Pressurised to transition. - Page 2

PumaJ · 06-18-2011, 10:31 AM

Following this fabulous discussion has given me so much food for thought. AtLastHome, thank you for the links you provided earlier in the conversation. Wonderful articles each one filled with so many excellent points.

I watched a documentary the other evening on PBS that was part of the Independent Lens series. The documentary was about Two Spirit people. In the past I'd partnered with two Native American Butches, both of whom ID'd as Two Spirit. Neveretheless, I found the documentary to be full of information I'd not known before. I especially like the traditional view that there are more than two genders and that each gender has a role to play in the community. Two Spirits

Would that we could have such an enlightened point of view in our culture.

Something that has become more clear to me as I read and think about all that has been said, is just how very queer being a High Femme is. Speaking for myself, I can say that supporting and defending the right to be just as they are, has always been a big component of my loving masculine of center women. I'm pretty certain that that is true for all femmes who love MOC women and those who choose to transition as FTM.

AtLast · 06-18-2011, 12:56 PM

After reading Aj's last post about the friend that could have began transitioning under not very safe conditions- no medical script for T- I am wondering about ways that we all can contribute to this sort of thing not happening. As butches of every flavor, as transmen and women, as femmes of all distinctions.

Overall, with the exception of my teenage friend (back in the mid 60's in a very small mountain community with abusive parents that did kill himself), all trans and my intergendered cousin have had medical as wells as support via psychotherapy, trans support groups and organizations. Because I am an old fart, most friendships I have are with older folks- so my guess is that my running into someone struggling with transitioning that is very young probably won't happen like it might for other people here. So, I am interested in more thoughts about how to handle it when we do see situations in which peer pressure might be contributing to transitioning.

Aj's statement to her friend were not judgemental or in any way "side taking." Really great examples of how to communicate to someone something that isn't easy without making them feel "wrong."

I would love to hear from everyone on the best ways one might handle and talk to a friend about this so that they seek professional care and don't risk their health by doing something like using street T. It almost feels like it is better for these messages to come from another transperson on hormone therapy for it to sink in.

AtLast · 05-14-2011, 12:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CherylNYC

I'm really sorry this happened to you, ALH. To be honest, I've heard conversations amongst femme women in which they changed preferred pronouns to male against the expressed preferences of the butch woman they were discussing. I've also heard femmes put subtle pressure on butches to ID as male. It's not quite the same thing as pressuring a butch to transition, but I think it's on the continuum. If I witness this I never let it go. It's my nature to challenge that kind of disrespect.

The worst incidences I've witnessed of pressuring butches to transition came from a very good FTM friend of mine who has transitioned and lives his life fully as a male. I have heard him tell butch women that they should transition because T is such a great drug, or because their lives would be easier as men, etc. He's even suggested that I take T. No, he was not joking. He seems to believe that T is some kind of health tonic. We've had huge fights over this, and I've warned him not to risk losing my respect. Hopefully I've heard the last of it. We're still friends because I consider him family, but his relentless pressure against butch women has occasionally endangered his status in my life.

I've also witnessed very young people pressuring each other to transition. Because it's cool. Yes, it's true. I live in NYC where there's a subculture and plenty of information about how to obtain street T.

So, the answer is YES. It happens, and it sucks. Just like Strappie wrote, it's no different than pressuring a person to be straight.

Thank you. It really hurts to hear other butches making what they have had happen to them known. I couldn't lie about my experiences and transmen, but I see the posts and it just plain hurts.

What can we do as a community about this?

Daywalker · 05-14-2011, 01:24 PM

What can we do?

We can hold true to ourselves, and just give a nod of recognition to those
who are heading towards their life Transition...knowing that ours
has/will/may most likely play out differently.

A mutal respect of Journeys.

But the first ink-ling that stirs within you that feels the need to "keep up
with the...masculinity" ~ that needs to be examined. It is not a competition,
it's supposed to be something for others to celebrate and for their Family
and Friends to accept. Transition is a many Splendid term for what
goes on inside and outside of our minds and Spirits.

If you are competitive by nature, be careful to examine this if you
feel 'pressured' by others that are doing their best to meet their
ideals of reaching the (masculine) match
between their minds and bodies.

06-18-2011, 10:31 AM	#1
PumaJ Member How Do You Identify?: High Femme Queer Feminist Preferred Pronoun?: she, her Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Portland Metro, Oregon Posts: 200 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 1,419 Thanked 500 Times in 147 Posts Rep Power: 1652642	Following this fabulous discussion has given me so much food for thought. AtLastHome, thank you for the links you provided earlier in the conversation. Wonderful articles each one filled with so many excellent points. I watched a documentary the other evening on PBS that was part of the Independent Lens series. The documentary was about Two Spirit people. In the past I'd partnered with two Native American Butches, both of whom ID'd as Two Spirit. Neveretheless, I found the documentary to be full of information I'd not known before. I especially like the traditional view that there are more than two genders and that each gender has a role to play in the community. Two Spirits Would that we could have such an enlightened point of view in our culture. Something that has become more clear to me as I read and think about all that has been said, is just how very queer being a High Femme is. Speaking for myself, I can say that supporting and defending the right to be just as they are, has always been a big component of my loving masculine of center women. I'm pretty certain that that is true for all femmes who love MOC women and those who choose to transition as FTM. __________________ PumaJ

05-14-2011, 01:24 PM	#4
Daywalker Senior Member How Do You Identify?: Hippy Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: * Posts: 3,750 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 6,499 Thanked 11,916 Times in 2,700 Posts Rep Power: 21474855	What can we do? We can hold true to ourselves, and just give a nod of recognition to those who are heading towards their life Transition...knowing that ours has/will/may most likely play out differently. A mutal respect of Journeys. But the first ink-ling that stirs within you that feels the need to "keep up with the...masculinity" ~ that needs to be examined. It is not a competition, it's supposed to be something for others to celebrate and for their Family and Friends to accept. Transition is a many Splendid term for what goes on inside and outside of our minds and Spirits. If you are competitive by nature, be careful to examine this if you feel 'pressured' by others that are doing their best to meet their ideals of reaching the (masculine) match between their minds and bodies. __________________ www.SirDaywalker.com

06-18-2011, 12:56 PM	#2
AtLast Infamous Member How Do You Identify?: Woman Preferred Pronoun?: HER - SHE Relationship Status: Relating Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: CA & AZ I'm a Snowbird Posts: 5,408 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 11,826 Thanked 10,827 Times in 3,199 Posts Rep Power: 21474857	After reading Aj's last post about the friend that could have began transitioning under not very safe conditions- no medical script for T- I am wondering about ways that we all can contribute to this sort of thing not happening. As butches of every flavor, as transmen and women, as femmes of all distinctions. Overall, with the exception of my teenage friend (back in the mid 60's in a very small mountain community with abusive parents that did kill himself), all trans and my intergendered cousin have had medical as wells as support via psychotherapy, trans support groups and organizations. Because I am an old fart, most friendships I have are with older folks- so my guess is that my running into someone struggling with transitioning that is very young probably won't happen like it might for other people here. So, I am interested in more thoughts about how to handle it when we do see situations in which peer pressure might be contributing to transitioning. Aj's statement to her friend were not judgemental or in any way "side taking." Really great examples of how to communicate to someone something that isn't easy without making them feel "wrong." I would love to hear from everyone on the best ways one might handle and talk to a friend about this so that they seek professional care and don't risk their health by doing something like using street T. It almost feels like it is better for these messages to come from another transperson on hormone therapy for it to sink in.