The Debates

[BullDog]

Romney doesn't support the Lily Ledbetter Act. He never answered the equal pay question. Who in their right mind thinks women should earn less than men?

[princessbelle]

Originally Posted by Andrea

I don't remember Romney's exact words but I felt his comments were condescending when he said women need "flexible" hours, etc. because they have families. Really? Men don't have families? Really?

This pissed me off too Andrea. So, to me, Romney is saying...sure hire women, lots of them, BUT make sure you are flexible and give them time off to go home and play with kids and make dinner and THEN they can come back and finish their "other" job.

REALLY? We (women) aren't capable of taking a job (career) of our choice with our OWN intellectual balance of what is needed in *our* lives?

No thanks Romney!!!! I don't need YOU to tell me to get off work at 4 and go home and cook then my world will be complete. *I* am totally complete without your patronizing view on women's place in society. All *I* need is for the Government to make sure women get a fair shake to PAY.

I worked full time, sometimes 3-11 shifts, raising my kids, without needing to be home to care for my kids at 4 and cook supper. Know why? Because i am INTELLIGENT enough to make sure my children's needs are met.

This is NOT the 1950s.

Get a freaking clue!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Gráinne]

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

I'm going to speak from my Latina place, I'm disgusted and insulted each and every time Mittens brings up his "Mexican" references. What I mean by this is his continous reminder that his parents were born in Maxico.

I happen to be born there as well, he's not a Latino, Mexican, Catholic, culturally raised man. His father was born in Mexico cause they fled there. That's the only reason that Mittens can even let himself to use my people and country as ANY sort of reference. We may be simple folk, the folk who do jobs no one wants but we ain't stupid. He's an arrogant twit even to think that I'd be swooned by his ignorant references.

Phew I had to get that out:\

I find the reference to be a cheap and patronizing ploy for the so-called Latino vote. But "Latino" isn't synonymous with "Mexican". In my own apartment complex, there are Mexicans, Puerto Ricans, Salvadoreans, and Cubans, among still other nations. All of those home countries have different cultures and intense pride in their own heritage. What I've found is that all of them resent the hell out of being tossed into a giant group together as if they're all the same,with the same issues and needs.

For Romney to insinuate that he understands the concerns and needs of "Latinos" because his ancestors were forced there is as ludicrous and offensive as if I made myself an expert on all Latinos because I went to Cancun.

[Medusa]

I sent this in last night:


Dear Mitt Romney,

Let me tell you about the American people.

American people, at least the vast majority of them, do not live the way you do.

They don't have elevators for their cars.

They don't have millions of dollars in off-shore accounts.

They don't have trust funds they can pull money out of when they are sick of eating tuna fish in college.

Their wives don't wear $8000 suits.

Most of all, they don't live in the stone age where "IF" women are going to be in the workforce.

Newsflash: There is no "if" with regard to women in the workforce. We're here and have been for a very long time. I know it's probably hard for you to understand because the women in your life have been Nannies and Cooks and Stepford Wives who are supposed to be seen and not heard.

I work hard every single day and the idea that you think that there is an "if" in the workforce that apparently doesn't deserve equal pay, the right to choose what to do with my body, or the right to marry my partner is not only grotesque and offensive but is probably the most blinding display of sexism and privilege that I've seen in the political arena ever.

I don't want you leading this country if this is what you stand for. I wouldn't even want you taking out my garbage if this is what you stand for. You, sir, are a cookie-cutter shadow of all of the old rich white men who have come before you who believe that pandering and lying are the way to get into office.

See, I don't live in a world where other people are "beneathe" me. You apparently do. Your vision of the world is not a shiny new adventure toward renewal as you paint it to be, it is the same tired stereotypically lazy concept that white men get to call the shots for everyone around them.

I'm not buying it. What I *am* doing, however, is hitting 'send' on this email to you and going straight over to the donation page for Barack Obama.
That's my money talking. The money I worked for. The money that you don't believe in protecting with the equal pay act.

