01-15-2010, 08:30 PM | #21 |
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2012
Why does everyone get all jiggy over the Neptune Cycle?
...Just askin'...
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01-15-2010, 08:53 PM | #22 |
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I agree with others here, it's a bunch of hype and as someone said I've already lived through several end of the world dates. I figure it like this. We are all gonna die sometime. It's what we all have in common. The minute of birth we start to die. So I've been waiting 47 yrs to die, and by then it will be 50 yrs I've waited to die. So if it comes it comes and if it don't then perhaps I'll make 51, but lets not rush things I want to finish 47,and do 48 and 49 first.
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01-18-2010, 05:14 PM | #23 |
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I'm definitely curious. Just as I was curious about Y2K, and I'm observant and curious about nuclear warheads being constructed. I'm also curious
about biological warfare, and terrorism and I have a mild curiosity over errant meteors slingshoting their way to terra firma. I guess, in short, while these things snag my attention, what can I/we really do about things that escape our immediate control ? I think something is bound to happen somewhere...then I'll go get a cup of coffee and be glad some god-awful cataclysmic event didn't take place. And in the meantime live every moment like it might...cause you never know. |
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01-18-2010, 05:59 PM | #24 |
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I think something will happen. I'm just not sure what.
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01-18-2010, 06:02 PM | #25 |
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I think 2012 will begin an averge weight of 235 amongst women.
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01-18-2010, 06:40 PM | #26 |
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I watched the big documentary on the supposed event and I came away with this idea....true enough the milky way does have a black hole in the center which we all know the gravitational pull of a black hole, right? The alignment with our core <earth> has to have some kind of effect much like that of a full moon accept greater. The oceans waters will rise creating floods. To what degree who knows. The cycle of life could be changed drastically if the earths movement is changed to the .1 degree they said it would, it would create a counter clockwise rotation flipping the poles. I don't think this would be an over night event though. It would take years and years causing a gradual altering of the entire life cycle on the planet.
just my three cents
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01-18-2010, 07:27 PM | #27 |
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I tend to agree with Corkey. I'm not sure why the Bible thumpers are jumping on this one since the Bible says that: No man knows the hour or day.
I remember growing up in the church and there being a big deal made of 1984 ...and then 1999. Fascinating stuff, and while Revelations does talk of end times, wars, rumors of wars, earthquakes, etc.... well, those things have been going on for a long time too.
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01-18-2010, 07:42 PM | #28 |
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Just another year, FF
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01-26-2010, 11:53 AM | #29 | |
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I'll take these one-by-one:
The whole 2012 thing is hype and nothing more. It sells books, it sells movie tickets but there is nothing to it. Dec 21 2012 will come and go and Dec 22 2012 will come and go. People who have made their money on the 2012 hysteria will have their money and they will then go on to pretend that they DIDN'T make predictions that failed to come true and will then start hyping the Apophis event in 2029. There is NO scientific basis for believing that anything at all interesting will happen on Dec 21 2012 unless humans do something incredibly stupid but that isn't the kind of thing we're discussing here. Cheers Aj
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01-26-2010, 12:37 PM | #30 | |
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I thought I'd add a bit more about the supermassive black hole at the center of the galaxy and why it has no measurable effect on us. In order to understand the full implications of this, it's necessary to dive a bit deeper into gravity--what it is and how it works. So.... Gravity is the warping of space-time by the presence of mass. The more massive an object is, the more gravitational influence it has. One implication of this is that, EVERYTHING with mass has SOME gravitational influence. That includes you, me, and everything else. However, your mass compared with the mass of the Earth is absolutely negligible so for all practical purposes we can ignore the mass of living things for the kinds of applications we're talking about. Another reason why we can ignore the mass of living things is that gravity is a field and ALL fields obey the inverse square law. To understand this falling off, let's take an ideal situation. Imagine a sphere that has mass. At distance 1R from the sphere, let's say that there are 9 'lines of force' radiating out in all directions contained in a box that we'll label B1. The lines of force in B1 will be F-F-F-F-F-F-F-F-F At distance 2R there will be *four* foxes which will have a pattern like B1: F-F-F B2: F-F-F B3: F-F B4: F-F. At distance 3R: there will be *nine* boxes with one line of force. The more F's in a box the greater the force. So a box with 9 lines of force in it has a greater amount of force than a box with one line of force. The reason I explained this was to give you some way of visualizing what is happening with the gravitational force between the supermassive black hole at the center of the Milky Way and the Earth. Now, we are 30,000 light years from the galactic center. A light year is 5,878,488,057,210 miles. That is an incomprehensible distance! To put it into scale, it takes light about 8 minutes to traverse the 93 million miles from the Sun to Earth. Moving at that speed it takes 30,000 years to traverse the distance between the Sun and the galactic center. Gravity propagates through space at the speed of light. Now, what I'm trying to get you to visualize is this: the gravitational effect of the galactic center is negligible while still being non-zero. However, it is so negligible as to not be worth considering for ANY applications that we're likely to use. (The only one I can think of where we would need it is to account for what is caused 'gravity lensing' when dealing with an object on the *other* side of the galaxy from us.) The gravitational force of the galactic center has NO effect on the tides (which are effected by the Moon pulling on the crust of the Earth slightly deforming it and causing the water to rise). The axial tilt of the Earth does not stay precisely at 23 degrees, by the way. It actually precedes at MORE than the .1 degree you mention (it actually changes about 1 degree over a 72 year cycle). As far as the Earth ever reversing its rotational direction that will NEVER happen. The angular momentum of the Earth (angular momentum is what keeps you upright when riding a bike) has so much energy in it that any force that would change that angular momentum enough to effect our rotation so drastically would literally shatter the Earth into pieces. Cheers Aj
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01-26-2010, 01:25 PM | #31 |
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I like the informative post by da geek Personally, I don't subscribe to the ancients, in theories or conjecture or anything paranormal. I believe in logic and scientific proof. I also believe is that God has things in control. I believe if we're meant to know things that become facts, we'll know.
