It's Time to Boycott Arizona

[DomnNC]

"I get it that the Arizonans don't want any of these things to happen to their state. I fully understand that. However, it makes no sense to suggest that those either targeted by this law or horrified by it simply shrug our collective shoulders in order to avoid hurting someone's feelings."

So am I to assume that since you are so horrified by it and any other person who is horrified by it that does NOT live in Arizona are going to leave the comfy confines of their homes where this isn't an issue, move to Arizona and start a grass roots movement to get Brewer and her cronies tossed from office in the next election?

We can all raise our collective voices and scream at the injustice of it from whatever state we live in, does it do any good? NO, because the people in Arizona were elected by the majority and they will be in office until they are ousted on their rear ends by the said same collective majority!

And no, the comments here have not been "bend over backwards" to ensure that the posters from Arizona have not made to feel like they are being targeted by these posts.
Cody stated he didn't vote for Brewer, some took exception to some of his terminology, Cody even stated he was half Native-American with blue eyes. Another poster implied with their post that he was lying about it. Did I see you as a moderator take that person to task, did another moderator step in and say, whoa wait a minute, that was a little unjust and unfair? NO that was not done, what was done was more criticism was hurled his way because of wording that he used even after he stated time and again that he wasn't a supporter of this policy, so much so to the point that he just disengaged altogether. What if he was a supporter, the amount of criticism heaped upon him lost him from the discussion when something could have been said to persuade him to change his vote at the poll in the next election was lost. That is never a good thing.
He mentioned "the look" and was taken to task for using those words, forgive me but isn't racial profiling all about "a look". If they look to be Hispanic, black, purple, yellow, green whathave you what racial profiling is all about? It was completely unnecessary as far as I'm concerned.

People seem to forget that during these economic hard times that some people cannot afford television, radios, newspapers, or treks into a nearby larger city where one may learn of political activism and what is going on in their own back yard. Not all people are as educated as you, as I, as the person to your left or to your right, that does not give us the right to take an air of superiority over any one when there is a discussion going on. And yes, that is the road this discussion is taking, making some feel less than when there is no need for that when they have stated they did NOT vote for these idiots and they refuse to have their feet held to the fire with the majority who did.

Please, keep the topic to the current situation, I'm fully aware of past atrocities of people before my time and your time. It just muddles, confuses and blurs the lines of the current situation.

So if those that are so indignant and horrified about the situation perhaps as I said you should pack up the comfy confines of your current home, move to Arizona and start a grass roots effort to oust the current political regime, however you should be prepared to move to the other 22 states who are NOW also considering adopting legislation similiar to Arizona's to deal with the influx of illegal immigrants.

I don't know what the answer is and I'm pretty sure you don't either, no one does, otherwise the situation would have already been corrected. I do know that bankrupting a state is not the answer, it only creates a whole host of other issues.

I've had my say about when now, all I did was happen upon the thread and was kinda taken aback by some of the commentary directed towards other members of this site and misinterpretation of a post.

[apretty]

wtf, mexicans didn't bankrupt the state.

and that was pretty much me blowing my entire load--i don't really have a lot of energy/extra time to argue over blatant racism (which you know, as i write that statement--sounds pretty fucking privileged of me to 'opt out' and i am owning that, this conversation makes me tired.)

[The_Lady_Snow]

There are NO green, purple, or pink people targeted by this heinous law.

I as a traveler in Az had to lie (left my purse in SD) about my status in this country. I used my tricks and made myself look white.

I get offend with good right when white folk describe POC with terms such as "that look"


If you are deflecting for Cody by saying he can't afford the TV he clearly haz interwebs! He could of read ALL THE FACTS posted in this thread


How one can live in denial I can't understand, wait I
can. White skin gives one privileges I'll never get

True story

[Corkey]

Did you know that other states are looking at SB1070 as a template for enacting this racist law? No? Well the state I live in is and so is Texas and New Jersey. It has nothing to do with the boarder being secure, it is racism pure and simple. So I will rail against it in AZ in PA in TX in NJ and any other state that even thinks this is a good idea. It isn't it is RACISM.

[Greyson]

Originally Posted by Corkey

Did you know that other states are looking at SB1070 as a template for enacting this racist law? No? Well the state I live in is and so is Texas and New Jersey. It has nothing to do with the boarder being secure, it is racism pure and simple. So I will rail against it in AZ in PA in TX in NJ and any other state that even thinks this is a good idea. It isn't it is RACISM.

Right now in California there is a petition being circulated state wide to gather enough signatures to put a California version of SB1070 on the ballot in the next election cycle.

[Novelafemme]

Originally Posted by Greyson

Right now in California there is a petition being circulated state wide to gather enough signature to put a California version of SB1070 on the ballot in the next election cycle.

What do you think the outcome will be, Grey?

[Greyson]

Originally Posted by Novelafemme

What do you think the outcome will be, Grey?

