Olivia Cruisers? Carribean Sun Cruise October 30th

The_Lady_Snow · 09-07-2010, 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MysticOceansFL

It's not that I have money to burn but I'm not going to make my choices of where I want to enjoy my vacation do to someone not being able to go on the Olivia Cruise If you have a problem or a situation with the cruise line then choose and pick another one and friendships shouldn't be based on what or where someone goes anyways! I get the impression that most of people are trying to "play" the you pick them we"ll not be friends with you, because of your choices" and that tells me that you never really were friends to begin with now was ya?

This is kinda ridiculous, to assume that people are posting their opinions so that all their friends follow like sheeple and not go on a vacation if that is what they wanted to do.

If (insert name) decided tomorrow that she was going on and Olivia Cruise, I would be like

I would more than likely talk to her about it, and our friendship would change since she is supporting a place I do not for it's policies. I don't know to what degree it would change but I am pretty positive that I would not just kick her to the curb without having some kind of dialogue.

Once again I find it odd that you are reading some subliminal message that is saying if pick a side or you are out the club.

Really odd.

PS

Can someone PLEASE point out the phobia, inclusion/exclusion ism's comments?????? PLEASE

suebee · 09-07-2010, 12:55 PM

I've been shaking my head since I saw this thread yesterday. Mountainstar has had her thread good and throughly hijacked. I believe it was intended to be about the cruise - maybe about other vacations. But between issues with Olivia and issues with the cruise ship industry in general I think we've managed to sour something that was light and fun for her - especially in light of what the cruise meant to her.

I guess it's too late to suggest that another thread might be a better place to sound off on the issues that are being brought up, but I just felt compelled to put in my two cents worth.

I hope you enjoy yourself MS.

Sue

SuperFemme · 09-07-2010, 01:03 PM

Right. The thread was hijacked by the horrible people who WERE discussing cruises.

Oh wait. What is being said is that it's only discussing if it shits glitter and sunshine.

Of course we want Mountain to have a good cruise, and it wasn't in the OP that it was shared what it meant to HER on a very PERSONAL level. Ironically, as a person with terminal cancer AND a spouse named Cal, I can totally say that if I were in her shoes I'd probably be doing exactly what she is doing.

Not liking Olivia Cruises or cruises in general that are not environmentally friendly does NOT mean that there are ill wishes towards the OP.

I swear.

suebee · 09-07-2010, 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SuperFemme

Right. The thread was hijacked by the horrible people who WERE discussing cruises.

Oh wait. What is being said is that it's only discussing if it shits glitter and sunshine.

Of course we want Mountain to have a good cruise, and it wasn't in the OP that it was shared what it meant to HER on a very PERSONAL level. Ironically, as a person with terminal cancer AND a spouse named Cal, I can totally say that if I were in her shoes I'd probably be doing exactly what she is doing.

Not liking Olivia Cruises or cruises in general that are not environmentally friendly does NOT mean that there are ill wishes towards the OP.

I swear.

I agree with everything you're saying - except about shitting glitter. Never WAS able to do that.

Usually we ask that a thread stay on topic, and that another thread be started if a splinter issue comes up. But thanks for answering.

Sue

BullDog · 09-07-2010, 02:47 PM

I do understand that having a butch femme group event on a lesbian cruise is totally inappropriate because not all butch femme community members are lesbians.

For people going on vacations on an individual basis with their spouses, significant others or friends that are not lesbians they would choose a different type of vacation. I totally get that. Or you may be a lesbian who just doesn't want to be stuck on a ship with thousands of other lesbians. Or you don't like cruises for environmental or other reasons. I totally get that.

If lesbian transwomen are discriminated against I think that is wrong. They are lesbians and women too and of course should be included. I do support the need and desire for having women's only space. I do not support any organization that excludes transwomen from their definition of women's space.

I also think it's wrong for anyone to be treated rudely at the docks or anywhere else.

What I don't understand is people seem to be upset that Olivia Cruises is geared towards lesbians and that it isn't inclusive? I don't think it was set up so they could say x, y and z can't go. It was set up for lesbians to have vacations geared for them. There's nothing on their website talking about who can't go. It talks about being a lesbian owned travel business that sets up vacations for lesbians.

