The Debates

[ruffryder]

Originally Posted by Medusa

Holy Crap. President Obama's face when he told Romney to "continue...".



That was cold rage.

I for one am tired of hearing about the attack in Libya. Of course it was an act of terror. No one needs to say anything about that. We all know this. Americans are targeted whether we are in or out of our own country. Whether they are targeted in or out of our country it is an act of terrorism when it is aimed at the Americans. It was very bold of Hillary Clinton to take the blame and responsibility for what happened. All of our leaders should. All of them. . I think Obama is just tired of hearing about it and getting all the rage and blame from it. He just needs to take responsibility as Clinton has, admit a mistake and assure the Americans it won't happen again. Yeah it's difficult to take care of every single American especially when they are in other countries but there are steps one can take to assure that they can be safe.

Originally Posted by Medusa

"Governor Romeny, you are the last person who is going to get tough on China." - MY PRESIDENT, Barack Obama

As for China and anyone getting tough on them. I think no President is about to get tough on China. We need them and want a defense relationship with them. They are a powerhouse and we need that global security. They provide military assets and resources for us. We like it that way to counter Russia and Iran. Ever since the bombing of Pearl Harbor we have been on the Chinese side. The United States has poured a great amount of aid to help the Chinese, vice versa, and it hasn't changed much since. We need to keep partner with China. They are a global economic power and we have increased trade with them over the years. Obama hasn't gotten tough with them and I don't see it happening with any one.

My concern with the upcoming Presidency is more with the American economy, jobs, healthcare, education, etc.. and I wish someone would step up and not just debate this but actually provide some relief and solutions to help us Americans here at home.

[dreadgeek]

Originally Posted by ruffryder

I for one am tired of hearing about the attack in Libya. Of course it was an act of terror. No one needs to say anything about that. We all know this. Americans are targeted whether we are in or out of our own country. Whether they are targeted in or out of our country it is an act of terrorism when it is aimed at the Americans. It was very bold of Hillary Clinton to take the blame and responsibility for what happened. All of our leaders should. All of them. . I think Obama is just tired of hearing about it and getting all the rage and blame from it. He just needs to take responsibility as Clinton has, admit a mistake and assure the Americans it won't happen again. Yeah it's difficult to take care of every single American especially when they are in other countries but there are steps one can take to assure that they can be safe.

For the record, Obama has taken responsibility. He did that last night. "I'm the President. I'm always responsible." Those were his words last night.

As for China and anyone getting tough on them. I think no President is about to get tough on China.

This is absolutely true. No President is going to 'get tough' with China.

We need them and want a defense relationship with them.

This I'm not so sure of. We certainly don't behave as if we want a defense relationship with them. We don't perform joint military exercises like we do with Japan and South Korea. I think that the military leadership of *both* nations are concerned that, eventually, they are going to have a conflict over Taiwan.

They are a powerhouse and we need that global security. They provide military assets and resources for us.

What assets and resources? I like to think I keep up on these matters and I certainly have a go-to person who is a military historian who I *know* keeps up on them and neither I nor my friend could come up with any instances of the Chinese providing either military assets or resources in the way that, say, the British do.

We like it that way to counter Russia and Iran. Ever since the bombing of Pearl Harbor we have been on the Chinese side.

Ummm, no we haven't. After Mao came to power in 1949 we pretty much broke off contact with China until, I believe, 1972 when Nixon went to China. It is not for nothing that we have that saying "Only Nixon could go to China". We have probably had a less hostile relationship with China than with any other Communist country save, perhaps, Hungary but I would not say we have been on China's side since before the Maoist revolution.

The United States has poured a great amount of aid to help the Chinese, vice versa, and it hasn't changed much since.

Outside of humanitarian relief, I'm not sure how much aid the US has given to China. What aid have the Chinese given us? Again, I can't think of any. Trade isn't aid.

Cheers
Aj

[ruffryder]

Yes, finally Obama has taken responsiblity. That's all he had to do. As soon as Clinton did, everyone dropped the subject of Libya except Romney who keeps wanting to bring it up. No leader should lie or cover up a mess, but more importantly step up, acknowledge, and take responsibility for outcomes and things happening under their control. This upsets me the most right now with the debates from both candidates and the "real" numbers of unemployment, jobs created, taxes on Americans, etc..

China does provide us with monetary resources.. some of our debt is contributed to China and the human rights we are trying to help them achieve. There is one China and it includes Taiwan according to the U.S. Taiwan has purchased billions in arms from the U.S. under Bush and China protested it suspending military contacts, but that's where we need them on board with us and recently in 09 China resumed military contact again.

My point is just that I'm more concerned with our American's struggling here and I don't see anyone getting tough on China and why would that even matter or help our issues we are having now. Besides, I may wonder where are these billions from arms are that are being sold to multiple countries and where is that being allocated to.

I beg to differ that trade is not aid. If we have Made in China stuff in the American stores how is that not aid.. American Jobs going out to China, fund going to China to help them with human rights when ours are not up to par, etc..

Again, the point I'm making is this is maybe a bit of a concern for me considering the debt and trade equality and keeping jobs in the U.S., however China is not gonna assist us with that besides maybe sending some debt relief and adding to it only to be used on other things and not what America needs right now to get back on track with the middle class and poverty numbers.

[ruffryder]

all because of single moms.

CNN.com - U.S. violent crime up for first time in years

Crime rates had been dropping steadily for nearly two decades, but recent statistics show that the increase pushed up the overall rate for violent crime for the first time since 1993. Are you surprised?


I think Obama gained some more support from women again with that whole Binder thing..

[Martina]

Re us and China, the Korean War was a bump in the road. My dad was in the airforce and tells stories of running from Chinese troops as they over-ran his airport during a "human wave" attack.

At dinner I was reading an article in the Economist that said that China thinks our good relationship with Myanmar -- thanks to Hillary -- is an effort to threaten their hegemony in the region. They def don't see us as their buddy.

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re single parenting and poverty, it is kind of ironic that Romney was standing right next to someone raised by a financially struggling single mother. One of her kids became a professor and the other got even a better job.

[always2late]

Ok...this link isn't technically about the debate...but the reviews are hysterically funny!
http://www.amazon.com/Avery-Durable-...DateDescending

[Martina]