Thanks,
Angie

[girl_dee]

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

I'm going to speak from my Latina place, I'm disgusted and insulted each and every time Mittens brings up his "Mexican" references. What I mean by this is his continous reminder that his parents were born in Maxico.

I happen to be born there as well, he's not a Latino, Mexican, Catholic, culturally raised man. His father was born in Mexico cause they fled there. That's the only reason that Mittens can even let himself to use my people and country as ANY sort of reference. We may be simple folk, the folk who do jobs no one wants but we ain't stupid. He's an arrogant twit even to think that I'd be swooned by his ignorant references.

Phew I had to get that out:\

Yes in the few minutes i listened in i heard *Mexican Drug Lords*... regarding illegal weapons!!!

[girl_dee]

Originally Posted by Medusa

I sent this in last night:


Dear Mitt Romney,

Let me tell you about the American people.

American people, at least the vast majority of them, do not live the way you do.

They don't have elevators for their cars.

They don't have millions of dollars in off-shore accounts.

They don't have trust funds they can pull money out of when they are sick of eating tuna fish in college.

Their wives don't wear $8000 suits.

Most of all, they don't live in the stone age where "IF" women are going to be in the workforce.

Newsflash: There is no "if" with regard to women in the workforce. We're here and have been for a very long time. I know it's probably hard for you to understand because the women in your life have been Nannies and Cooks and Stepford Wives who are supposed to be seen and not heard.

I work hard every single day and the idea that you think that there is an "if" in the workforce that apparently doesn't deserve equal pay, the right to choose what to do with my body, or the right to marry my partner is not only grotesque and offensive but is probably the most blinding display of sexism and privilege that I've seen in the political arena ever.

I don't want you leading this country if this is what you stand for. I wouldn't even want you taking out my garbage if this is what you stand for. You, sir, are a cookie-cutter shadow of all of the old rich white men who have come before you who believe that pandering and lying are the way to get into office.

See, I don't live in a world where other people are "beneathe" me. You apparently do. Your vision of the world is not a shiny new adventure toward renewal as you paint it to be, it is the same tired stereotypically lazy concept that white men get to call the shots for everyone around them.

I'm not buying it. What I *am* doing, however, is hitting 'send' on this email to you and going straight over to the donation page for Barack Obama.
That's my money talking. The money I worked for. The money that you don't believe in protecting with the equal pay act.

Thanks,
Angie

i just felt a little tingle.........

[Gráinne]

Angie, I nominate you as one of my favorite people ever.

I don't think I've spent anywhere close to $8000 on clothes in thirty years. I hyperventilate if I have to buy a $200 suit.

I may not have agreed with the President in everything he's done (or not done), but at least he's living on the same damn planet.

[dreadgeek]

I posted this on my Facebook wall last night and I'm going to repost it here:

If you are forming a band and are looking for a name, Binders Full of Women. You're welcome.

Cheers
Aj

[QueenofSmirks]

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

I'm going to speak from my Latina place, I'm disgusted and insulted each and every time Mittens brings up his "Mexican" references. What I mean by this is his continous reminder that his parents were born in Maxico.

I happen to be born there as well, he's not a Latino, Mexican, Catholic, culturally raised man. His father was born in Mexico cause they fled there. That's the only reason that Mittens can even let himself to use my people and country as ANY sort of reference. We may be simple folk, the folk who do jobs no one wants but we ain't stupid. He's an arrogant twit even to think that I'd be swooned by his ignorant references.

Phew I had to get that out:\

I posted something similar on Facebook after I heard he was running an ad where his son (?) does the ad in Spanish, to "reach the Latino vote". My reaction was: Are you freakin' kidding me??? His family FLED to Mexico to avoid persecution for practicing polygamy which is illegal in the U.S.! That hardly qualifies them as "Mexicans". To add insult to injury, look at his stance on immigration!! To say he sympathizes because his family are/were immigrants is bullshit.

[dreadgeek]

My other post from FB last night:

Dear Mittens;

Here are the President's words, verbatim, from the Rose Garden:

"No acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation, alter that character, or eclipse the light of the values that we stand for."