I think enough signatures will be collected to get it on the ballot. I don't think it will pass, but it will not be by a resounding landslide.

AJ does an excellent job in spelling it out succiently, IMO. Are we willing to give up some of our artificially low cost services and goods here in the USA?

Most of you know I am a Mexican American and I have lived in California since the age of two. This entire immigratrion thing is complex and much of it grounded in preconceived racist notions. On the other side of the coin is Mexico's long history of ignoring the basic needs of it's people. Of course this does not include their wealthy.

(Actually, the States is becoming more and more like this. Huge economic disparity between the working folks and the very rich.)

Back to California. Right now the State of California has an incoming Democratic Gov, Assembly and State Democrat majority, all state constitutional officers Democractic and two Democratic Federal Senators. I really do not hold out for much even with this. I think as the world moves forward we are creating a new paradigm. I just hope globally, nationally and locally, more will choose the high road as oppossed to greed and short sightedness.

[betenoire]

Originally Posted by DomnNC

Please, keep the topic to the current situation, I'm fully aware of past atrocities of people before my time and your time. It just muddles, confuses and blurs the lines of the current situation.

"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."

It's BEYOND silly to refuse to look at the parallels, here.

[DomnNC]

These are the 22 states considering or drafting legislation similar to Arizona's.

Alabama, Arkansas, Colorado, Florida, Idaho, Indiana, Maryland, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri, Nebraska, Nevada, New Jersey, North Carolina, Ohio, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas and Utah.

Let me amend this as I was not deflecting for Cody but responding to numerous comments made about "ignorant voters":

People seem to forget that during these economic hard times that some people cannot afford television, radios, newspapers, INTERNET ACCESS, COMPUTERS, or treks into a nearby larger city where one may learn of political activism and what is going on in their own back yard.

[Novelafemme]

Canada is looking better and better all the time! Seriously!!

My brain is mush and I have a huge paper looming...love and hugs, all

[The_Lady_Snow]

It's a pretty hot topic, even without alll those things, convos happen. Public libraries were my education for YEARS. I did not own a computer till 2000, television 2002.

Public libraries, standing around listening to peers if one hears something THIS alarming I would think people would research it or shrug it off.

One is easier than the other. Unless of course it affects you or your people directly.

[dreadgeek]

Originally Posted by DomnNC

These are the 22 states considering or drafting legislation similar to Arizona's.

Alabama, Arkansas, Colorado, Florida, Idaho, Indiana, Maryland, Michigan, Minnesota, Missouri, Nebraska, Nevada, New Jersey, North Carolina, Ohio, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, South Carolina, Tennessee, Texas and Utah.

Let me amend this as I was not deflecting for Cody but responding to numerous comments made about "ignorant voters":

People seem to forget that during these economic hard times that some people cannot afford television, radios, newspapers, INTERNET ACCESS, COMPUTERS, or treks into a nearby larger city where one may learn of political activism and what is going on in their own back yard.

Actually, beyond all these you list above I am MOST concerned that there are people in the US Congress who are seriously talking about trying to repeal the 14th Amendment. That, quite honestly, would be my breaking point. If the 14 is repealed or seriously changed, I'm gone because the ONLY thing that puts my mind at ease as I watch my country head down the track toward barbarism are the 1st and 14th Amendments.

As far as the argument re: access to information. I don't buy it. There are public libraries with newspapers and Internet access. Radios are cheap--it doesn't have to be an expensive radio. Most larger cities have free newspapers. One can go to a neighbor and say "hey, when you're done with your daily paper can I have it so I can look for a job and keep up on the world?" There are countless Americans who couldn't name three Supreme Court Justices, either of their Senators, a single representative from their state, their governor or their mayor but I guarantee you that they could tell you absolutely minute detail every last doing of some Kardashian sister or Snooki or 'the Situation' or Lindsay Lohan or what Bristol Palin wore on Dancing with the Stars. There are people living in genuine, honest-to-goodness Third World countries who will find some way to stay informed while we Americans, awash in a sea of information, will go out of our way to be blissfully, blindingly ignorant.

Now, I learned a different ethic growing up. I was taught that as a black American it was incumbent upon me to be aware of the issues of the day. "Ignorance is a luxury for white people, we negroes can't afford it" is something my mother would say to us on a regular basis (and yes, she used the term negroes because that's the term she grew up with).

And you know, I have to say that this pretense we Americans are in love with that there is no substantive difference between someone who knows about a subject and someone who doesn't is nothing short of madness.

If someone believes that global climate change isn't happening, they're wrong. It's not that they have a different opinion, they're simply *wrong*. If someone believes that Iraq had WMD in March of 2003 or had an active nuclear weapons program, they're wrong. Again, not a difference of opinion, just plain out wrong. If someone believes that evolution didn't happen or that there is some controversy within biology such that working biologists think creationism should be taught in public schools, they're wrong. If someone believes that gays and lesbians are more likely to be child molesters, or are more likely to have kids with social pathologies, they are wrong. Not holding a different opinion but demonstrably wrong in an empirically verifiable fashion.

