Japanese reactor crisis

[Medusa]

Word, Atlast!
I have been trying to read multiple news sources over the last several days and have been looking at diagrams of nuclear facilities so that I can try to understand what is happening.

It also helps having someone with a scientific background (Thanks AJ!) draw a verbal diagram. Im fairly negative about depending on one news source to tell us everything we need to know and have pretty much accepted that we aren't getting the whole story.

From where I sit, it looks very much like there is a radioactive event of large proportions happening in Japan right now. I hope Im wrong but am fearful that Im not.

[Linus]

http://www.voanews.com/english/news/...117971924.html

[Medusa]

Originally Posted by Linus

http://www.voanews.com/english/news/...117971924.html

This is so frustrating! This article reads as there has been no meltdown and another site http://e.nikkei.com/e/fr/freetop.aspx is talking about how high the radiation shot up after the explosion.

I have been reading BBC news as well but this article from Reuters is fairly enlightening:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/...72D8LM20110314

It says the shell is 4 - 8 inches of steel. That's something I didnt know; I thought it was an inch or two (hoping it's closer to 8 than 4!!)

[Linus]

I think the disparity in news is the effect of the internet. We probably won't know for sure until a day or two later. The reality is that news agencies are tripping over each other for the latest and "accurate" (I question how accurate since I don't think they are actually verifying). At the same time, I don't know even if Japanese officials know since the people who would know are doing what they are supposed to: try and contain this as best as they can.

I wonder if there will be a point where they will say "We cannot do anything more.."

[AtLast]

Originally Posted by Linus

I think the disparity in news is the effect of the internet. We probably won't know for sure until a day or two later. The reality is that news agencies are tripping over each other for the latest and "accurate" (I question how accurate since I don't think they are actually verifying). At the same time, I don't know even if Japanese officials know since the people who would know are doing what they are supposed to: try and contain this as best as they can.

I wonder if there will be a point where they will say "We cannot do anything more.."

Good points! And I hope your last statement never happens! And lets face it, things like this get entangled with political motivations as well.

[Passionaria]

Thanks for taking the time to post this AJ! I appreciate info that I can actually understand. I too, have been very concerned. I am doing research on herbs and supplements that combat radiation poisoning. I will get back to all about what I find.....

Pashi

[dreadgeek]

So, I've subscribed to a couple of IAEA (International Atomic Energy Agency) news feeds for the duration of this event. I will post them here so there is a clearinghouse of the most recent information so as it becomes available, I'll try to stay on top of it and make sure that it gets here.

Japan Earthquake Update (15 March 2011, 14:10 UTC)

The IAEA Incident and Emergency Centre (IEC) continues to monitor the status of the nuclear power plants in Japan that were affected by the devastating earthquake and consequent tsunami.

All units at the Fukushima Daini, Onagawa, and Tokai nuclear power plants are in a safe and stable condition (i.e. cold shutdown).

The IAEA remains concerned over the status of the Fukushima Daiichi nuclear power plant, where sea water injections to cool the reactors in Units 1, 2 and 3 are continuing. Attempts to return power to the entire Daiichi site are also continuing.

After explosions at both Units 1 and 3, the primary containment vessels of both Units are reported to be intact. However, the explosion that occurred at 04:25 UTC on 14 March at the Fukushima Daiichi Unit 2 may have affected the integrity of its primary containment vessel. All three explosions were due to an accumulation of hydrogen gas.

A fire at Unit 4 occurred on 14 March 23:54 UTC and lasted two hours. The IAEA is seeking clarification on the nature and consequences of the fire.

The IAEA continues to seek details about the status of all workers, reactors and spent fuel at the Fukushima Daiichi plant.

An evacuation of the population from the 20-kilometre zone around Fukushima Daiichi is in effect. The Japanese have advised that people within a 30-km radius shall take shelter indoors. Iodine tablets have been distributed to evacuation centres but no decision has yet been taken on their administration.

A 30-kilometre no-fly zone has been established around the Daiichi plant. Normal civil aviation beyond this zone remains uninterrupted. The Japan Coast Guard established evacuation warnings within 10 kilometres of Fukushima Daiichi and 3 kilometres of Fukushima Daini.