Best,
A Citizen

I *loved* that look that Obama gave Romney after Romney all but said that the President did not care about the people who were killed in Libya and took a swipe at Mr. Obama's very genuine taking on the responsibility. I think that had it *not* been live on TV, he would have gone across the stage at Romney exclaiming "okay motherf---er I'm going to kick your butt up and down this stage...tell *me* I don't care about people I put in harm's way!"

[Kätzchen]

Yesterday, at the train station platform, a homeless black man had a carton of blackberry pies on hand in exchange for a bus pass for the day, if he could get one. I loved the ingenuity behind exchanging something of value for something he needed dearly - a paid bus ticket so he could get to work on time. I was done for the day (it was early afternoon) and traded my paid bus pass for the day (a five dollar pass) for a berry pie.

He then asked me if I was voting for Romney while trying to ask me for part of the tacos I had in my possession (the supper Eddie wanted me to get for him that he paid for by dropping funds into my account) and I looked at him and said: "No, I'm not giving you my son's supper nor am I voting for Romney and if Romney becomes president, you'll witness a nuclear explosion unheard of in this neighborhood. I'm fresh out of gaskets to blow. I am voting for President Obama: No. One. Deserves. My. Vote. Other. Than. Obama" (Served with a Femme Death Stare).


My hope is that Michelle Obama runs for President in 2016.

[ruffryder]

Originally Posted by Medusa

Holy Crap. President Obama's face when he told Romney to "continue...".



That was cold rage.

I for one am tired of hearing about the attack in Libya. Of course it was an act of terror. No one needs to say anything about that. We all know this. Americans are targeted whether we are in or out of our own country. Whether they are targeted in or out of our country it is an act of terrorism when it is aimed at the Americans. It was very bold of Hillary Clinton to take the blame and responsibility for what happened. All of our leaders should. All of them. . I think Obama is just tired of hearing about it and getting all the rage and blame from it. He just needs to take responsibility as Clinton has, admit a mistake and assure the Americans it won't happen again. Yeah it's difficult to take care of every single American especially when they are in other countries but there are steps one can take to assure that they can be safe.

Originally Posted by Medusa

"Governor Romeny, you are the last person who is going to get tough on China." - MY PRESIDENT, Barack Obama

As for China and anyone getting tough on them. I think no President is about to get tough on China. We need them and want a defense relationship with them. They are a powerhouse and we need that global security. They provide military assets and resources for us. We like it that way to counter Russia and Iran. Ever since the bombing of Pearl Harbor we have been on the Chinese side. The United States has poured a great amount of aid to help the Chinese, vice versa, and it hasn't changed much since. We need to keep partner with China. They are a global economic power and we have increased trade with them over the years. Obama hasn't gotten tough with them and I don't see it happening with any one.

My concern with the upcoming Presidency is more with the American economy, jobs, healthcare, education, etc.. and I wish someone would step up and not just debate this but actually provide some relief and solutions to help us Americans here at home.

[Corkey]

Originally Posted by Martina

To me this said it all. The man has no morals, is a pathological liar, racist, sexist, pandering privileged patriarchal psychopath. I think I may have left a few adjectives out but you get my drift.

[dreadgeek]

Originally Posted by ruffryder

I for one am tired of hearing about the attack in Libya. Of course it was an act of terror. No one needs to say anything about that. We all know this. Americans are targeted whether we are in or out of our own country. Whether they are targeted in or out of our country it is an act of terrorism when it is aimed at the Americans. It was very bold of Hillary Clinton to take the blame and responsibility for what happened. All of our leaders should. All of them. . I think Obama is just tired of hearing about it and getting all the rage and blame from it. He just needs to take responsibility as Clinton has, admit a mistake and assure the Americans it won't happen again. Yeah it's difficult to take care of every single American especially when they are in other countries but there are steps one can take to assure that they can be safe.

For the record, Obama has taken responsibility. He did that last night. "I'm the President. I'm always responsible." Those were his words last night.

As for China and anyone getting tough on them. I think no President is about to get tough on China.

This is absolutely true. No President is going to 'get tough' with China.

We need them and want a defense relationship with them.

