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Old 10-18-2011, 12:40 AM   #341
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Disparagers scoff that participants come from a variety of backgrounds and lack focus. Do not let anyone portray cohesive diversity as inarticulate disunity. The diversity of participants is one of the strongest statements of all.

At the gym tonight, I watched two local Chicago stations give this air time. The FOX station, not surprisingly, portrayed this a protest of mostly "25 to 35 year olds." Well, I saw what I saw yesterday, and I wasn't the only person approaching a half century.

The newscast went on to offer that "many were unemployed, but some were employed." And the more FOX hopes to manipulate folks into seeing this movement as something specific to young, restless, unemployed folks, the more they continue to lose its own credibility (if that's possible).
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Old 10-18-2011, 01:09 AM   #342
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Disparagers scoff that participants come from a variety of backgrounds and lack focus. Do not let anyone portray cohesive diversity as inarticulate disunity. The diversity of participants is one of the strongest statements of all.

At the gym tonight, I watched two local Chicago stations give this air time. The FOX station, not surprisingly, portrayed this a protest of mostly "25 to 35 year olds." Well, I saw what I saw yesterday, and I wasn't the only person approaching a half century.

The newscast went on to offer that "many were unemployed, but some were employed." And the more FOX hopes to manipulate folks into seeing this movement as something specific to young, restless, unemployed folks, the more they continue to lose its own credibility (if that's possible).
You know what? I haven't owned a TV in years - for the very reasons you state above -- that media seems to manipulate (or shall I say, construe messages) according to the perspective media feels will garner the most attention or closely align with the viewing audience of said station????

I think social media -whether it occurs here on the Planet, FB, MS or other social networking sites- is probably the largest way people gather information and form opinion according to what source they deem is most rational to them.

Simultaneously, for me and maybe others, I don't always buy what media produces as an 'credible' accounting of news. I think people like me are not representative of the majority. That's not to say that my way of digesting communication is the best way ... but I guess what I am trying to say is that I think what we have going on within the medium of OWS is clearly, most likely, the closest thing we have to people actually participating in active democracy; ensuring that voice from the center, off-center, or even on the perimeter - the outskirts of the Bell Curve (those lovely little statistical 'trouble makers' ) whose voice is not all that often heard due to the cacaphony of the majority; thus, an indication that we as a people, diverse as we are, are capable of making sure that our voices are heard - one way or the other.

I hope my idea makes sense (above).

I appreciate your comments and share the same sentiment, the urgency, to advocate this social cause (OWS).

~D
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Old 10-18-2011, 07:38 AM   #343
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Old 10-18-2011, 07:42 AM   #344
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Here are counters for how much we spend every second on war and for how much the government has lost in revenue because of the Bush tax cuts for the rich. I'm no economist; I'm not even that good with crunching numbers but I don't think it takes a degree in macroeconomics to get that ending these tax cuts and curtailing our government's penchant for making war would go a long, long way toward closing the deficit. Here are two of the biggest drains on our nation's budget and yet we are continually fed the same bullshit about people on welfare dragging us down. I tried to find a counter for how much money our government spends every second on welfare for its citizens, but there doesn't seem to be a counter for that. Nor is there one for how much the government spends every second on unemployment benefits. We are told demands for a fair wage, $20 an hour, is ridiculous. We are told guaranteeing a living wage for all, regardless of employment, is ridiculous. A single payer healthcare system and free college education...just ridiculous according to most of our nation's public officials.

The numbers flying by on these counters...if you ask me, that is the definition of ridiculous.

http://costoftaxcuts.com/

http://costofwar.com/en/
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Old 10-18-2011, 07:50 AM   #345
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Here are counters for how much we spend every second on war and for how much the government has lost in revenue because of the Bush tax cuts for the rich. I'm no economist; I'm not even that good with crunching numbers but I don't think it takes a degree in macroeconomics to get that ending these tax cuts and curtailing our government's penchant for making war would go a long, long way toward closing the deficit. Here are two of the biggest drains on our nation's budget and yet we are continually fed the same bullshit about people on welfare dragging us down. I tried to find a counter for how much money our government spends every second on welfare for its citizens, but there doesn't seem to be a counter for that. Nor is there one for how much the government spends every second on unemployment benefits. We are told demands for a fair wage, $20 an hour, is ridiculous. We are told guaranteeing a living wage for all, regardless of employment, is ridiculous. A single payer healthcare system and free college education...just ridiculous according to most of our nation's public officials.

