Stone Femme?

[lillith]

After reading the Stone Butch thread, I decided that maybe we could open the door to discuss what it means to be a Stone Femme. And if the guys wish to participate, tell us what it is about a Stone Femme that gets you. I will start by copying and pasting my post from the Stone Butch thread.

The very first time I heard the term, I thought, "OK. They must smoke a lot of weed." I asked that question, and was very fortunate to have someone in my life who gently laughed and said, "No." When hy explained things to me, it made sense to me, but I also felt a curious mixture of excitement and repulsion. I told hym that I needed some time to digest what hy said. I understood why I was excited, but I couldn't wrap my head around why I was repulsed. After a couple of days and some serious searching, I came to the conclusion that it was too hetero. I was dedicated to my lesbian sex. I explained all of this to hym, and we agreed friends would be best. There was a nagging, deep feeling I couldn't shake about it all, though. I approached hym and asked hym to show me. And good God-Almighty, did hy ever! Things were so profound that I could no longer say that I was lesbian. I had been "flipped," as it were.

It has been many years since that story, and I have learned that there is no predescribed definition. I have met stones who are hardcore no you don't touch me except for my back to stones who don't look at their biological sex as something other than a mini cock that should be worshiped. I think the point for me is that I am who I am. I am a pleaser and giver and a receiver. What all those mean depends on the relationship and what is agreed to and at any point agreements can change because there are no set rules for me.

[CherylNYC]

My answer, copied and pasted from the Stone Butch thread:


Because I'm a stonefemme my ideal partner would be a stone butch. My late gf was nearly stone, so it worked out very well for us. She allowed a certain amount of touching under some rare circumstances, but it wasn't common for her to be very interested in that sort of thing.

Quote:
Originally Posted by lillith
"... There was a nagging, deep feeling I couldn't shake about it all, though. I approached hym and asked hym to show me. And good God-Almighty, did hy ever! Things were so profound that I could no longer say that I was lesbian. I had been "flipped," as it were.

...I have met stones who are hardcore no you don't touch me except for my back to stones who don't look at their biological sex as something other than a mini cock that should be worshiped."


I don't see why being a stonefemme, or a stone butch for that matter, means that we aren't lesbians. My late gf IDed as such, and I certainly do, too. She was an old school butch who IDed as a lesbian, stone butch, butch dyke, and/or leatherdyke top. All of those IDs were female to her, and she didn't feel compelled to call herself anything other than a woman. A very, VERY butch woman. She had a vagina and a clit, just like any other woman. Being stone meant that she was the pitcher. My stonefemme nature means I'm the catcher. No more, no less.

I'm a lesbian and my sex is stone sex. I assume that no one on this site is going to be foolish enough to tell me that I'm not a lesbian because I'm a stonefemme.

*******************************

Lilth, I'm not devaluing your experience, but I have to say that I'm persistently astonished that there are so many people who think that stone can't be lesbian. I agree that many have a vision of 'typical' lesbian sex which involves taking turns doing the same things to each other in an egalitarian way. I don't think I know many lesbians who actually have sex based on that model. Each person and every combination of people tends to do 'it' and each other however they most enjoy it. The sex act doesn't define who is a lesbian, but the gender of the participants in said act might.

[lillith]

Hey, Cheryl. Lets move this discussion here? I, again, agree with you. There are many variables to defining any kind of ID, including one's gender. Like I said in the Stone Butch thread, I simply wanted to express my experience and what I can encountered.

[atomiczombie]

I have heard various definitions of stone femme, so I am wondering what it means for you ladies.

[CherylNYC]

Originally Posted by atomiczombie

I have heard various definitions of stone femme, so I am wondering what it means for you ladies.

I didn't know that 'stonefemme' was an ID until a friend told me that I was one. I had been struggling mightily with some really horrible guilt about what I couldn't do in bed. When I finally spoke about it out loud to my friend she was not only non-judgmental, she gave me a key that helped me finally understand something essential about myself. It wasn't an easy ID for me to claim at first.

My own manifestation of stonefemme is very much a part of my leather sexuality. I'm a masochist, and sexually submissive. As I noted above, I'm strictly a catcher, never a pitcher. That's very much tied up with sexual submission for me.