There really ARE people who really ARE ignorant--willfully, deliberately, ignorant. Not uninformed--my granddaughter is uninformed on a whole raft of subjects but she's three. I'm talking about people who are ignorant, who hold forth on subjects expressing their opinions as if they were facts and then get bent out of shape when it is pointed out to them that their facts are entirely wrong. That is ignorance and ignorance is not something we should encourage or suffer lightly or long. Some of these ignorant people vote. I'm not saying they shouldn't have the *right* to vote but it's a mistake to pretend that an informed voter and an uninformed voter are doing the same thing--they aren't.

Cheers
Aj

[dreadgeek]

Originally Posted by Greyson

Right now in California there is a petition being circulated state wide to gather enough signature to put a California version of SB1070 on the ballot in the next election cycle.

The Republican Party is just *determined* to immolate itself in California aren't they? Don't they get it? I'm reminded--in the fractally strange way my mind works--of an old Frantics skit called Tai Kwan Leep. At one point the sensei, who has just given an obnoxious student Ed Gruberman a 'boot to the head', is challenged by another student and asks "have you learned nothing from the lesson of Ed Gruberman"?

In this instance, Ed Gruberman is the Republican party of California and the boot to the head is the results of the midterm elections.

Because the President and the Congress are Democratic the Republicans should have done well--it's what typically happens and despite all the breathless crowing about tidal waves and never before has any sitting President lost seats in a midterm, the fact is that what happened earlier this month was pretty much in line with what has generally happened--the party of the President loses seats. Except in California.

Governor? Went to a Dem. Senatorial race? Went to the Dem. Attorney General? Went to the Dem. House races? Largely won by Dems. Hell, the Democratic party picked up seats in the California Senate! Why? Because of the Hispanic vote. Hispanics turned out in droves and voted their self-interest. They did the math, realized where the GOP wanted to go, and voted for the Dem. Same thing happened in Nevada. Harry Reid should have lost and yes, Angle was a spectacularly bad candidate but he *still* should have lost. But she ran an anti-immigrant campaign and paid the price.

The GOP seems bound and determined to make themselves a rump party. It may not happen in 2012, it could certainly happen in 2016 and by 2020 if the GOP doesn't get it that racism doesn't pay they will learn it then.

Cheers
Aj

[Nat]

Originally Posted by Corkey

Did you know that other states are looking at SB1070 as a template for enacting this racist law? No? Well the state I live in is and so is Texas and New Jersey. It has nothing to do with the boarder being secure, it is racism pure and simple. So I will rail against it in AZ in PA in TX in NJ and any other state that even thinks this is a good idea. It isn't it is RACISM.

As a Texan I am very concerned about the spread of this crap which is one of many reasons it matters so much to me that Arizona feel the negative impact of this. If it is economically and politically rewarding, it will spread like wildfire through many more states.

[asphaltcowboi]

i have ban myself from porting in this thread.. my statements were not made clear enough for several and my abilty of speach does dont comepete.. please refain from using my name on this thread or assuming what i am or may /may not have or know. i do not know you nor you me.
thanks
cody

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

There are NO green, purple, or pink people targeted by this heinous law.

I as a traveler in Az had to lie (left my purse in SD) about my status in this country. I used my tricks and made myself look white.

I get offend with good right when white folk describe POC with terms such as "that look"


If you are deflecting for Cody by saying he can't afford the TV he clearly haz interwebs! He could of read ALL THE FACTS posted in this thread


How one can live in denial I can't understand, wait I
can. White skin gives one privileges I'll never get

True story

[The_Lady_Snow]

Originally Posted by cody

i have ban myself from porting in this thread.. my statements were not made clear enough for several and my abilty of speach does dont comepete.. please refain from using my name on this thread or assuming what i am or may /may not have or know. i do not know you nor you me.
thanks
cody

Um look Cody, why not call out DNC for using your name in his post? Hence my reply using your name.

As far as your "unclear" statements, this is what is odd to me, white folks can use the most colorful descriptors when it comes to POC and then brush it off as "we" misconstrued such adjectives.

So with that said, I did not assume, YOU chose to use "that look" I stand by it was not the best choice of adjectives to describe us, why? Cause it is fucking offensive, just as offensive as "wet back" "beaners" and my favorite everyone still uses no matter how many times we asked you don't

ILLEGAL.

I am not illegal, I did not come from another planet here I came from a land where MY ancestors ( I have direct bloodlines to Pancho Villa AND can prove it) roamed freely.

So please don't wag your finger at me for your name use, at least I did not use an offensive descriptor.

Thanks