The numbers flying by on these counters...if you ask me, that is the definition of ridiculous.

http://costoftaxcuts.com/

http://costofwar.com/en/
The saddest part about the cost of war one is that all of that money isn't worth the life lost in fighting these bullshit wars. That includes both sides.
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Old 10-18-2011, 08:06 AM   #346
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[quote=T4Texas;439767]
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Absolutely, you have to force change.

I think those who oppose OWS are waiting for some violent explosion so they can institute martial law and become even more oppressive. No one knows where all this will go. I believe as many have said the best ways to fight are to move your money, support small business, and let your public officials know your displeasure with the way they vote or make policy decisions. What they forget is the general public is what makes this country tick, not just a handful of politicians or a president, or a CEO. They might hold the reigns of power, but its still John Q. public making it all work. WE have the power to decide where our money goes and what we spend it on. These folks are afraid because they know this thing could become a serious grass roots movement that will alter the way they profit. Its always all about the dollar no matter how you look at it.
You do have to force change because otherwise its not going to happen. But you don't need a mob to force change. You do it quietly by using your credit union instead of your bank. By not patronizing companies like WalMart. By telling your elected officials they need to work for their constituents instead of some lobbyist or they can forget re-election. Just occupying public spaces is not going to make it work.
I feel if change is not forthcoming, this country is going to be in a hella mess. We already have a debt that is out of control and will take years to fix. We import so much more than we export and have allowed China to overrun our country with mass poorly made goods. We have outsourced so much that if our international creditors shut us down tomorrow, we'd be screwed. We waste money on wars that will never be won or serve the interests of either us or the countries we fight in. We have a president who appears to be more concerned about his re-election than running the country. How many times in the last few years has wall street almost been on the verge of financial collapse? I think people have no idea what will really happen if this economy bottoms out and I fear we are getting close.
Those in power have not been working for you. They have been working for their own interests and filling their own pockets for years now. We need to do a house cleaning in washington and get some people in office who are truly concerned about the mom and pop business owners, the people on public assistance who want to get off it, the unemployed who get caught up in a cycle of benefits vs taking a job. I feel until we do this house cleaning, the problem is not going to get better.

yes but it's important that the people come together and stand together if for nothing else than to say we have been wronged. it's important because we are trapped in a place where we have no choices. we have have no choices as consumers because everything on shelves in stores across America ...it's all made in China. we have no food choices (and the fact that our food supply was mentioned in the OWS declaration really struck a chord with me) because our food supply has been quietly becoming monopolized and being replaced, literally, with poisonous chemicals. if for nothing else.....the people need to stand up and say that they are not ignorant to the goings on of the widespread corruption that has become our country and say NO to it. we have no choices in democracy because we've lost so many freedoms in the name of security that we can't even protest in parks that our tax dollars pay for without getting arrested or pepper sprayed. even when the people come together and elect the right guy as president he's so crippled by government infighting that not a lot happens in our favor. we have no choices. deregulation has taken the power of choice out of the people's hands and put that power into the hands of corporations that can pirate you and not be held accountable. we have judges on the supreme court who have been caught lying, evading taxes, and taking money from lobbyists to pass judgement that further the corporate agenda and nothing is being done about it. because we have no choices. the people absolutely need to come together in masses and stand together and fight. freedoms are not free. we had to fight to get them and we have to fight to keep them and we should fight back when we lose them.

on a side note.....it took months of a group of women protesting and some endured jail time and abuse....to get women the right to vote. and that was LESS than one hundred years ago.
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Old 10-18-2011, 08:08 AM   #347
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The saddest part about the cost of war one is that all of that money isn't worth the life lost in fighting these bullshit wars. That includes both sides.
Ain't that the truth. Here's another Zinn quote that speaks to the moment and speaks to how in the world we got to the place where we need to fight fruitless, expensive, devastating war after war:

"The year of the massacre at Wounded Knee, 1890, it was officially declared by the Bureau of the Census that the internal frontier was closed. The profit system, with its natural tendency for expansion, had already begun to look overseas. The severe depression that began in 1893 strengthened an idea developing within the political and financial elite of the country: that overseas markets for American goods might relieve the problem of underconsumption at home and prevent the economic crises that in the 1890s brought class war.

