OCCUPY WALL STREET

[persiphone]

i've come to the conclusion that i'm against the idea of having to get a (or 47) permit(s) to protest. free speech and freedom to assemble has become a victim to overpermitization. (is that a word?) especially in areas that the public pays for. it's a little ridiculous and it's the grounds Naomi was arrested on.

about the name. i understand the issue with the name. however, i couldn't care less if they called it Shit On A Stick, as long as it invokes positive changes.

[Dominique]

The *Occupied Cities* seem to all be different. Albeit, the cause is the same. Tent city, here in Pgh. is less than 20 tents. Ironic that the small patch of grass they are [occupying] is owned by Mellon Bank (part of BNY). Mellon Bank has given them permission to be there. The area is clean. I haven't heard of this being an issue. The majority of the people go home each night and return each day. Some, like me, have jobs and other things going on and can only participate on a limited basis. Therefore, the size of the crowds vary. The Pgh. Police are near by but have not interrupted any of the demonstrations. All have been described as *peaceful*. The ACLU has been on the television saying it is keeping a watchful eye on what is going on.

The messages are getting out. There are plenty. I don't think there is a right way or a wrong way. As long as this movement is getting peoples attention. Giving people something to think about. This entire state is in extreme financial hardship, Harrisburg, our Capitol, may not be able to pay it's bills until the end of the year. Lot's of people are loosing jobs because of Goverment free wheeling. People want answers. Tent cities send a message.

[SoNotHer]

From Zinn's A People's History of the United States -

http://www.historyisaweapon.com/defc...nselhel15.html

These people were becoming "dangerous," as Steinbeck said. The spirit of rebellion was growing. Mauritz Hallgren, in a 1933 book, Seeds of Revolt, compiled newspaper reports of things happening around the country:

England, Arkansas, January 3, 1931. The long drought that ruined hundreds of Arkansas farms last summer had a dramatic sequel late today when some 500 farmers, most of them white men and many of them armed, marched on the business section of this town. .. . Shouting that they must have food for themselves and their families, the invaders announced their intention to take it from the stores unless it were provided from some other source without cost.

Detroit, July 9, 1931. An incipient riot by 500 unemployed men turned out of the city lodging house for lack of funds was quelled by police reserves in Cadillac Square tonight. . ..

Indiana Harbor, Indiana, August 5, 1931. Fifteen hundred jobless men stormed the plant of the Fruit Growers Express Company here, demanding that they be given jobs to keep from starving. The company's answer was to call the city police, who routed the jobless with menacing clubs.

Boston, November 10, 1931. Twenty persons were treated for injuries, three were hurt so seriously that they may die, and dozens of others were nursing wounds from flying bottles, lead pipe, and stones after clashes between striking longshoremen and Negro strikebreakers along the Charlestown-East Boston waterfront.

Detroit, November 28, 1931. A mounted patrolman was hit on the head with a stone and unhorsed and one demonstrator was arrested during a disturbance in Grand Circus Park this morning when 2000 men and women met there in defiance of police orders.

Chicago, April 1, 1932. Five hundred school children, most with haggard faces and in tattered clothes, paraded through Chicago's downtown section to the Board of Education offices to demand that the school system provide them with food.

Boston, June 3, 1932. Twenty-five hungry children raided a buffet lunch set up for Spanish War veterans during a Boston parade. Two automobile-loads of police were called to drive them away.

New York, January 21, 1933. Several hundred jobless surrounded a restaurant just off Union Square today demanding they be fed without charge.. . .

Seattle, February 16, 1933. A two-day siege of the County-City Building, occupied by an army of about 5,000 unemployed, was ended early tonight, deputy sheriffs and police evicting the demonstrators after nearly two hours of efforts.

Yip Harburg, the songwriter, told Studs Terkel about the year 1932: "I was walking along the street at that time, and you'd see the bread lines. The biggest one in New York City was owned by William Randolph Hearst. He had a big truck with several people on it, and big cauldrons of hot soup, bread. Fellows with burlap on their feet were lined up all around Columbus Circle, and went for blocks and blocks around the park, waiting." Harburg had to write a song for the show Americana. He wrote "Brother, Can You Spare a Dime?"

