy to me to try and bottle up and sell something that cannot be replicated without ownership.

Make me smile. Lavish me in your laughter. Split open your pain and bleed on me. Hold me whilst I bleed on you. Make me feel safe in a way that only you can. Surrender and let me love you....

Because nobody knows how many licks it takes to get to the center. Of anything.

[labete]

Originally Posted by Gemme

Energy is probably the best identifier for this dynamic for me as well. Through the years, terms and phrases and words have floated around to describe the B-F dynamic....yin/yang.....the dance....complementary energies....etc.

I think they are all correct. Each partnering is individual and rarely follows the exact same parameters. I know I have it when I feel it. It's like a strong wind blowing through a valley of trees. Some days I'm the trees. Some days I'm the wind. But there is always that syncopation; that rhythm of movement.

This is largely how I feel about it, too. Complementary energies that, for me, give a kind of balance that works for me and reinforces my energy. I find that I naturally seek a kind of balance, and if the person I'm with is too much like me, my balance can be thrown off.

When I had my first female lover, she was very feminine, and I found myself feeling the yin side of me rise more, which (for me, myself, and I, not remotely speaking for anyone else here) subdued my yang in a way that makes me feel less true to myself. I don't like that feeling.

It's not about who opens the door or takes out the trash or cooks or washes, although such acts can be symbolic of the energy exchange if they are meaningful to the people engaging in them. It's about finding someone whose energies balance mine in a way that supports me being true to myself. For me, that means someone whose yin is more prevalent than their yang, and I find that in butches.