And would not a foreign adventure deflect some of the rebellious energy that went into strikes and protest movements toward an external enemy? Would it not unite people with government, with the armed forces, instead of against them? This was probably not a conscious plan among most of the elite -- but a natural development from the twin drives of capitalism and nationalism."

http://www.historyisaweapon.com/defc...nempire12.html
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Old 10-18-2011, 08:13 AM   #348
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The saddest part about the cost of war one is that all of that money isn't worth the life lost in fighting these bullshit wars. That includes both sides.
Yes. That is the saddest part. And I thought of that when I wrote that post, I thought of a ton of stuff that I felt was just as or even more important than what I posted about. But I wanted to make a particular point and I didn't want to digress. But yes for the record I also believe that the saddest part and actually the HIGHEST cost of war is tallied in human life.

Hopefully someone will also focus a little on the cost of Bush's tax cuts, as well as the cost of war in the context of the failing national budget. But of course human life is more important than money.

Upon further reflection that might not go without saying so thanks for saying it.
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Old 10-18-2011, 09:12 AM   #349
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And would not a foreign adventure deflect some of the rebellious energy that went into strikes and protest movements toward an external enemy? Would it not unite people with government, with the armed forces, instead of against them?
"A foreign adventure" - what an appalling euphemism for war. But I suppose we must consider poetic license. It's hard out there for a writer.

War is almost always helpful no matter what is causing a division. If you can get the public on board, which, initially, is easily done using a variety of tactics with fear in the forefront then it will be smooth sailing for awhile. It certainly helped unite the country after the election in 2000 when everyone was walking around trying to figure out what the hell had just happened. The war in Iraq, just after 9/11, catapulted Bush’s job approval rating to 90%.

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This was probably not a conscious plan among most of the elite -- but a natural development from the twin drives of capitalism and nationalism."
Well perhaps the first ten times it's not a conscious plan just great timing, but eventually...
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Old 10-18-2011, 10:11 AM   #350
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Checking in with OccupyLasVegas!!!!



...and a nod to Occupy Savannah (Georgia), my own hometown!!!





~Theo~
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Old 10-18-2011, 11:37 AM   #351
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Probably my favorite video so far. I guess the brainwashing didn't work on him.
Actually most of the veterans I know (serving from Vietnam to present) don't believe in war.....didn't support Iraq. Most veterans believe the same thing this guy does. It's tough on those on active duty to speak out against police brutality as active duty folks are prevented from participating in protests and/or active campaigning for candidates.

The brainwashing that occurs is usually around freedom and looking out for your brothers and sisters, not killing or brutalizing US citizens.
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Old 10-18-2011, 12:00 PM   #352
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This just in... Goldman Sachs sets aside 10 billion dollars for executive bonuses, yet they post a loss, and lay off thousands of employees.

And they wonder why we occupy...
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Old 10-18-2011, 12:29 PM   #353
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And they wonder why we occupy...
It's Mockery, They don't care that we occupy!

eta, do you have a link?
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Old 10-18-2011, 12:43 PM   #354
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It's Mockery, They don't care that we occupy!

eta, do you have a link?
It was on CNN... I was watching the news (when I sould have been picking classes for spring sem.... lol
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Old 10-18-2011, 12:47 PM   #355
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It's Mockery, They don't care that we occupy!

eta, do you have a link?
Speaking of mockery.



Bank of America’s Not-So-Subtle Jab at Occupy Wall Street

Found that pic clicking one of the links in this article about Jesse Jackson saving the medi-tent at Occupy Wall St.
http://www.alternet.org/newsandviews...re/#paragraph4
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Old 10-18-2011, 12:50 PM   #356
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It was on CNN... I was watching the news (when I sould have been picking classes for spring sem.... lol
I think this article covers it.

http://alexjonessucks.blogspot.com/2...eople-for.html
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Old 10-18-2011, 01:30 PM   #357
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Old 10-18-2011, 03:16 PM   #358
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Old 10-18-2011, 05:54 PM   #359
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WASHINGTON -- While an estimated 15,000 to 20,000 Occupy Wall Street protesters flooded into Times Square on Saturday, there was still a regular New York general assembly at 7 p.m. During that meeting, according to sources who contacted The Huffington Post, the Zuccotti Park General Assembly -- though at a reduced presence due to the Times Square march -- approved the formation of a new working group.