The IAEA and several other UN organizations held a meeting at 11:00 UTC today to discuss recent developments and coordinate activities related to consequences of the earthquake and tsunami. The meeting was called under the framework of the Joint Radiation Emergency Management Plan of the International Organizations, and this group expects to work closely together in the days ahead.

[dreadgeek]

Originally Posted by Linus

I think the disparity in news is the effect of the internet. We probably won't know for sure until a day or two later. The reality is that news agencies are tripping over each other for the latest and "accurate" (I question how accurate since I don't think they are actually verifying). At the same time, I don't know even if Japanese officials know since the people who would know are doing what they are supposed to: try and contain this as best as they can.

I wonder if there will be a point where they will say "We cannot do anything more.."

Yes, I'm not sure what that point will be but I'm willing to bet that at this point, there are folks on the ground who are saying "I don't think we can stop this thing".

I know that folks don't usually think of scientists and engineers as heroes. But I want to ask everyone to take a moment to think about this:

Right now, on site in Japan, there are people in control rooms working in what are now becoming very hot (radioactively not thermally) conditions. There are ways to deal with exposure: everyone is going to be wearing a dosimeter, everyone will be wearing a mask to keep particulates out of their lungs, they'll be wearing protective clothing. But these are people who are in a hazardous area, the hazard is silent, invisible, and pervasive. You can't dodge it, you can't see it, you can't outrun it, and you have to do a job under conditions at the limit of human cognitive ability, on a system that is already stressed beyond its design specification. These are folks who *know* how nasty radiation sickness can be. They know what those alpha particles are doing to their bodies. They know what Strontium and Cesium can do. Now, I don't know that this happened but any kind of *humane* employer would have said "we can't tell you to stay, so we're going to ask for volunteers". I suspect that everyone on site is there because they volunteered. Unless you are a cop, a firefighter or in the military your employer generally isn't going to ask you to do something that you *know* could get you killed.

The operators on site are heroes. We may not think of them as square-jawed action-figures, but right now everyone of them is being as much a hero as any firefighter.

Cheers
Aj

[Gayla]

I usually tend to take things on face value but right now, I'm sort of on the edge of completely freaking out about this whole thing. The PM is going on TV and telling people that radiation is leaking and I can't help but wonder how much worse it is than what they are saying.

In something I read earlier today, a professional something or another, someone who knows these types of things said, "Right now, I'd worry more about looking both ways when I cross the street than about radiation hitting the West Coast." (totally paraphrased that, but, yeah). I want to know if he's going to come back and tell us when it's time to start worrying? Logically, I know that this is very unlikely but I'm not thinking all that logically right now.

[AtLast]

Originally Posted by dreadgeek

Yes, I'm not sure what that point will be but I'm willing to bet that at this point, there are folks on the ground who are saying "I don't think we can stop this thing".

I know that folks don't usually think of scientists and engineers as heroes. But I want to ask everyone to take a moment to think about this:

Right now, on site in Japan, there are people in control rooms working in what are now becoming very hot (radioactively not thermally) conditions. There are ways to deal with exposure: everyone is going to be wearing a dosimeter, everyone will be wearing a mask to keep particulates out of their lungs, they'll be wearing protective clothing. But these are people who are in a hazardous area, the hazard is silent, invisible, and pervasive. You can't dodge it, you can't see it, you can't outrun it, and you have to do a job under conditions at the limit of human cognitive ability, on a system that is already stressed beyond its design specification. These are folks who *know* how nasty radiation sickness can be. They know what those alpha particles are doing to their bodies. They know what Strontium and Cesium can do. Now, I don't know that this happened but any kind of *humane* employer would have said "we can't tell you to stay, so we're going to ask for volunteers". I suspect that everyone on site is there because they volunteered. Unless you are a cop, a firefighter or in the military your employer generally isn't going to ask you to do something that you *know* could get you killed.

The operators on site are heroes. We may not think of them as square-jawed action-figures, but right now everyone of them is being as much a hero as any firefighter.

Cheers
Aj

I think you might about those really on "the fronts lines" of this are in volunteer status and for me, it is not a stretch to attach "hero" to them.

There are quite a few heros in fields of science - those that developed life saving medicines and surgical procedures would stand out for me. Many others, too.

[Linus]

Article similar to what AJ said but with picture (for those of us who are visually inclined)

http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/_news...lear-questions