This I'm not so sure of. We certainly don't behave as if we want a defense relationship with them. We don't perform joint military exercises like we do with Japan and South Korea. I think that the military leadership of *both* nations are concerned that, eventually, they are going to have a conflict over Taiwan.

They are a powerhouse and we need that global security. They provide military assets and resources for us.

What assets and resources? I like to think I keep up on these matters and I certainly have a go-to person who is a military historian who I *know* keeps up on them and neither I nor my friend could come up with any instances of the Chinese providing either military assets or resources in the way that, say, the British do.

We like it that way to counter Russia and Iran. Ever since the bombing of Pearl Harbor we have been on the Chinese side.

Ummm, no we haven't. After Mao came to power in 1949 we pretty much broke off contact with China until, I believe, 1972 when Nixon went to China. It is not for nothing that we have that saying "Only Nixon could go to China". We have probably had a less hostile relationship with China than with any other Communist country save, perhaps, Hungary but I would not say we have been on China's side since before the Maoist revolution.

The United States has poured a great amount of aid to help the Chinese, vice versa, and it hasn't changed much since.

Outside of humanitarian relief, I'm not sure how much aid the US has given to China. What aid have the Chinese given us? Again, I can't think of any. Trade isn't aid.

Cheers
Aj

[*Anya*]

It forever blows my mind that out of all the Republicans in this country, Romney is the best that they could come up with to run for president.

Abraham Lincoln must turn over in his grave 10 times per day to see what has been made of his party.

Pissed me off this morning on my drive to work, the guy doing the news for KRock in LA, 106.7, gave the most recent poll results and kept calling President Obama, Mr. Obama.

WTF.

[ruffryder]

Yes, finally Obama has taken responsiblity. That's all he had to do. As soon as Clinton did, everyone dropped the subject of Libya except Romney who keeps wanting to bring it up. No leader should lie or cover up a mess, but more importantly step up, acknowledge, and take responsibility for outcomes and things happening under their control. This upsets me the most right now with the debates from both candidates and the "real" numbers of unemployment, jobs created, taxes on Americans, etc..

China does provide us with monetary resources.. some of our debt is contributed to China and the human rights we are trying to help them achieve. There is one China and it includes Taiwan according to the U.S. Taiwan has purchased billions in arms from the U.S. under Bush and China protested it suspending military contacts, but that's where we need them on board with us and recently in 09 China resumed military contact again.

My point is just that I'm more concerned with our American's struggling here and I don't see anyone getting tough on China and why would that even matter or help our issues we are having now. Besides, I may wonder where are these billions from arms are that are being sold to multiple countries and where is that being allocated to.

I beg to differ that trade is not aid. If we have Made in China stuff in the American stores how is that not aid.. American Jobs going out to China, fund going to China to help them with human rights when ours are not up to par, etc..

Again, the point I'm making is this is maybe a bit of a concern for me considering the debt and trade equality and keeping jobs in the U.S., however China is not gonna assist us with that besides maybe sending some debt relief and adding to it only to be used on other things and not what America needs right now to get back on track with the middle class and poverty numbers.

[ruffryder]

all because of single moms.

CNN.com - U.S. violent crime up for first time in years

Crime rates had been dropping steadily for nearly two decades, but recent statistics show that the increase pushed up the overall rate for violent crime for the first time since 1993. Are you surprised?


I think Obama gained some more support from women again with that whole Binder thing..

[Martina]

Re us and China, the Korean War was a bump in the road. My dad was in the airforce and tells stories of running from Chinese troops as they over-ran his airport during a "human wave" attack.

At dinner I was reading an article in the Economist that said that China thinks our good relationship with Myanmar -- thanks to Hillary -- is an effort to threaten their hegemony in the region. They def don't see us as their buddy.

-----

re single parenting and poverty, it is kind of ironic that Romney was standing right next to someone raised by a financially struggling single mother. One of her kids became a professor and the other got even a better job.

[always2late]

Ok...this link isn't technically about the debate...but the reviews are hysterically funny!
http://www.amazon.com/Avery-Durable-...DateDescending

[Martina]