[atomiczombie]

Originally Posted by CherylNYC

I didn't know that 'stonefemme' was an ID until a friend told me that I was one. I had been struggling mightily with some really horrible guilt about what I couldn't do in bed. When I finally spoke about it out loud to my friend she was not only non-judgmental, she gave me a key that helped me finally understand something essential about myself. It wasn't an easy ID for me to claim at first.

My own manifestation of stonefemme is very much a part of my leather sexuality. I'm a masochist, and sexually submissive. As I noted above, I'm strictly a catcher, never a pitcher. That's very much tied up with sexual submission for me.

Yeah I only pitch and don't catch, so I hear ya. I used to ID as a stone butch, but now that I know myself better as a transguy, there really isn't an ID to go along with it it seems. No one really talks about being a stone transguy, that I have heard.

[cuddlyfemme]

I'm a stone femme and am very proud of it. I never realized that I was a Stone Femme untill I was in a relationship with a Stone Butch. When I found out what a Stone Butch was and what a Stone Femme was, I suddenly felt comlete. It seems to be hard to find a single Stone Butch, but I keep hoping that one will come along

[ScandalAndy]

Originally Posted by atomiczombie

Yeah I only pitch and don't catch, so I hear ya. I used to ID as a stone butch, but now that I know myself better as a transguy, there really isn't an ID to go along with it it seems. No one really talks about being a stone transguy, that I have heard.

Many of the transmen I know are "stone" while exploring their sexuality in relation to their transition. Although they may not identify as such, their behavior and discomfort with manipulation of their genitalia suggests a stone mindset.

[ScandalAndy]

Okay, so I'm going to come right out and be blunt about this since I"m confused and need a straight answer about this. I apologize for any discomfort my brevity may cause, but I can assure you I am coming from a place of curiosity and not animosity.


So, a stone butch is one who does not want physical stimulation of their genitals, and a stone femme is someone who receives genital stimulation but does not stimulate their partner genitally. Is this correct?


What if there is a butch or a femme who doesn't want to give or receive stimulation?

[Gemme]

Originally Posted by ScandalAndy

Okay, so I'm going to come right out and be blunt about this since I"m confused and need a straight answer about this. I apologize for any discomfort my brevity may cause, but I can assure you I am coming from a place of curiosity and not animosity.


So, a stone butch is one who does not want physical stimulation of their genitals, and a stone femme is someone who receives genital stimulation but does not stimulate their partner genitally. Is this correct?


What if there is a butch or a femme who doesn't want to give or receive stimulation?

Yes and no. That could be a very basic example of what a Stone Butch and Stone Femme could be, but there are many layers of what Stone is and is not. Some have different boundaries as to WHAT bits can and cannot be touched. Also, there are femmes who are Stone who do not want to be touched either. They are the pitchers, so to speak.

For me, Stone means that there are boundaries in the way one likes to be touched (and not always just sexually). For some, those boundaries are finite and do not and will not change. For others, it depends on their partner as to what they are and are not comfortable with. For still others, they have some touch that do not allow and some that they do and still more that is fluid.

Stone is not something that you can look up in the dictionary and say "Aha! This is it EXACTLY!" because it is individualized and just doesn't work that way. There are general guidelines, but it always comes down to the person. ASK him/hym/hir/her/ze what they do and do not allow. If you had 100 Stones in a room and asked each of them what Stone means to them in terms of touch and what is and is not allowed, you will get some repeat answers but there will be far more highly individualized answers, I assure you.

[Gemme]

Originally Posted by atomiczombie

I have heard various definitions of stone femme, so I am wondering what it means for you ladies.

For me, being Stone means, in part, that I prefer to partner with either a Stone Butch or a Transguy. There are certain ways to touching my partner that are just not comfortable for me, so I do not engage in them. The kind of Stones and Transguys I have partnered with get that and don't want that kind of touch anyway.

Stone is not attached to my partner, though they may claim it as their own. Stone is me. My boundaries. My choices. My love. My sex.

[LaneyDoll]

Originally Posted by Gemme

ASK him/hym/hir/her/ze what they do and do not allow.