There are lots of vacation businesses and packages that are geared towards gay men. I have never been offended that they aren't geared for me. I am not interested in buying a vacation package to go on a cruise or other type of vacation geared towards gay men. I hope they have a great time.

Are people saying its wrong that all queers are not included? Why can't a travel business set up vacations aimed for lesbians? Or for gay men? Is there a different between Olivia Cruises and some travel business geared towards gay men? I genuinely am puzzled. If people wanted to have a butch femme vacation business I think that would be great and a queer vacation business for every single type of queer person would be great too. However, I don't think every single travel or other business needs to be geared towards every single type of queer person.

My other question is do people who are not lesbians really want to go on vacations geared towards lesbians?

I totally understand everyone can make their choices about where and who they want to vacation with and how they spend their money. I am not understanding why setting up vacations where lesbians are the target audience is wrong.

SuperFemme · 09-07-2010, 02:50 PM

Newsflash: There are many, many LESBIANS who are partnered with transfolk.

BullDog · 09-07-2010, 02:52 PM

Yes I am very well aware of that. I said that in my post.

Gayla · 09-07-2010, 03:09 PM

What people are saying is that we each have an individual choice as to whether we support Olivia by attending their events and giving them our money.

Right now, where I'm at in my life today, I can't imagine spending any amount of time on a boat full of 3,000 lesbians. That's not some place that I would be comfortable. It doesn't sound like fun. Throw me on a boat full of 3,000 gay men, I'd probably have much more fun.

Olivia has the "right" to do whatever they want in the way they structure their business and who they choose to cater to in the same way that I get to decide who I support monetarily. In the past, I did support Olivia and give them quite a bit of my money. That was back when they were a women's music company and not a cruise line.

There seems to be some type of underlying insinuation that we should all support Olivia because they are a woman-owned / lesbian-owned business and that we are somehow "bad lesbians" or anti-lesbian or lesbiphobic if we don't.

BullDog · 09-07-2010, 03:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gayla

What people are saying is that we each have an individual choice as to whether we support Olivia by attending their events and giving them our money.

Right now, where I'm at in my life today, I can't imagine spending any amount of time on a boat full of 3,000 lesbians. That's not some place that I would be comfortable. It doesn't sound like fun. Throw me on a boat full of 3,000 gay men, I'd probably have much more fun.

Olivia has the "right" to do whatever they want in the way they structure their business and who they choose to cater to in the same way that I get to decide who I support monetarily. In the past, I did support Olivia and give them quite a bit of my money. That was back when they were a women's music company and not a cruise line.

There seems to be some type of underlying insinuation that we should all support Olivia because they are a woman-owned / lesbian-owned business and that we are somehow "bad lesbians" or anti-lesbian or lesbiphobic if we don't.

I personally am not insinuating anything. I have a genuine question.

naturlover_52 · 09-07-2010, 04:17 PM

[QUOTE=gayla;187445]What people are saying is that we each have an individual choice as to whether we support Olivia by attending their events and giving them our money.
Right now, where I'm at in my life today, I can't imagine spending any amount of time on a boat full of 3,000 lesbians. That's not some place that I would be comfortable. It doesn't sound like fun. Throw me on a boat full of 3,000 gay men, I'd probably have much more fun.

I would have to Agree w/ Gayla...About NOT wanting to be on a boat w/ 3,000 lesbians....BUT for me I just am NOT a cruise type person....lesbian OR Straight. I lived in Alaska for 7 years in Fairbanks and saw the people being carted around like Cattle....I would have to agree w/ the rest of those that have posted about Olivia being Unaccommodating to ALL of the Community.

I am NOT a follower SOOO I don't go by what MY friends are doing or as support.....I do it because of the fact that like ANOTHER member stated....I don't support ANY kind of ISM....BE it be Sexuality based, gender based or race based.

and as to what Snow said....Then it somehow translated into anti lesbian craziness.
It happens A LOT if trans issues are discussed by the same group of peeps.

ONLY one person wanted this thread moved because of the fact that is was ANTIlesbian...and ADMIN spoke to her.