Once in khaki suits.

Gee, we looked swell,

Full of that Yankee Doodle-de-dum.

Half a million boots went sloggin' through Hell,

I was the kid with the drum.

Say, don't you remember, they called me Al-

It was Al all the time.

Say, don't you remember I'm your pal-

Brother, can you spare a dime?

[Ebon]

[Ebon]

Originally Posted by persiphone

i've come to the conclusion that i'm against the idea of having to get a (or 47) permit(s) to protest. free speech and freedom to assemble has become a victim to overpermitization. (is that a word?) especially in areas that the public pays for. it's a little ridiculous and it's the grounds Naomi was arrested on.

about the name. i understand the issue with the name. however, i couldn't care less if they called it Shit On A Stick, as long as it invokes positive changes.

Here is their permit.

"When in the Course of human events it becomes necessary for one people to dissolve the political bands which have connected them with another and to assume among the powers of the earth, the separate and equal station to which the Laws of Nature and of Nature's God entitle them, a decent respect to the opinions of mankind requires that they should declare the causes which impel them to the separation.

We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights, that among these are Life, Liberty and the pursuit of Happiness."

Moving on.

[Ebon]

Austin still going strong even after this incident. I love the way the news handled it.

[ruffryder]

.. almost Halloween, it could get scary!

Friday the 28th is National Walk Out of School Day for OWS. 12:30 p.m. nationwide. Time for students and teachers to show their outrage with a walkout and a protest. This is slated for schools across the nation. Who will attend?

Remove inflation. The cause for holding students hostage with the debt of education. Be protected by the Bill of Rights. Assemble peacefully and occupy public space. Take a stand together against the 1%, have a right to free speech, protest, and make your voice heard in your country and in your streets. Occupy it.

[Ebon]

Originally Posted by June

I am part of the 99%. I hope this all brings about some change and unifies those of us who pay more taxes for less representation. I hope it helps people like my mother understand that we are owned by corporations and the Republicans are not our saviors.

With that said. Our "Occupy Portland Camp" smells like reefer and Patcchuli and seems to be made up of young white folks with enough middle class privilege that they can afford to camp out in the middle of the city.

That kind of sucks. I know the one in NYC wasn't allowing drugs or alcohol, not that I ever think of reefer(I haven't heard this term used since 1982) as a drug. Patchouli I expected. lol At most of the other camps I've seen people from all walks of life. Older people, young people, students, union workers etc...

[ruffryder]

I thought this article was interesting on the connection between food stamps and JPMorgan or banks.

http://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/a...p-morgan-makes

[Toughy]

yahoo photos.....about 2/3 through the 27 pics you will see what it looked like before the police 'evicted' them. Looks very neat and orderly to me.

http://news.yahoo.com/photos/police-...072926256.html

I'm not buying the health and safety crap. KPFA....it's free radio...gave voice to the Occupy folks. They all seemed knowlegeable about food safey and health stuff. There are plenty of ways to safely deal with human waste. Camping toliets are fabulous things. These folks are not dirty nasty sub humans who want to wallow in human and rat piss and shit. Rats are everywhere in downtown Oakland as they are in every frigging city in the country.

If the Health Department had concerns they could have simply asked to talk to the folks in charge of the kitchen and work with them to make corrections IF needed.

Occupy Oakland and Occupy SF are well organized with every kind of committee you can think of..I know SF even has a gender issues point person.....they have regular open meetings. They are serious folks about the issues.

Oh yes there are probably some asshats.....always have been and always will be.......however they are no where no way the majority of the 99% folks.

[Toughy]

Originally Posted by Ebon

That kind of sucks. I know the one in NYC wasn't allowing drugs or alcohol, not that I ever think of reefer(I haven't heard this term used since 1982) as a drug. Patchouli I expected. lol At most of the other camps I've seen people from all walks of life. Older people, young people, students, union workers etc...

come on............it's Portland..........laughin......about the most white bread city in the country.......