I agree 100%. I have always employed this practice when I begin to explore things with a new partner. I would rather ask than possibly insult. Besides, I think it takes the stress off someone when you say "please tell me how you prefer for me to touch or not touch you" rather than wait for them to broach the subject. There are ways to ask that are not mood breakers and I think those few moments spend make for a more fulfilling experience.

[ScandalAndy]

Originally Posted by Gemme

Yes and no. That could be a very basic example of what a Stone Butch and Stone Femme could be, but there are many layers of what Stone is and is not. Some have different boundaries as to WHAT bits can and cannot be touched. Also, there are femmes who are Stone who do not want to be touched either. They are the pitchers, so to speak.

For me, Stone means that there are boundaries in the way one likes to be touched (and not always just sexually). For some, those boundaries are finite and do not and will not change. For others, it depends on their partner as to what they are and are not comfortable with. For still others, they have some touch that do not allow and some that they do and still more that is fluid.

Stone is not something that you can look up in the dictionary and say "Aha! This is it EXACTLY!" because it is individualized and just doesn't work that way. There are general guidelines, but it always comes down to the person. ASK him/hym/hir/her/ze what they do and do not allow. If you had 100 Stones in a room and asked each of them what Stone means to them in terms of touch and what is and is not allowed, you will get some repeat answers but there will be far more highly individualized answers, I assure you.

Thank you for this response. Admittedly, I ask and explore with partners as that ends with less disappointment and frustration so don't worry, I promise I'm not tromping all over people's comfort levels.

As I was reading this thread I kept seeing over and over people saying "when I found out I was a stone femme" or "when I learned what these words meant" but there wasn't any sort of explanation of what that meant for those of us who weren't quite sure. I didn't know if there was some magical definition out there that I hadn't found yet.

[Gemme]

Originally Posted by ScandalAndy

Thank you for this response. Admittedly, I ask and explore with partners as that ends with less disappointment and frustration so don't worry, I promise I'm not tromping all over people's comfort levels.

As I was reading this thread I kept seeing over and over people saying "when I found out I was a stone femme" or "when I learned what these words meant" but there wasn't any sort of explanation of what that meant for those of us who weren't quite sure. I didn't know if there was some magical definition out there that I hadn't found yet.

Yes and, for $19.95 plus shipping and handling, you too can know the secrets of the Stones!

*grin*

You ever work at something really hard.....a task at work or maybe a word problem in school....and you can feel yourself getting closer to the answer but you are still confused about the process and are just not there yet? You kinda get it but not really? And then...out of nowhere...it comes to you? A moment that changes how you see things and brings things into focus that had been fuzzy?

For a lot of us, that's how it is. We're too close to be objective or maybe just ignorant of the verbiage but when we figure it out, it just "fits* and the Universe gives us a cosmic high five.

For me, it kind of felt like being able to take deep, full breath after years of shallow breathing.

I don't know of anyone that looked it up or heard about it and just said "Yep, that's it" casually without it bringing their world into focus a bit more and/or creating a moment in their life that they would remember for all time. Personal identity is, well, personal and I have no idea how that kind of discovery could not change someone at their very core.

[CherylNYC]

Originally Posted by ScandalAndy

...As I was reading this thread I kept seeing over and over people saying "when I found out I was a stone femme" or "when I learned what these words meant" but there wasn't any sort of explanation of what that meant for those of us who weren't quite sure. I didn't know if there was some magical definition out there that I hadn't found yet.

The simplest, most common understanding of stonefemme is that we don't penetrate our partners. Stonefemmes will often be unable to perform typical oral sex on their partner, but giving a blow job on their partner's butch cock is usually just fine. Stonefemmes often can't touch their partners breasts or chest in a 'feminising' way.

As Gemme mentioned above, there are also femme women who are stone just as a butch would be stone. They are the pitcher, and they don't catch. They are Stone Femmes. Yes, this is terribly confusing, and I've been agitating for a change in nomenclature for years.

[Gemme]

Originally Posted by CherylNYC

The simplest, most common understanding of stonefemme is that we don't penetrate our partners. Stonefemmes will often be unable to perform typical oral sex on their partner, but giving a blow job on their partner's butch cock is usually just fine. Stonefemmes often can't touch their partners breasts or chest in a 'feminising' way.