This “Demands Working Group” then immediately “established a website and fairly educated/articulated list of solutions.” A separate group out of Zuccotti Park has also been working on a list of possible proposals, but a member of the Education and Empowerment Working Group said he suspects the Demands Working Group’s list will become the national platform.

They’ve posted the list online but they’ve also made this announcement under the radar -- a national convention to be held July 4, 2012:


WE, THE NINETY-NINE PERCENT OF THE PEOPLE of the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, in order to form a more perfect Union, by, for and of the PEOPLE, shall elect and convene a NATIONAL GENERAL ASSEMBLY beginning on July 4, 2012 in the City Of Philadelphia.

They plan to elect delegates by direct vote, one male and one female per each of the 435 Congressional Districts. The office would be open to any United States citizen over the age of 18. The 870 delegates would then compose a petition of grievances that would be non-partisan.

The posted “demands” are only a working list of “suggestions,” however. Number one and two are a ban on private contributions to politicians seeking or holding federal office and instead public financing for campaigns, and a constitutional amendment to reverse the Citizens United decision by the Supreme Court.

The list then goes on to suggest single-payer national health care, immediate passage of the DREAM Act, a jobs plan, a deficit reduction plan and recalling military personnel at all non-essential bases.

The movement would also reinstate the Glass-Steagall Act, increase regulation and increase taxes by way of eliminating corporate tax loopholes.

The idea of coming up with a list of demands has been controversial among protesters.

David Sauvage, who directs videos for the Occupy Wall Street protests and supports the movement, said he viewed demands as being too similar to talking points.

But Daniel Lerner, a physicist and member of the Demands Working Group, argued to Mother Jones that their demands would have wide appeal.

In their list, however, they close with one last warning: if Congress, the President and the Supreme Court do not act on the settled grievances the movement eventually comes up with, its members are prepared to form a third, independent political party to run in every Congressional seat in 2014 and 2016.
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Old 10-18-2011, 09:45 PM   #360
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Default Well this is certainly ambitious.

The99PercentDeclaration

An OWS Working Group Committed to Elect a Non-Partisan National General Assembly




WHEREAS THE FIRST AMENDMENT TO THE UNITED STATES CONSTITUTION PROVIDES:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

BE IT RESOLVED THAT:
WE, THE NINETY-NINE PERCENT OF THE PEOPLE of the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA, in order to form a more perfect Union, by, for and of the PEOPLE, shall elect and convene a NATIONAL GENERAL ASSEMBLY beginning on July 4, 2012 in the City Of Philadelphia.

I. Election of Delegates:

The People, consisting of all United States citizens who have reached the age of 18, regardless of party affiliation and voter registration status, shall elect Two Delegates, one male and one female, by direct vote, from each of the existing 435 Congressional Districts to represent the People at the NATIONAL GENERAL ASSEMBLY in Philadelphia. Said Assembly shall convene on July 4, 2012 in the city of Philadelphia.

The office of Delegate shall be open to all United States citizens who have reached the age of 18. Election Committees, elected by local General Assemblies from all over the United States, shall coordinate with the 99 Percent Declaration Working Group (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/the99declaration/) to organize, coordinate and fund this national election by direct democratic voting. The Election Committees shall operate similarly to the original Committees of Correspondence during the first American Revolution.

II. Meeting of the National General Assembly and Deliberation:

At the NATIONAL GENERAL ASSEMBLY, the 870 Delegates shall set forth, consider and vote upon a PETITION OF GRIEVANCES to be submitted to all members of Congress, The Supreme Court and President and each of the political candidates running in the nationwide Congressional and Presidential election in November 2012. The Delegates of the National General Assembly shall vote upon and implement their own agenda, propagate their own rules and elect or appoint committee members as the Delegates see fit to accomplish their goal of presenting a PETITION OF GRIEVANCES from the 99% of Americans before the 2012 elections.