As to reefer....I smell it every day on the streets anyway....medical marijuana is alive and well and on the streets in the Bay...

I didn't read the rules at the camps, but I would imagine no booze, no illegal drugs, no cigarettes/cigars would be the norm and probably no weapons except for knives. Smoking a bowl of bud is another thing.

[ruffryder]

what to do if you're arrested for participating in OWS.

Although there may not be any justification for an arrest and you don't like the way you are treated, you should always remain calm. Physically resisting arrest will be worse for you. You have the right to remain silent and you have the right to refuse consent for a search.

Most of the arrests for OWS are falling under disorderly conduct. It can be different for each state, but they are along those lines, impeding traffic, failure to disperse, creating annoyance, loitering, etc. It could result in a misdemeanor charge, jail time and a criminal record. Once out of jail, if you continue to OWS and another arrest happens, it could bring harsher penalties each time.

Understand your rights however. Here is a link that goes over your rights if you're stopped by police, including asking if you are free to leave and writing a complaint and contacting your local ACLU if you feel your rights are violated.

http://www.aclu.org/drug-law-reform-...what-do-if-you

[Nat]

Originally Posted by June

I am part of the 99%. I hope this all brings about some change and unifies those of us who pay more taxes for less representation. I hope it helps people like my mother understand that we are owned by corporations and the Republicans are not our saviors.

With that said. Our "Occupy Portland Camp" smells like reefer and Patcchuli and seems to be made up of young white folks with enough middle class privilege that they can afford to camp out in the middle of the city.

I heart patchouli :P

[greeneyedgrrl]

apparently Quan helped plan the raid, but had NO idea it was gonna go down. ??
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/articl...BAMD1LMMA0.DTL

[nowandthen]

4 favorite parts of tonight,1. Hanging with G 2.taking 14th and Broadway with music and dancing 3. All the folks parting to let an ambulance through and then re-taking the street 4. marching to the jail and have the folks in jail flick the lights and us cheering let them all out and them flickering the lights. pictures/video to follow in the AM, sweet dreams all

[AtLast]

Originally Posted by persiphone

i've come to the conclusion that i'm against the idea of having to get a (or 47) permit(s) to protest. free speech and freedom to assemble has become a victim to overpermitization. (is that a word?) especially in areas that the public pays for. it's a little ridiculous and it's the grounds Naomi was arrested on.

about the name. i understand the issue with the name. however, i couldn't care less if they called it Shit On A Stick, as long as it invokes positive changes.

I see your point about permits and I also want safety for all as well as sanitary conditions to exist at protests. Sometimes someone gets sick and needs an ambulance. There has to be a way for the ambulance to get to them and get them on their way to a hospital, for example.

And I don't see a problem with having demonstrators disperse for public works employees to do their clean up jobs. Parks are continually maintained and cleaned by these kinds of departments and power washing is used all of the time. Then, everyone can come back.

I don't agree with the camping out as it leads to many more sanitation problems. For everyone- and disease is spread this way. There are many people including homeless folks that do not have good healthcare (one of our complaints), have compromised immune systems or other chronic illness in which contracting stash or hepatitis is more likely, thus, potentially threatening the health of others. This just happens in large crowd situations no matter who the people gathering are.

In a socially democratic society, we care about the health and well being of others. So, in exercising our rights to protest for the "good of the common people," shouldn't we consider how to best control the spread of germs, etc.?

LOL, yes, I am a germ-phobe, although it comes naturally as a person with an audio-immune cluster that I know compromises me in these kinds of situations. I wash my hands a lot! Don't even think about eating off of my plate or sharing a beverage. And if someone is coughing or sneezing, I'm gone. It isn't just a common cold that I could get. And I am just one of millions of people in the US dealing with this. I will be a real mess if I have to evacuate to a dorm situation or tent city during an earthquake! Consider the fact that homeless people may very well have poor health and not be able to fight off a common cold or become very ill with a flu strain. They don't even get decent general medical care as it is and most that have mental illnesses are not on needed medications in any consistent manner. They are at high risk.

