What makes me butch?

[The_Lady_Snow]

Originally Posted by Kobi

some hold packages while others do the shopping.

ACKK I don't hold packages OR do shopping

>I want mah butch card<

[Kobi]

I can not find anywhere else to put this. So maybe it can go here. My ex sent this to me.....I think there was a subtle message in here somewhere but I chose to ignore it.

So, we can title this....you know you are Butch when you understand the following femme-isms:

1) Fine: This is the word femmes use to end an argument when they are right and you need to shut up.



(2) Five Minutes: If she is getting dressed, this means a half an hour. Five minutes is only five minutes if you have just been given five more minutes to watch the women’s basketball game before helping around the house.



(3) Nothing: This is the calm before the storm. This means something, and you should be on your toes. Arguments that begin with nothing usually end in fine.


(4) Go Ahead: This is a dare, not permission. Don't Do It!



(5) Loud Sigh: This is actually a word, but is a non-verbal statement often misunderstood by denying or unobservant butches. A loud sigh means she thinks you are an idiot and wonders why she is wasting her time standing here and arguing with you about “nothing”. (Refer back to # 3 .)



(6) That's Okay: This is one of the most dangerous statement a femme can make to a butch. This means she wants to think long and hard before deciding how and when you will pay for your mistake. Be prepared for her interminable silence!



(7) Thanks: A femme is thanking you, do not question, or faint. Just say you're welcome. (I want to add in a clause here - This is true, unless she says 'Thanks a lot' - that is PURE sarcasm and she is not thanking you at all. DO NOT say 'you're welcome' to that as it will bring on a 'whatever').



(8) Whatever: Is a femme's way of saying F--- YOU!



(9) Don't worry about it, I got it: Another dangerous statement, meaning this is something that a femme has told you to do several times, but is now doing it herself. This will later result in a butch asking 'What's wrong? Did I do something wrong?' For the femme's response refer to # 3.



* Send this to the butches you know, to warn them about arguments they can avoid if they remember the terminology even when the femme agrees to work through disagreements, she usually means #8.



* Send this to the femmes you know to give them a good laugh, cause they know it's true!!!

[The_Lady_Snow]

Originally Posted by Kobi

I can not find anywhere else to put this. So maybe it can go here. My ex sent this to me.....I think there was a subtle message in here somewhere but I chose to ignore it.

So, we can title this....you know you are Butch when you understand the following femme-isms:

1) Fine: This is the word femmes use to end an argument when they are right and you need to shut up.





(2) Five Minutes: If she is getting dressed, this means a half an hour. Five minutes is only five minutes if you have just been given five more minutes to watch the women’s basketball game before helping around the house.





(3) Nothing: This is the calm before the storm. This means something, and you should be on your toes. Arguments that begin with nothing usually end in fine.


(4) Go Ahead: This is a dare, not permission. Don't Do It!





(5) Loud Sigh: This is actually a word, but is a non-verbal statement often misunderstood by denying or unobservant butches. A loud sigh means she thinks you are an idiot and wonders why she is wasting her time standing here and arguing with you about “nothing”. (Refer back to # 3 .)



(6) That's Okay: This is one of the most dangerous statement a femme can make to a butch. This means she wants to think long and hard before deciding how and when you will pay for your mistake. Be prepared for her interminable silence!





(7) Thanks: A femme is thanking you, do not question, or faint. Just say you're welcome. (I want to add in a clause here - This is true, unless she says 'Thanks a lot' - that is PURE sarcasm and she is not thanking you at all. DO NOT say 'you're welcome' to that as it will bring on a 'whatever').





(8) Whatever: Is a femme's way of saying F--- YOU!



(9) Don't worry about it, I got it: Another dangerous statement, meaning this is something that a femme has told you to do several times, but is now doing it herself. This will later result in a butch asking 'What's wrong? Did I do something wrong?' For the femme's response refer to # 3.



* Send this to the butches you know, to warn them about arguments they can avoid if they remember the terminology even when the femme agrees to work through disagreements, she usually means #8.



* Send this to the femmes you know to give them a good laugh, cause they know it's true!!!

Really?

Misogyny much?

[Kobi]

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

Really?

Misogyny much?

And now the righteous indignation begins......

Kobi going to watch movie before Kobi creates any more controversy today.

[The_Lady_Snow]

Originally Posted by Kobi

And now the righteous indignation begins......

Kobi going to watch movie before Kobi creates any more controversy today.

This isn't about righteous anything Kobi, do you really believe that is what makes a butch?

That kind of thinking?

Do you think that was respectful to femmes?

Serious questions here...

[weatherboi]

as a guy i think this is a disgraceful thing to post

this list is most idiotic

i don't think like this

Originally Posted by Kobi

I can not find anywhere else to put this. So maybe it can go here. My ex sent this to me.....I think there was a subtle message in here somewhere but I chose to ignore it.