III. Proposed Petition for the Redress of Grievances:

The PETITION OF GRIEVANCES shall be non-partisan and address the critical issues now confronting the People of the United States. The Delegates shall deliberate and vote upon proposals for the PETITION OF GRIEVANCES in consultation with the 99% similarly to the first two Continental Congresses.

Below is a suggested list of grievances respectfully submitted by the OWS Working Group on the 99% Declaration. The final version of the PETITION OF GRIEVANCES voted upon by the Delegates of the National General Assembly MAY or MAY NOT include the following suggested issues:

1. Implementing an immediate ban on all private contributions of money and gifts, to all politicians in federal office, from Individuals, Corporations, Political Action Committees, Super Political Action Committees, Lobbyists, Unions and all other private sources of money to be replaced by the fair and equal public financing of all federal political campaigns. We categorically REJECT the concept that money is equal to free speech because if that were so, then only the wealthiest would have a voice. These actions must be taken because it has become clear that politicians in the United States cannot regulate themselves and have become the exclusive representatives of corporations, unions and the very wealthy who spend vast sums of money on political campaigns to influence the candidates’ decisions and ensure their reelection year after year.

2. The immediate reversal, even if it requires a Constitutional Amendment, of the outrageous and anti-democratic holding in the "Citizens United" case by the Supreme Court, which equates the payment of money by corporations, wealthy individuals and unions to politicians with free speech. We, the People, demand that institutional bribery and corruption not be deemed protected speech.

3. Prohibiting all federal public officials and their immediate family members, whether elected or appointed, from EVER being employed by any corporation they regulate while in office and/or holding any stock or shares in any corporation they regulate while in office until a full 5 years after their term is completed.

4. A complete lifetime ban on accepting all gifts, services, money, directly or indirectly, to any elected or appointed federal officials or their immediate family members, from any person, corporation, union or other entity that the public official was charged to regulate while in office.

5. A complete reformation of the United States Tax Code to require ALL citizens to pay a fair share of a progressive, graduated income tax by eliminating loopholes, unfair tax breaks, exemptions and deductions, subsidies (e.g. oil, gas and farm) and ending all other methods of evading taxes. The current system of taxation favors the wealthiest Americans, many of whom, pay fewer taxes to the United States Treasury than citizens who earn much less and pay a much higher percentage of income in taxes to the United States Treasury. We, like Warren Buffet, find this income tax disparity to be fundamentally unjust.

6. Medicare for all American citizens or other single-payer healthcare system, adjusted by a means test (i.e. citizens who can afford it may opt-out and pay their own health insurance or opt-in and pay a means tested premium). The Medicaid program, fraught with corruption and fraud, will be eliminated except for the purpose of providing emergency room care to indigent non-citizens who will not be covered by the single-payer program.

7. New comprehensive regulations to give the Environmental Protection Agency expanded powers to shut down corporations, businesses or any entities that intentionally or recklessly damage the environment and/or criminally prosecute individuals who intentionally damage the environment. We also demand the immediate adoption of the most recent international protocols, including the "Washington Declaration" to cap carbon emissions and implement new and existing programs to transition away from fossil fuels to reusable or carbon neutral sources of power.

8. Adoption of an immediate plan to reduce the national debt to a sustainable percentage of GDP by 2020. Reduction of the national debt to be achieved by BOTH a cut in spending to corporations engaged in perpetual war for profit, the "healthcare" industry, the pharmaceutical industry and all other sectors that use the federal budget as their income stream AND a truly progressive income tax code that does not allow the wealthy and corporations to evade taxes through excessive deductions, subsidies and loopholes. We agree that spending cuts are necessary but those cuts must be made to facilitate what is best for the People of the United States of America, not multinational and domestic corporations.

9. Passage of a comprehensive job and job-training act like the American Jobs Act to employ our citizens in jobs that are available with specialized training and by putting People to work now by repairing America's crumbling infrastructure. We also recommend the establishment of an online international job exchange to match employers with skilled workers or employers willing to train workers in 21st century skills.