It looks like in Oakland, the demonstrators are free to come back to the park after it is cleaned. However, they will not be allowed to camp-out or demonstrate after dark. I agree with Aj on the whole occupied land thing and the fact that unless one is Native American, they don't really have a right to take over any public space.

Does anyone know if these are now common procedures that are being put in place in other cities in the US where there are OWS protests. Also, have there been more efforts get a balance between the demonstrators and the jobs public works employees need to do with maintaining a public park. Frankly, I don't see the need for violence on either side of this if cool heads prevail. There have to be common sense solutions to keeping this peaceful and safe so that the real points of this assembly is realized.

I was arrested more than once back in the 70's while protesting- and I usually caught a cold after protesting. It's kind of like going into a classroom with a bunch of little kids with runny noses. Back then I didn't have the same health concerns, however. I am still going to some of these, but I won't be setting up camp.

[persiphone]

Originally Posted by AtLast

I see your point about permits and I also want safety for all as well as sanitary conditions to exist at protests. Sometimes someone gets sick and needs an ambulance. There has to be a way for the ambulance to get to them and get them on their way to a hospital, for example.

And I don't see a problem with having demonstrators disperse for public works employees to do their clean up jobs. Parks are continually maintained and cleaned by these kinds of departments and power washing is used all of the time. Then, everyone can come back.

I don't agree with the camping out as it leads to many more sanitation problems. For everyone- and disease is spread this way. There are many people including homeless folks that do not have good healthcare (one of our complaints), have compromised immune systems or other chronic illness in which contracting stash or hepatitis is more likely, thus, potentially threatening the health of others. This just happens in large crowd situations no matter who the people gathering are.

In a socially democratic society, we care about the health and well being of others. So, in exercising our rights to protest for the "good of the common people," shouldn't we consider how to best control the spread of germs, etc.?

LOL, yes, I am a germ-phobe, although it comes naturally as a person with an audio-immune cluster that I know compromises me in these kinds of situations. I wash my hands a lot! Don't even think about eating off of my plate or sharing a beverage. And if someone is coughing or sneezing, I'm gone. It isn't just a common cold that I could get. And I am just one of millions of people in the US dealing with this. I will be a real mess if I have to evacuate to a dorm situation or tent city during an earthquake! Consider the fact that homeless people may very well have poor health and not be able to fight off a common cold or become very ill with a flu strain. They don't even get decent general medical care as it is and most that have mental illnesses are not on needed medications in any consistent manner. They are at high risk.

It looks like in Oakland, the demonstrators are free to come back to the park after it is cleaned. However, they will not be allowed to camp-out or demonstrate after dark. I agree with Aj on the whole occupied land thing and the fact that unless one is Native American, they don't really have a right to take over any public space.

Does anyone know if these are now common procedures that are being put in place in other cities in the US where there are OWS protests. Also, have there been more efforts get a balance between the demonstrators and the jobs public works employees need to do with maintaining a public park. Frankly, I don't see the need for violence on either side of this if cool heads prevail. There have to be common sense solutions to keeping this peaceful and safe so that the real points of this assembly is realized.

I was arrested more than once back in the 70's while protesting- and I usually caught a cold after protesting. It's kind of like going into a classroom with a bunch of little kids with runny noses. Back then I didn't have the same health concerns, however. I am still going to some of these, but I won't be setting up camp.

with the creation of superbugs via the current corporate oppression, i'd say you're kinda out of luck in the germaphobe thing. i'm sure it would be nice to have neat and clean protests that are shiny and germ and violence free, but that's just not how most (not all) change of this magnitude occurs. there is going to be violence, and germs, and differences of opinion, and a whole slew of other things to pick at and pick apart. hopefully the violence stays contained on the police side cuz that will just make people more involved. i would be worried when we hit the tipping point and the protestors become violent in response. i hope that doesn't happen.

i don't mind that it's messy. messy happens. i don't care about what the people look like or how old they are or if there is some trash or not or who has germs and who doesn't or if i smell incense. i don't give a shit. change needs to happen and i don't mind getting my hands dirty over it.