Sidebar: I don't regard God, the supernatural or preter-natural as paranormal in the usual sense. |
01-26-2010, 02:36 PM | #32 |
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Yeahhh, how many times has Earth been supposed to end in my life time alone?
When I was a kid I would get all bent out of shape and scared, now I am jaded. 2012 will be just another year. Probably more annoying than usual with people acting like they did in Y2K and stocking up on wheat, water and Spam. Really interesting posts as always AJ! and For those of you who do believe in the "Celestial Dictaphone" version of the Bible. Jesus warned his followers several times that the end would happen when we least expect it.
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01-26-2010, 02:52 PM | #33 |
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From as astrological standpoint - the Pluto-Jupiter-Saturn quincunx on that date does signify an intense spiritual change/enlightenment of sort - also indicating a 'painful' transformation for some (thanks to Saturn and Jupiter). In a nutshell, it does signifies a new beginning - both on a personal level and a collective level. (These planets are more "generational" than they are "individual" and the effects vary upon the placement of these planets in a person's chart.)
Yeah, I know .. blah blah blah. It means something is going to happen, but I really don't believe it will be the end of the physical world. It might feel that way to some - (but that will be more on an emotional level). Change is good, even if it feels bad at first. Otherwise, I'll be 46 in 2012, Mare will be 49. Hopefully by then, we'll have our farm and a pot belly pig named Harold. Oh and a chicken, and maybe a horse or two. (and no, not of the apocalyptic breed).
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01-26-2010, 03:56 PM | #34 | |
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Although I am not an expert I am certain it's all about Quantum Physics http://library.thinkquest.org/3487/qp.html What reality will you manifest? I will be with my soulmate, we will be happy each moment we breathe. It will be our commitment to feed each other and keep each other safe. Things are aligning and change is inevitable. The planet has always shifted and change. This will be great change. Will it happen all one one day? No, I dont think so but i do believe there will be a great sign. Its already happening all around us. [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wKyNIY9oMnw"]YouTube- Lisa Thiel - Song to Inanna[/ame]
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01-26-2010, 04:08 PM | #35 |
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nothing...over my life time..they have said the world was gonna end a couple of times....i will believe when i see it........and by that time i wont have time to care anyway
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01-26-2010, 04:55 PM | #36 | |
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QM (quantum physics) is a theory dealing only with microscopic objects. By this I mean that it really only deals with *sub-atomic* objects. The reason for this is that the sub-atomic world deals with objects on what is called the Planck length. The Planck length is the smallest conceivable distance. It is 10^-43 (that's a 1 with 43 zeros in front of it). Atoms are HUGE compared to the Planck length. Once you start talking about molecules and other macro-objects (and for our purposes here even a single bacterial spore is a macro-object) all of the various statistical effects cancel one another out and we can safely treat that object as a classical phenomena (meaning we don't need to use quantum physics). (This is not ALWAYS the case, computer circuitry is becoming so small that engineers have to take into account quantum mechanical effects but they are building logic gates that are only, maybe, a dozen or so atoms across. To give you a sense of scale the average human hair is between 800,000 and 1,200,000 atoms across.) Quantum mechanics is necessary when talking about things like the nucleus of an atom or the electron shells around that nucleus but that is really about all. The only OTHER exception I can think of is when you are dealing with the interior of a black hole (which, no matter the size of the black hole's event horizon can be treated as a singularity at or a little larger than the Planck length). However, it's important to note that this ONLY applies to the *interior* of a black hole, once you are beyond the event horizon black holes can be treated as relativistic objects because they are so massive and you can ignore any quantum mechanical effects. Fritjof Capra and Fred Alan Wolf (Dr. Quantum) not-with-standing people in the mainstream of physics do not ascribe quantum mechanical effects to macro-objects. Another important thing to remember about quantum mechanics is that it is a *statistical* theory. While it is still deterministic what is usually talked about is the probability that, for instance, a given electron will be found in a given orbit (shell) of an atom. Quantum mechanics is a vital part of what is called the Standard Model of particle physics but the key words here are *particle* physics. QM enables physicists to describe the four fundamental forces (electromagnetic, gravitational, strong and weak nuclear)*, what they are made of (quarks and bozons) and why they have the strengths they do. However, once you are talking about objects *effected* by those forces typically quantum mechanics is not particularly useful. Anything the size of the Earth and certainly any living things ON the Earth are too large and too hot (from a thermodynamic perspective) for quantum mechanics to apply to them. Even a single neuron in your brain is too large and too hot for quantum mechanics to be usefully applied to it. I'm not saying that it is absolutely *impossible* just very, very, very, very, very, very improbable! *The four forces in order of strength are:
** To appreciate the difference in strength values between the electromagnetic force and the gravitational force (the two forces we're most familiar with) try this. During a thunderstorm take a comb and rub it on your shirt (best if it is wool) then hold that comb over a piece of unimpeded paper sitting on your desk. It should lift the paper. Think about this. It takes the mass of the entire PLANET to hold the paper on the desk and only the small amount of static electricity you can generate during a thunderstorm with a comb to overcome the planet's gravity! Here is a link to a paper I wrote on the misuse of quantum mechanics for a philosophy of science class last term. While I wrote it with my professor (who was a chemist in another career incarnation) as a target audience it should still be accessible to most people (I hope): http://web.me.com/dreadgeek/Dreaded_...mysticism.html
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01-26-2010, 06:30 PM | #37 | |
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That paper deserves a thread of it's own. Just say No to New Age Fascism! "any meaning-creation systems we deploy should be in line with science or, if that is not possible, they should stay as far away from the purview of science as is humanly possible." Indeed.
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01-26-2010, 07:33 PM | #38 |
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Last Nov. 3, www.bbc.co.uk aired a documentary on the subject of black holes. In the search of Black Holes they found something that is the building block of existence, and a subject that keeps the balance in the Universe. They said this discovery has frightened scientists as they can't make sense of it. They have found something which cannot be seen, it is so small yet it's mass equals infinity. It's where time stops and there is no Space. This is where physics fails. This is where the Universe came from and is at the centre of each black hole. It cannot be seen, but will give traces of light. There are millions of it, and I'm sure science will discover it is closer to home then they think. Science has given this place where infinite Gravity and Infinite Density exists the name "Singularity." This "Singularity" is something they cannot explain as the equations make this equal Infinity. Theory of Relativity is thrown out the window, and when they use Quatum Mechanics it gets even worse as this equals Infinity x Infinity. Astrologically, there will be an alignment, but we cannot say for certain what will occur.
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01-26-2010, 07:59 PM | #39 | |
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The singularity as the beginning of the Universe is not used anymore. It is an artifact of cosmology that includes general relativity but not quantum mechanics. If you 'roll the tape backwards' to the beginning of the Universe without incorporating quantum mechanics you end up with an infinitely dense mass in an infinitely small space (a singularity). However, later developments in cosmology that *do* incorporate quantum mechanics eliminate the need for a singularity and no one in cosmology uses it any longer. Singularities do *not* keep the balance of the Universe because the Universe is not in balance. Dark matter and dark energy (whatever they are) are *far* more important at explaining the expansion of the Universe (and thus its topology) than black holes or singularities. Actually if there were a black hole in our immediate neighborhood, we would detect it. They are NOT subtle objects. Black holes have a number of very noticeable effects if they are in the neighborhood of other objects so it would NOT sneak up on us. Our sun lacks the mass to become a black hole by a couple of orders of magnitude. The nearest black hole to us is the SMBH at the center of the galaxy and that is 30,000 light years away (that's 17,634,641,716,300,000 miles away!). There are millions of black holes, in fact all the spiral galaxies appear to have supermassive black holes at the center of them but they are ALL very far away from us. To say that black holes terrify scientists because we don't fully understand the physics of them is an insult to scientists. It is that lack of understanding that creates interesting scientific work. The only reason it would terrify them if, for some reason, we found one in our immediate (solar) neighborhood but there isn't one and there isn't anything near (within a few hundred light years) massive enough to create one. Cheers Aj
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01-26-2010, 08:08 PM | #40 |
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I think he is responsible for the singularity:
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