As Gemme mentioned above, there are also femme women who are stone just as a butch would be stone. They are the pitcher, and they don't catch. They are Stone Femmes. Yes, this is terribly confusing, and I've been agitating for a change in nomenclature for years.

For me, I write it as Stone Femme, because that's what looks best to me. I'll also use StoneFemme. However, you are right; most differentiate between the two using the space and sometimes the capitalization. It can definitely be confusing to someone who isn't sure.

[ScandalAndy]

Originally Posted by CherylNYC

The simplest, most common understanding of stonefemme is that we don't penetrate our partners. Stonefemmes will often be unable to perform typical oral sex on their partner, but giving a blow job on their partner's butch cock is usually just fine. Stonefemmes often can't touch their partners breasts or chest in a 'feminising' way.

As Gemme mentioned above, there are also femme women who are stone just as a butch would be stone. They are the pitcher, and they don't catch. They are Stone Femmes. Yes, this is terribly confusing, and I've been agitating for a change in nomenclature for years.

Okay, so in this particular context, what are you using "pitcher" and "catcher" to connote?


Thank you all for being so patient. I know it can be frustrating or uncomfortable to try and explain something as individualized as interpretation of one's sexual tendencies in the context of a label.

[Gemme]

Originally Posted by ScandalAndy

Okay, so in this particular context, what are you using "pitcher" and "catcher" to connote?


Thank you all for being so patient. I know it can be frustrating or uncomfortable to try and explain something as individualized as interpretation of one's sexual tendencies in the context of a label.

Pitcher and catcher, of course, refer to baseball. The pitcher takes the Top role and the catcher takes the submissive role. Sometimes. That doesn't always come into play, though.

Play.

Ha.

ba dum BUM

Basically, instead of a baseball, the partners are throwing pleasure balls.

One receives the pleasure in an active manner. That's the catcher. By active manner, I mean the other person (the pitcher) is consciously doing things to create pleasure for their partner. The receiver provides pleasure to the pitcher in what could be referred to as passive or inactive manner by showing him/hym/her/ze that their initial actions have created a pleasureable reaction and the cycle builds from there.

I don't particularly care for terms inactive or passive, because it goes back to the whole 'being a pillow princess' thing. For some, that's a compliment. For others, an insult. And it's just wrong. If I'm enjoying my honey and what he's doing, I'm not just laying there. My innards are contracting, my hips moving, my nails digging into his skin, and he's going to hear it too.

Although, I AM a princess and I AM often on pillows.

Hmmmm.....

I think I just made this waaaaay more complicated than it needed to be.



Let's try again, yes?

The dance that so many talk about is most evident during Stone sex to me. As is Newton's law. One action (pitching) creates an equal and opposite reaction (catching) and it goes on and on from there. The partners feed off of one another's enjoyment of one another and their shared pleasure until...ideally....kaboom.

[Jess]

I am so stealing "pleasure balls"... very enlightening thread, sorry for the derail.

Thank you

[*Anya*]

As always, I speak for myself & my own experiences:

For 10 years my Stone Butch would not allow me to perform oral sex on her. Fucking her or touching her breasts were out of the question. She did feel comfortable masturbating in front of/with me.

I guess during this time I could have been considered a stone femme but it was not my own true sexual identity. Oh god, here goes: I love to eat pussy & I missed it somewhat but there were other obvious benefits in my relationship.

During our 11th year, she was a little tipsy & somehow I wound up fucking her & she liked it but it was a very, very rare experience thereafter and she never wanted to discuss it. It just did not fit with her own sexual identity or self-image. That was OK with me.

Did I love doing it-yes I did! Maybe I have a smidgen of femme top in me but that does not feel comfortable for me at all in my own self-image. I am open to just about anything but am not overtly aggressive sexually. I feel very shy sexually really and have to feel totally comfortable and safe with my sexual partner in order to let myself go. That letting go is very, very hard for me. Stems from my puritanical, rigid upbringing I am sure.

How can I be open to anything on one hand but am never the one to "make the moves"? I have no idea, if you can figure that one out, I'd be glad to know.

I really do hope it is OK to be so honest. I have no idea why I am-scares me a little. The Internet is forever. I just have not found so many like-minded souls before & at least for now, it is bubbling out of me. I think I better put a cork in it.