[SoNotHer]

Excellent post! I'm so glad to hear someone bringing this up and correlating it to corporation action - the creation of monocultures, "pesticide ready" plants, GMOs and "terminal seeds," the wildly indiscriminate use of antibiotics in stockyard animals" as a natural (or unnatural) impetus and cause for the creation of superbugs like drug-resistant staff infections.

Persiphone, I've encouraged my students to write about a variety of topics, including OWS and this one. Do you have any sources for this that you like? One student is writing about this, and she's already accessed an article form The Altantic (6/11) and the PBS survival series segment. What else have you read that you like?

Originally Posted by persiphone

with the creation of superbugs via the current corporate oppression, i'd say you're kinda out of luck in the germaphobe thing. i'm sure it would be nice to have neat and clean protests that are shiny and germ and violence free, but that's just not how most (not all) change of this magnitude occurs. there is going to be violence, and germs, and differences of opinion, and a whole slew of other things to pick at and pick apart. hopefully the violence stays contained on the police side cuz that will just make people more involved. i would be worried when we hit the tipping point and the protestors become violent in response. i hope that doesn't happen.

i don't mind that it's messy. messy happens. i don't care about what the people look like or how old they are or if there is some trash or not or who has germs and who doesn't or if i smell incense. i don't give a shit. change needs to happen and i don't mind getting my hands dirty over it.

[persiphone]

Originally Posted by SoNotHer

Excellent post! I'm so glad to hear someone bringing this up and correlating it to corporation action - the creation of monocultures, "pesticide ready" plants, GMOs and "terminal seeds," the wildly indiscriminate use of antibiotics in stockyard animals" as a natural (or unnatural) impetus and cause for the creation of superbugs like drug-resistant staff infections.

Persiphone, I've encouraged my students to write about a variety of topics, including OWS and this one. Do you have any sources for this that you like? One student is writing about this, and she's already accessed an article form The Altantic (6/11) and the PBS survival series segment. What else have you read that you like?

there are antibiotic resistant genes in GMOs as well. what i find interesting is that there was DNA specifically engineered to be antibiotic resistant in a lab in America and then it was pumped into the food supply all nice and quiet. meanwhile, the media is all about telling us that OVERuse of antibiotics is the real problem...not that that ISN'T a problem...but i suspect it's not THE problem. same with the use of antibiotics in meat. is it a good practice? no. is it bad for you to eat meat that has been grown with antibiotics? probably. but what we're NOT talking about is the specifically engineered DNA that was specifically made to be antibiotic resistant floating around in GMO foods that are neither labeled on products nor regulated.

to understand this, one would have to look at how foreign or new DNA is taken up by an organism, lets say for example e.coli. there are a couple ways this happens naturally. one way is called horizontal gene transfer where different strains of bacteria are capable of uptaking each other's DNA. some organisms release their DNA upon death and leave what we call DNA litter. so let's say you ingest an e.coil organism that is carrying antibiotic resistant DNA (cuz e.coli is what they use in agrotech to introduce new DNA into plant cells) and that antibiotic resistant DNA litter is now in your digestive tract and your natural e.coli that is swarming around your intestines picks up the DNA via horizontal transfer. and voila! a superbug is born. i believe that we've actually become human farms for these superbugs unwittingly via GMOs. and i suspect i'm not the only one. there seems to be a timeline correlation between the emergence of superbugs and GMOs that i find unsettling.

i've not found books on this stuff. but i do read a lot and i've taken enough microbiology classes to be sufficiently scared to death of our food. you won't find anything in the news either. i would say google some science journals on the matter and possibly news sources that are not in America. Europe is vehemently antiGMO. protestors even went as far as to invade and cut down GMO crops while the police just stood and watched. i think those vids are floating around youtube. if we did that here we would be arrested and sued. on a side note....GMOs aren't only in the food supply. there are acres upon acres of GMO trees growing in our forests, in the amazon, and gawd only knows where else. veggies will pollinate once. trees, however, will pollinate many times in their lifetime. and the location of many of these GMO tree palntings are a secret. why?

[Cin]