So, we can title this....you know you are Butch when you understand the following femme-isms:

1) Fine: This is the word femmes use to end an argument when they are right and you need to shut up


(2) Five Minutes: If she is getting dressed, this means a half an hour. Five minutes is only five minutes if you have just been given five more minutes to watch the women’s basketball game before helping around the house.


(3) Nothing: This is the calm before the storm. This means something, and you should be on your toes. Arguments that begin with nothing usually end in


(4) Go Ahead: This is a dare, not permission. Don't Do It!


(5) Loud Sigh: This is actually a word, but is a non-verbal statement often misunderstood by denying or unobservant butches. A loud sigh means she thinks you are an idiot and wonders why she is wasting her time standing here and arguing with you about “nothing”. (Refer back to # 3 .)

(6) That's Okay: This is one of the most dangerous statement a femme can make to a butch. This means she wants to think long and hard before deciding how and when you will pay for your mistake. Be prepared for her interminable silence!


(7) Thanks: A femme is thanking you, do not question, or faint. Just say you're welcome. (I want to add in a clause here - This is true, unless she says 'Thanks a lot' - that is PURE sarcasm and she is not thanking you at all. DO NOT say 'you're welcome' to that as it will bring on a 'whatever').


(8) Whatever: Is a femme's way of saying F--- YOU!


(9) Don't worry about it, I got it: Another dangerous statement, meaning this is something that a femme has told you to do several times, but is now doing it herself. This will later result in a butch asking 'What's wrong? Did I do something wrong?' For the femme's response refer to # 3.



* Send this to the butches you know, to warn them about arguments they can avoid if they remember the terminology even when the femme agrees to work through disagreements, she usually means #8.



* Send this to the femmes you know to give them a good laugh, cause they know it's true!!!

[Corkey]

Originally Posted by Kobi

I can not find anywhere else to put this. So maybe it can go here. My ex sent this to me.....I think there was a subtle message in here somewhere but I chose to ignore it.

So, we can title this....you know you are Butch when you understand the following femme-isms:

1) Fine: This is the word femmes use to end an argument when they are right and you need to shut up.



(2) Five Minutes: If she is getting dressed, this means a half an hour. Five minutes is only five minutes if you have just been given five more minutes to watch the women’s basketball game before helping around the house.



(3) Nothing: This is the calm before the storm. This means something, and you should be on your toes. Arguments that begin with nothing usually end in fine.


(4) Go Ahead: This is a dare, not permission. Don't Do It!



(5) Loud Sigh: This is actually a word, but is a non-verbal statement often misunderstood by denying or unobservant butches. A loud sigh means she thinks you are an idiot and wonders why she is wasting her time standing here and arguing with you about “nothing”. (Refer back to # 3 .)



(6) That's Okay: This is one of the most dangerous statement a femme can make to a butch. This means she wants to think long and hard before deciding how and when you will pay for your mistake. Be prepared for her interminable silence!



(7) Thanks: A femme is thanking you, do not question, or faint. Just say you're welcome. (I want to add in a clause here - This is true, unless she says 'Thanks a lot' - that is PURE sarcasm and she is not thanking you at all. DO NOT say 'you're welcome' to that as it will bring on a 'whatever').



(8) Whatever: Is a femme's way of saying F--- YOU!



(9) Don't worry about it, I got it: Another dangerous statement, meaning this is something that a femme has told you to do several times, but is now doing it herself. This will later result in a butch asking 'What's wrong? Did I do something wrong?' For the femme's response refer to # 3.



* Send this to the butches you know, to warn them about arguments they can avoid if they remember the terminology even when the femme agrees to work through disagreements, she usually means #8.



* Send this to the femmes you know to give them a good laugh, cause they know it's true!!!

If this was supposed to be funny, it isn't, if it was your attempt at a joke, it failed. It is misogynistic and stereotypical. It has made it's way thru several sites, and each site has come to the same conclusion, it sucks.

[Kobi]

I apologize if I offended anyone. I thought it was cute.

[The_Lady_Snow]

Originally Posted by Kobi

I apologize if I offended anyone. I thought it was cute.

Thanks

just know that it's as cute as when someone says to a butch

you wanna be man..

cause we all know butch does not equate man, or wanting to be one.

yes?

[Down2marsboi]

Originally Posted by Darth Denkay

Thanks for the responses. And to be clear, I'm definitely not searching for the definition of butch. I'm not looking to create a one-size-fits-all box for butch. Butch is coupled with masculinity, but then what is masculinity? For that matter, what is femininity? There are certain attributes that tend to be ascribed to those words; when do those attributes cease to be true descriptors and become stereotypes? I get that butch masculinity comes from within, it's not something we put on from the outside; it is our essence.