I have been following this post ALL the way along...I agree that Olivia is a business and HAS their right to do business how they want....I would rather GO to Alaska Via Ferry w/ friends gay, straight, trans...JUST because there is MORE freedom to DO what U want....travel where U want....and NOT have to follow the rules of a COMPANY. If I was gonna drop money like this ON a vacation it would be to go to like Hawaii to the BIG island...and maybe go to a GENERAL Gay....area....by gay....I mean the Community as a whole.

Thanks

09-07-2010, 12:55 PM	#2
suebee Member How Do You Identify?: TOWANDA! Preferred Pronoun?: Queen Bee Relationship Status: Good 'n married. Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Eastern Canada. But if I make a wrong turn at the lights I get stopped by a border guard. Posts: 1,499 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 2,355 Thanked 2,756 Times in 820 Posts Rep Power: 16450093	I've been shaking my head since I saw this thread yesterday. Mountainstar has had her thread good and throughly hijacked. I believe it was intended to be about the cruise - maybe about other vacations. But between issues with Olivia and issues with the cruise ship industry in general I think we've managed to sour something that was light and fun for her - especially in light of what the cruise meant to her. I guess it's too late to suggest that another thread might be a better place to sound off on the issues that are being brought up, but I just felt compelled to put in my two cents worth. I hope you enjoy yourself MS. Sue __________________ "Compassion, in which all ethics must take root, can only attain its full breadth and depth if it embraces all living creatures and does not limit itself to mankind." -Albert Schweitzer

09-07-2010, 02:47 PM	#5
BullDog Infamous Member How Do You Identify?: Dominant Stone Butch Daddy Preferred Pronoun?: She Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: In A Healing Place Posts: 5,371 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 18,160 Thanked 22,640 Times in 4,463 Posts Rep Power: 21474857	I do understand that having a butch femme group event on a lesbian cruise is totally inappropriate because not all butch femme community members are lesbians. For people going on vacations on an individual basis with their spouses, significant others or friends that are not lesbians they would choose a different type of vacation. I totally get that. Or you may be a lesbian who just doesn't want to be stuck on a ship with thousands of other lesbians. Or you don't like cruises for environmental or other reasons. I totally get that. If lesbian transwomen are discriminated against I think that is wrong. They are lesbians and women too and of course should be included. I do support the need and desire for having women's only space. I do not support any organization that excludes transwomen from their definition of women's space. I also think it's wrong for anyone to be treated rudely at the docks or anywhere else. What I don't understand is people seem to be upset that Olivia Cruises is geared towards lesbians and that it isn't inclusive? I don't think it was set up so they could say x, y and z can't go. It was set up for lesbians to have vacations geared for them. There's nothing on their website talking about who can't go. It talks about being a lesbian owned travel business that sets up vacations for lesbians. There are lots of vacation businesses and packages that are geared towards gay men. I have never been offended that they aren't geared for me. I am not interested in buying a vacation package to go on a cruise or other type of vacation geared towards gay men. I hope they have a great time. Are people saying its wrong that all queers are not included? Why can't a travel business set up vacations aimed for lesbians? Or for gay men? Is there a different between Olivia Cruises and some travel business geared towards gay men? I genuinely am puzzled. If people wanted to have a butch femme vacation business I think that would be great and a queer vacation business for every single type of queer person would be great too. However, I don't think every single travel or other business needs to be geared towards every single type of queer person. My other question is do people who are not lesbians really want to go on vacations geared towards lesbians? I totally understand everyone can make their choices about where and who they want to vacation with and how they spend their money. I am not understanding why setting up vacations where lesbians are the target audience is wrong. __________________ Love consists in this, that two solitudes protect and touch and greet each other. - Rainer Maria Rilke

09-07-2010, 02:52 PM	#7
BullDog Infamous Member How Do You Identify?: Dominant Stone Butch Daddy Preferred Pronoun?: She Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: In A Healing Place Posts: 5,371 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 18,160 Thanked 22,640 Times in 4,463 Posts Rep Power: 21474857	Yes I am very well aware of that. I said that in my post. __________________ Love consists in this, that two solitudes protect and touch and greet each other. - Rainer Maria Rilke

09-07-2010, 01:03 PM	#3
SuperFemme Timed Out How Do You Identify?: Permanently Banned 10/24/2010 Preferred Pronoun?: She. Relationship Status: Married (one of 18,000) Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Atascadero, CA Posts: 4,933 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 2,309 Thanked 7,108 Times in 2,327 Posts Rep Power: 0	Right. The thread was hijacked by the horrible people who WERE discussing cruises. Oh wait. What is being said is that it's only discussing if it shits glitter and sunshine. Of course we want Mountain to have a good cruise, and it wasn't in the OP that it was shared what it meant to HER on a very PERSONAL level. Ironically, as a person with terminal cancer AND a spouse named Cal, I can totally say that if I were in her shoes I'd probably be doing exactly what she is doing. Not liking Olivia Cruises or cruises in general that are not environmentally friendly does NOT mean that there are ill wishes towards the OP. I swear.

