Being female within Butch

[BullDog]

Originally Posted by cathexis

Need a little advice, please.
Have facial hair (light red chin, moustache, and side burns), just moved to a small closeted town in the NY North Country, and not the tallest womon on Earth (4'10"). Am usually not able to project tons of confidence (tend to walk more like prey).
After the backstory, would you feel comfortable letting your facial hair grow out in this situation?
Lover is one of THOSE fabulous Alpha Butches that light up a room with their energy when entering, but don't want Her feeling obligated to defend me...She would!

In my experience getting harassed for looking butch/masculine female is totally random. Some places where I would think I would I haven't, and other so-called liberal places I have.

I do have a mustache and the only time I have been directly harassed for that was in Los Angeles. I have mostly lived in liberal places but have also lived in Tennessee and now in a very small town in New Mexico and haven't experienced any problems. So for me, it seems totally random.

For me, if I got rid of my mustache I would still look butch so I don't think it would make me any safer from attacks. Facial hair on a female might freak some people out more but I would think in most cases it wouldn't make a big difference if you already look like a masculine female to begin with.

In really small towns (population of 800 people where I am at), people don't really have much room to hide if they are rude to someone. You are going to see the same people at the post office, the gas station, the convenience store over and over again, and I do find most people friendly.

I would say get a feel for the town and think about how much it means to you. I personally like having my mustache and don't plan to get rid of it, but if I was constantly getting harassed or felt uncomfortable I would consider it.

[Ascot]

I don't have any experience shaving facial hair, but by all accounts, it seems to make it more noticeable, particularly when it's growing out again. If downplaying its visibility is the concern, maybe bleaching it is a viable option? I joke about having a bit of a 'stache, but it's soft and light in color.

[cathexis]

Originally Posted by BullDog

In my experience getting harassed for looking butch/masculine female is totally random. Some places where I would think I would I haven't, and other so-called liberal places I have.

I do have a mustache and the only time I have been directly harassed for that was in Los Angeles. I have mostly lived in liberal places but have also lived in Tennessee and now in a very small town in New Mexico and haven't experienced any problems. So for me, it seems totally random.

For me, if I got rid of my mustache I would still look butch so I don't think it would make me any safer from attacks. Facial hair on a female might freak some people out more but I would think in most cases it wouldn't make a big difference if you already look like a masculine female to begin with.

In really small towns (population of 800 people where I am at), people don't really have much room to hide if they are rude to someone. You are going to see the same people at the post office, the gas station, the convenience store over and over again, and I do find most people friendly.

I would say get a feel for the town and think about how much it means to you. I personally like having my mustache and don't plan to get rid of it, but if I was constantly getting harassed or felt uncomfortable I would consider it.

A hairy update.lol

Chose to leave it be, but as it gets longer i'll trim and shave
areas.

Plan to create a handlebar 'stache if all goes well, and it should

when i talk the new doctor into putting me back on T (was on for several

years - stopped a few years ago with a doc change r/t move).

Thanx to all for advice and encouragement!!!

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^cathexis^^^^^^^^^ ^^^

[BullDog]

Thanks for your hairy update!

Sounds good, especially the handlebar 'stache which is very cool. I hope your new town is treating you well and definitely keep us updated!.

Speaking of small towns and hair, I can't wait to go visit my friend in Albuquerque so I can get my haircut. We don't have much in the way of barbers here. Thank goodness for ball caps because I am really shaggy right now!

Originally Posted by cathexis

A hairy update.lol

Chose to leave it be, but as it gets longer i'll trim and shave
areas.

Plan to create a handlebar 'stache if all goes well, and it should

when i talk the new doctor into putting me back on T (was on for several

years - stopped a few years ago with a doc change r/t move).

Thanx to all for advice and encouragement!!!

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^cathexis^^^^^^^^^ ^^^

[cathexis]

Originally Posted by BullDog

Thanks for your hairy update!

Sounds good, especially the handlebar 'stache which is very cool. I hope your new town is treating you well and definitely keep us updated!.

Speaking of small towns and hair, I can't wait to go visit my friend in Albuquerque so I can get my haircut. We don't have much in the way of barbers here. Thank goodness for ball caps because I am really shaggy right now!

Lived in New Mexico total of about 15 years of which 10 were in Albuq. Love

that city...looking West to Mt. Taylor...East to the Sandias...North, the

Sangria de Christos. Such beauty...low humidity...hot springs.

Will return in the next couple years.

Agree about small towns and haircuts, went to a unisex cutter 3 weeks ago.

Clueless about what i wanted, she said "you DON'T want something

feminine??!!!!! She said this as the clippers were gracing the sideburns.

Stood up shouting "AAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHH" 'bout causing the clippers

to fall to the floor. No, no sideburns or nape of neck!

Maybe i'll invest in a trip to NYC for grooming...a bit traumatized so i get it

TOTALLY.

[Ascot]

I read an interesting article the other day, written by a gay man who identifies as Femme. I confess, even as my gender is Butch, I've never really given much thought to what it must be like on the other side. As many have stated in this thread and elsewhere, it can be tough being a masculine of center female out and about in the world. Still, I think for the most part, it is easier to be a masculinely presenting woman than it is a femininely presenting man. That's fucked up. It is yet another vile example of how things female/feminine/girly/whatever other adjective you want to insert are devalued because of their inherent nature. This might not even be really the right place for it, but it has been on my mind so I'm putting it out there.

[Cin]

Originally Posted by Ascot

I think for the most part, it is easier to be a masculinely presenting woman than it is a femininely presenting man.

Maybe yes, maybe no. Who can really measure such things. I know that feminine men are despised. I know that masculine women are despised. I think if we are talking "for the most part" masculine women are persona non grata. You can find much loved feminine male characters on TV or in the movies. Not so much for masculine women. I can't think of one really. Lesbian sure, but a masculine woman? Never seen it happen (with one exception being perhaps Lea Delaria.) Masculinity is heavily policed so masculine women are not easily tolerated. I'm not saying feminine men have it easy. I am just responding to the idea that feminine men have a more difficult time with society as a whole/in general than masculine women. Check the earning potential of a feminine man next to a masculine woman. At then end of the day, a butch woman is still a woman and is valued by a patriarchal society accordingly. And a woman seen as trying to break into the masculinity club (even though that is not what butch is about, it is just how it is interpreted by a binary gender obsessed society,) is about as welcome as a woman trying to get ahead in a field protected by the old boys club or even the young boys club (see gamergate).