Trans News/ Issues

[JDeere]

Originally Posted by charley

Here is one thing I do not understand at all, what is a Terf? I read the article and didn't get what was going on... Someone care to explain... And what is with this violence? Personally, I do not accept violence as a valid solution to any conflict.

I read it as well and it confused me too. I know what a terf is but the violence within the gltbqi community is ridiculous.

Terf is a trans exclusionary radical feminist.

[charley]

Originally Posted by JDeere

I read it as well and it confused me too. I know what a terf is but the violence within the gltbqi community is ridiculous.

Terf is a trans exclusionary radical feminist.

Thanks, JDeere; okay, so I finally googled Wikipedia:

"They are, in short, a hate group that by no means represents mainstream feminism."

Ah, I now get that their violence is motivated by hatred - absolutely horrid. First, I learned about the incel movement because of the Toronto van killings, and now this! Am stunned!
Women grouping together (vigilantism) & beating up transfolk - mind-boggling.

[JDeere]

Originally Posted by charley

Thanks, JDeere; okay, so I finally googled Wikipedia:

"They are, in short, a hate group that by no means represents mainstream feminism."

Ah, I now get that their violence is motivated by hatred - absolutely horrid. First, I learned about the incel movement because of the Toronto van killings, and now this! Am stunned!
Women grouping together (vigilantism) & beating up transfolk - mind-boggling.

There have been transfolk who have beat up on TERF'S as well.

[*Anya*]

I really have not wanted to talk about this here.

I have no way of knowing how it would be received here but it is a very, very, big issue out in the rest of the lesbian world.

There are blogs upon blogs and posts in Tumblr and Twitter and forums, of a large group of transwomen advocating violence against lesbians that chose to not have sex with them, but chose to have sex only with biologically female lesbians.

I have seen and could post here- but won't- of some of the most vicious calls for violence against lesbians, as well as documented celebrations of actual violence against lesbians.

It has become a "thing" in the world outside of BFP.

It upsets me beyond measure.

TERF is a slur. It is a vile slur.

It is once again women being attacked.

You won't find gay men being attacked verbally or physically by transmen if they chose to have sex with only biologically gay men.

No, Only lesbians get this treatment.

What JDeere is referring to is the most recent experience in which a lesbian in a bar made a comment pereceived to be anti-transwomen, so a group of her friends, including the transwoman, beat the shit out of the lesbian outside the bar and then celebrated that they did this online afterward. I read all of their posts.

What the everlasting fuck??!

After all the years that lesbians fought for their right to exist and fuck who they choose, lesbians are being verbally and physically attacked within the queer community?

It feels to many lesbians that there is an attempt to erase us.

BFP has been a safe place for me. I have not had to deal with this here but out in the rest of the real world and the online community it is now happening.

[Femmewench]

I was so eloquent in my first version of this post. Then the ether ate it.

TERF (Trans Exclusionary Radical Feminist) is to MtFs as incel (involuntarily celibate - men who can't find women willing to have sex with them) is to men. I don't owe anyone sex. To say that I do is to take away my right of self-determination.

And incels are talking online about getting what is owed to them - by force if necessary. This sounds remarkably similar to the group of MtFs who allegedly beat up the lesbian in the article. Give them what they want or they'll punish us. The first would be rape, and the second is battery. The amount of anger I felt reading that article stunned me.

Both reek to me of male privilege gone wrong. It's not the fact that the physical transition for the trans woman in the article isn't complete that ensures lesbians find her unattractive. It's the fact that anyone expects someone to have sex with them that makes them unattractive.

TERF is a term applied to us not adopted by us. And that slur doesn't effect me at all because it's not a descriptor of me. It does tell me all I would need to know about someone who uses the term.

I can't imagine living in a body which doesn't match my internal knowledge of my real self. It's not an excuse to belittle others or hurt others.

If I offended anyone with this post, please PM me. It was not my intent.

[*Anya*]

Originally Posted by Femmewench

I was so eloquent in my first version of this post. Then the ether ate it.

TERF (Trans Exclusionary Radical Feminist) is to MtFs as incel (involuntarily celibate - men who can't find women willing to have sex with them) is to men. I don't owe anyone sex. To say that I do is to take away my right of self-determination.

And incels are talking online about getting what is owed to them - by force if necessary. This sounds remarkably similar to the group of MtFs who allegedly beat up the lesbian in the article. Give them what they want or they'll punish us. The first would be rape, and the second is battery. The amount of anger I felt reading that article stunned me.

Both reek to me of male privilege gone wrong. It's not the fact that the physical transition for the trans woman in the article isn't complete that ensures lesbians find her unattractive. It's the fact that anyone expects someone to have sex with them that makes them unattractive.

TERF is a term applied to us not adopted by us. And that slur doesn't effect me at all because it's not a descriptor of me. It does tell me all I would need to know about someone who uses the term.

I can't imagine living in a body which doesn't match my internal knowledge of my real self. It's not an excuse to belittle others or hurt others.

If I offended anyone with this post, please PM me. It was not my intent.

Thank you for this.

[Gemme]

Originally Posted by JDeere

http://www.afterellen.com/general-ne...of-a-drag-show

What do y'all think?