09-07-2010, 02:50 PM	#6
SuperFemme Timed Out How Do You Identify?: Permanently Banned 10/24/2010 Preferred Pronoun?: She. Relationship Status: Married (one of 18,000) Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Atascadero, CA Posts: 4,933 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 2,309 Thanked 7,108 Times in 2,327 Posts Rep Power: 0	Newsflash: There are many, many LESBIANS who are partnered with transfolk.

09-07-2010, 03:09 PM	#8
Gayla Timed Out How Do You Identify?: Kinky Butch Top Preferred Pronoun?: I'm not picky Relationship Status: She makes me dance like a fool and forget how to breathe. Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: SF CA Posts: 3,229 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 877 Thanked 7,077 Times in 1,966 Posts Rep Power: 0	What people are saying is that we each have an individual choice as to whether we support Olivia by attending their events and giving them our money. Right now, where I'm at in my life today, I can't imagine spending any amount of time on a boat full of 3,000 lesbians. That's not some place that I would be comfortable. It doesn't sound like fun. Throw me on a boat full of 3,000 gay men, I'd probably have much more fun. Olivia has the "right" to do whatever they want in the way they structure their business and who they choose to cater to in the same way that I get to decide who I support monetarily. In the past, I did support Olivia and give them quite a bit of my money. That was back when they were a women's music company and not a cruise line. There seems to be some type of underlying insinuation that we should all support Olivia because they are a woman-owned / lesbian-owned business and that we are somehow "bad lesbians" or anti-lesbian or lesbiphobic if we don't.

09-07-2010, 04:17 PM	#10
naturlover_52 Member How Do You Identify?: soft butch/bi Preferred Pronoun?: she and her are just fine....Sweetcheeks hey you Relationship Status: seeing someone long distance but soon will be both in Ca love her very much Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: So Calif East San Gabrielle Valley aka the land of shake and bake Posts: 108 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 85 Thanked 89 Times in 44 Posts Rep Power: 3426	[QUOTE=gayla;187445]What people are saying is that we each have an individual choice as to whether we support Olivia by attending their events and giving them our money. Right now, where I'm at in my life today, I can't imagine spending any amount of time on a boat full of 3,000 lesbians. That's not some place that I would be comfortable. It doesn't sound like fun. Throw me on a boat full of 3,000 gay men, I'd probably have much more fun. I would have to Agree w/ Gayla...About NOT wanting to be on a boat w/ 3,000 lesbians....BUT for me I just am NOT a cruise type person....lesbian OR Straight. I lived in Alaska for 7 years in Fairbanks and saw the people being carted around like Cattle....I would have to agree w/ the rest of those that have posted about Olivia being Unaccommodating to ALL of the Community. I am NOT a follower SOOO I don't go by what MY friends are doing or as support.....I do it because of the fact that like ANOTHER member stated....I don't support ANY kind of ISM....BE it be Sexuality based, gender based or race based. and as to what Snow said....Then it somehow translated into anti lesbian craziness. It happens A LOT if trans issues are discussed by the same group of peeps. ONLY one person wanted this thread moved because of the fact that is was ANTIlesbian...and ADMIN spoke to her. I have been following this post ALL the way along...I agree that Olivia is a business and HAS their right to do business how they want....I would rather GO to Alaska Via Ferry w/ friends gay, straight, trans...JUST because there is MORE freedom to DO what U want....travel where U want....and NOT have to follow the rules of a COMPANY. If I was gonna drop money like this ON a vacation it would be to go to like Hawaii to the BIG island...and maybe go to a GENERAL Gay....area....by gay....I mean the Community as a whole. Thanks