10. Student loan debt relief. Our young People and students are more than $830 billion in debt from education loans alone. Payment and interest on these debts should be deferred for periods of unemployment and the principal on these loans reduced using a corporate tax surcharge.

11. Immediate passage of the Dream Act and comprehensive immigration and border security reform including offering visas, lawful permanent resident status and citizenship to the world’s brightest People to stay and work in our industries and schools after they obtain their education and training in the United States.

12. Recalling all military personnel at all non-essential bases and refocusing national defense goals to address threats posed by the geopolitics of the 21st century, including terrorism and limiting the large scale deployment of military forces to instances where Congressional approval has been granted to counter the Military Industrial Complex's goal of perpetual war for profit.

13. Mandating new educational goals to train the American public to perform jobs in a 21st Century economy, particularly in the areas of technology and green energy, taking into consideration the redundancy caused by technology and the inexpensive cost of labor in China, India and other countries and paying our teachers a salary that is competitive with the private sector. Paying our teachers a competitive salary commensurate with the salaries of People in the private sector with similar skills.

14. Subject to the elimination of corporate tax loopholes and exploited exemptions and deductions stated above, offering tax incentives to businesses to remain in the United States and hire its citizens rather than outsource jobs and reconstruct the manufacturing capacity of the United States. In conjunction with a new jobs act, reinstitution of the Works Progress Administration and Civilian Conservation Corps and a similar emergency governmental agency tasked with creating new public works projects to provide jobs to the 46 million People living in poverty, the 9.1% unemployed and 10% underemployed.

15. Implementing of immediate legislation to encourage China and our other trading partners to end currency manipulation and reduce the trade deficit.

16. Immediate reenactment of the Glass-Steagall Act and increased regulation of Wall Street and the financial industry by the SEC, FINRA and the other financial regulators, and the commencement of a Justice Department criminal investigations into the Securities and Banking industries practices that led to the collapse of markets, $700 billion bail-out, and financial firm failures in 2007-2008.

17. Adoption of a plan similar to President Clinton’s proposal to end the mortgage crisis and instead of the Federal Reserve continuing to lower interest rates for loans to banks who are refusing to loan to small businesses and consumers, the Federal Reserve shall buy all underwater or foreclosed mortgages and refinance these debts at 1% or less to be managed by the newly established Consumer Financial Protection Bureau (and foreclosure task force described below) because 1% or less is the interest rate the Federal Reserve loans to the banks directly who hoard the cash rather than loan it to the People and small businesses.

18. An immediate one year freeze on all foreclosures to be reviewed by an independent foreclosure task force appointed by Congress and the Executive Branch to (in conjunction with the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau ) determine, on a case by case basis, whether foreclosure proceedings should continue based on the circumstances of each homeowner and propriety of the financial institution's conduct.

19. Subject to the above ban on all private money and gifts in politics, to enact additional campaign finance reform requiring free air time and public campaign finances to all candidates who obtain sufficient petition signatures and/or votes to participate in the primaries and/or electoral process, to shorten the campaign season and to allow voting on weekends and holidays.

20. An immediate withdrawal of all troops from Iraq and Afghanistan and a substantial increase in the amount of funding needed for veteran job placement and the treatment of the physical and emotional injuries sustained by veterans in these wars. Our veterans are committing suicide at an unprecedented rate and we must help now.

BE IT FURTHER RESOLVED that IF the PETITION OF GRIEVANCES approved by the 870 Delegates of the NATIONAL GENERAL ASSEMBLY in consultation with the PEOPLE, is not acted upon by Congress, the President, and Supreme Court, to the satisfaction of the Delegates of the NATIONAL GENERAL ASSEMBLY, said Delegates shall organize a THIRD, COMPLETELY NON-PARTISAN, INDEPENDENT POLITICAL PARTY to run candidates for every available Congressional seat in the mid-term election of 2014 and again in 2016 until all vestiges of the existing corrupt corporatocracy have been removed by the ballot box.

★THE NINETY-NINE PERCENT★

Email us with your ideas for this declaration and petition at: The99Declaration@gmail.com or join this Working Group by visiting http://groups.yahoo.com/group/the99declaration/ and the Working Group Forum at http://the99delegation.forumotion.com/.
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