I think my question has much broader implications than just butch identity. Let me see if I can explain what's in my head. In the world there are countless identities folks embrace. Each identity is based on some group of characteristics - not that one must meet every criteria - but enough "fit" that the identity feels comfortable. Where do these characteristics stop and stereotypes begin? How can we distinguish between the two? That's really what I'm asking, whether it be about butch identity, feminist identity, scientist identity, or artist identity. Make sense?

Yes, I AGREE that ones BUTCH SELF is not only EMcompassed by CHARACTERISTICS but most IMPORTANTLY by ones OWN sense of butchness...your INTERNAL ESSENCE meter so to SPEAK. I FEEL that characteristics BECOME STEROTYPES when people start to BELIEVE that you are a way SIMPLY become you possess a characteric that COMMONLY is associated with a way of BEING. Butchness to me is INTERNAL...Masculinity, Crewcuts, Male SWAGGER, jeans, aggression, etc...are some characterisics usually associated with Butchness from ole school means...this is what the WORLD saw as being a DIfferent essence, back in the day and has STUCK...as people who SELF PROCLAIM as being butch...and all the different energies and appearance become more PREVALENT...then to SHALL the steroyypes I think BEGAN to FALL.

[Beau]

Originally Posted by Darth Denkay

I think my question has much broader implications than just butch identity. Let me see if I can explain what's in my head. In the world there are countless identities folks embrace. Each identity is based on some group of characteristics - not that one must meet every criteria - but enough "fit" that the identity feels comfortable. Where do these characteristics stop and stereotypes begin? How can we distinguish between the two?

I am sick to death of gender identity discussions, but your question is salient and worth considering.

My answer:
Stereotypes begin at the moment a person's perceptions, narrow-mindedness, or ignorance is used to define others without the inclusion of the possibilities, beliefs, or experiences that supersede such definitions.

[Queerasfck]

I think it's my deodorant.

[AtLast]

Take a look at these definitions of the term butch....

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/butch

Interesting in terms of the discussion, especially stereotyping... There has to be other definitions from a queer perspective somewhere.... ????

[KayCee]

Originally Posted by Kobi

I apologize if I offended anyone. I thought it was cute.

Being a 'femme' I didn't find it whether disrespectful nor disgraceful. I thought it was quite funny. Thanks Kobi, Kam and I had some good laughs!

[Cowboi]

I think.....therefore I am.....

[The_Lady_Snow]

Originally Posted by kat6071

Being a 'femme' I didn't find it whether disrespectful nor disgraceful. I thought it was quite funny. Thanks Kobi, Kam and I had some good laughs!

I believe I am femme as well, and *I* personally do not find it funny or cutesey to be put in that kind of light nor do I fit that particular stereotype of femme.

I tend to get upset when it comes to my gender and how someone assumes it is portrayed...

[Hack]

Something about this thread disturbs me. It's not the intent of the thread, so no disrespect toward Darth, who started this thread.

I think it's just that I find identity - yours, mine and whoever's - to be a very personal thing. How I got to where I am today was a journey, sometimes a battle, and most definitely an evolution. I am sure that is true for nearly everyone, no matter who you are.

I have a sign in my office that says, "I look forward to the day when I no longer have to explain anything." It pertains to my job, really, but I also feel that way about my identity both in and outside of this community.

For me, it's always more interesting to listen to people tell their stories about how they came to be the person they are -- the experiences that shaped them, or the upbringing they had.

Just my thoughts.

Jake

[apretty]

Originally Posted by EzeeTiger

I think it's my deodorant.

old spice swagger?

[Mister Bent]

I only came in here to see what makes apretty butch.

[AtLast]

Originally Posted by Hack

Something about this thread disturbs me. It's not the intent of the thread, so no disrespect toward Darth, who started this thread.

I think it's just that I find identity - yours, mine and whoever's - to be a very personal thing. How I got to where I am today was a journey, sometimes a battle, and most definitely an evolution. I am sure that is true for nearly everyone, no matter who you are.

I have a sign in my office that says, "I look forward to the day when I no longer have to explain anything." It pertains to my job, really, but I also feel that way about my identity both in and outside of this community.

For me, it's always more interesting to listen to people tell their stories about how they came to be the person they are -- the experiences that shaped them, or the upbringing they had.

Just my thoughts.

Jake

Wouldn't it be great to be there! Just the whole notion of your own personal being... just being without any questions, from anyone. No explanations needed because there isn't a thing that is odd or different needing explanation because we have finally gone beyond stereotypes completely and traditional gender identification. Everyone is represented other than in documentaries that are mainly viewed by this community. No traditional characterizations and expectations begining at birth...

Thinking of John Lennon's Imagine...