I think the bloodlust is disgusting. Someone doesn't get someone else's identity so the solution is to beat them down the next time they come to the bar? I think that someone should have cooled their heels in a jail cell for that. What's wrong with debate and education?

[JDeere]

Originally Posted by Gemme

I think the bloodlust is disgusting. Someone doesn't get someone else's identity so the solution is to beat them down the next time they come to the bar? I think that someone should have cooled their heels in a jail cell for that. What's wrong with debate and education?

No clue. I was completely appalled at the whole situation in the article. I still have yet to fully understand.

[Wrang1er]

This is the first I have heard of TERF. It's horrible. It seems like hate is rampant these days. I suppose it was always there we just didn't have all the means of hearing about it as we do now.

[JDeere]

Originally Posted by Wrang1er

This is the first I have heard of TERF. It's horrible. It seems like hate is rampant these days. I suppose it was always there we just didn't have all the means of hearing about it as we do now.

I've known of TERFS for a very long time. Dont like em probably as much as they don't like me but ya know violence only makes shit worse.

[*Anya*]

Originally Posted by JDeere

I've known of TERFS for a very long time. Dont like em probably as much as they don't like me but ya know violence only makes shit worse.

TERFS are what lesbians are called that choose to have relationships with female born women.

They are called that by queer-identified transwomen that believe violence against lesbians that do not have sex with them is called for.

Is that what you mean when you say that you have known TERFS for a long time and don't like them?

TERF is a slur.

[Gemme]

Originally Posted by *Anya*

TERF is a slur.

I hadn't heard the term before JDeere's article. If the energy that people use to tear others down was collected and applied to positive ventures, do you (general collective you) realize how far we could go as a nation and humankind?

[Medusa]

Hold up, folks.

I am getting messages and reports because several folks are very concerned about where this discussion is going...and I am too.

Just to be clear, this thread is a thread for Trans News and Issues. It does not feel safe or fair to have the "TERF" discussion in this thread since that term is being used to describe people who largely identify as Lesbians.

From my own studies, the usage of "TERF" has denoted Lesbians who are "Trans-exclusionary" from their brand of "Radical Feminism", meaning, they DO NOT view MtF's as "real" women. One could make the argument ( and I have seen it in multiple venues) that not seeing Trans women as "real" women is the real reason that Trans-exclusionists don't want to have sex with them.

Do we all agree that nobody of any gender owes sex to another person? God, I hope so. If not, get the fuck off of my site.

I would absolutely be down for having an in-depth, heated, radical discussion about the term "TERF" in the Red Zone, but not here.

Carry on.

Thank you,
Angie

[JDeere]

Originally Posted by Medusa

Hold up, folks.

I am getting messages and reports because several folks are very concerned about where this discussion is going...and I am too.

Just to be clear, this thread is a thread for Trans News and Issues. It does not feel safe or fair to have the "TERF" discussion in this thread since that term is being used to describe people who largely identify as Lesbians.

From my own studies, the usage of "TERF" has denoted Lesbians who are "Trans-exclusionary" from their brand of "Radical Feminism", meaning, they DO NOT view MtF's as "real" women. One could make the argument ( and I have seen it in multiple venues) that not seeing Trans women as "real" women is the real reason that Trans-exclusionists don't want to have sex with them.

Do we all agree that nobody of any gender owes sex to another person? God, I hope so. If not, get the fuck off of my site.

I would absolutely be down for having an in-depth, heated, radical discussion about the term "TERF" in the Red Zone, but not here.

Carry on.

Thank you,
Angie

Red zone is fine with me. My purpose was to bring to life the fact that this still exists and that the trans community should know shit like this still happens.

[nycfem]

Just a gentle reminder to all that if we mod, please don't respond on the thread to it. If you want to PM us regarding it, that's alright.

[Kätzchen]

I'm leaving an link today to some exceptional news coverage and latest articles found on the Huffington Post website. Lots of interesting stories about how current day activists and LGBTQ pioneers are shaping progress for others in the Trans community and how Matthew Shepherd policy advocates play an critical role in furthering social progress for all.

Cheers,
--K.

https://m.huffpost.com/us/feature/pride-2018

[Esme nha Maire]

Hi folks! I've just come across this article entitled "Non-coding DNA changes the genitals you're born with" on the Science Daily website:http://https://www.sciencedaily.com/...0614213729.htm

It's a fascinating and thought-provoking read!

[cathexis]

Originally Posted by Esme nha Maire

Hi folks! I've just come across this article entitled "Non-coding DNA changes the genitals you're born with" on the Science Daily website:http://https://www.sciencedaily.com/...0614213729.htm

It's a fascinating and thought-provoking read!

Really would like to read this article, there seems to
be some difficulty with the link. Would you be so kind
as to check and repost. Thanx

[Esme nha Maire]

Sure! That's weird, two posts in a row where I've posted links and they've not come out right. Never mind!

Here's the link again: https://www.sciencedaily.com/release...0614213729.htm

[cathexis]

Originally Posted by Esme nha Maire

Sure! That's weird, two posts in a row where I've posted links and they've not come out right. Never mind!

Here's the link again: https://www.sciencedaily.com/release...0614213729.htm

Works great now. Much appreciated. Really interesting article.