How important is language?

betenoire · 11-02-2011, 05:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DapperButch

That question sucks.

Unless you are a mind reader, and said exactly what they wanted you to say, it was a no win situation for you.

I'm sorry that happened.

Not a fair question unless you know them really, really well ...well enough to be certain that they won't be hurt by whatever answer you may give them.

Well on top of that, what kind of a weird insecure person ASKS that sort of shit?

UofMfan · 11-02-2011, 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by betenoire

Well on top of that, what kind of a weird insecure person ASKS that sort of shit?

The same kind of person who asks "Does this dress make me look fat?"

betenoire · 11-02-2011, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by UofMfan

The same kind of person who asks "Does this dress make me look fat?"

What about "do these glasses make me look smarter?"?

Hollylane · 11-02-2011, 05:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by betenoire

What about "do these glasses make me look smarter?"?

Or....

Honey, do you think that femme woman over there is hot?

What do you think of her chest size in comparison to these?

betenoire · 11-02-2011, 06:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hollylane

Or....

Honey, do you think that femme woman over there is hot?

What do you think of her chest size in comparison to these?

See, I would never ask those questions! Instead I say things like "listen, see that woman over there? You totally have permission to sleep with her. And if you don't; I will."

But I'm a terrible person.

I really did say the glasses thing, though. What?

Silverseastar · 11-02-2011, 06:01 PM

Well to be fair this is a young butch struggling with trans identity for a while. I agree I felt sort of cornered but I don't think that was the intent.

For my part I think in retrospect I wish rather than answering I had asked why to see where the conversation might go and gain more insight.

Thank you all for wading in with your opinions. I appreciate the feedback more than you can possibly know.

macele · 11-02-2011, 06:06 PM

is she new to coming out?

a butch woman sometimes needs a femmes approval, i think.
if she is tying to figure out if she is a homosexual or a transsexual.

just speaking from my experience,
it's a big relief when a femme really digs your tomboy ways.

not all lesbians are attracted to other women with masculine ways.
may be she is questioning you for that reason. she wants to know if you like.

insecurity can be a mega factor for a butch just coming out.
i'd say she is questioning herself.

i don't know the statistics, but they have to be high, ...
that most butch women wonder if they are really supposed to be male.
she has to work thru a lot. it's thought about, for sure.

Hollylane · 11-02-2011, 06:09 PM

In all seriousness...

Nothing like being set up for a 50/50 chance at failure.

I think that you are right, waiting and feeling it out for a friend might have been better. However, I think the friend should be able to handle the answer to the question they put you in the position of answering.

Gemme · 11-02-2011, 06:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silverseastar

Hello. My question stems from a butch asking me to describe how I viewed them and did they seem like a man.

I'm curious, why would someone ask this question? What would be the appropriate response in this situation? Honesty? Further questions?

In my attempt to describe it I hurt their feelings and it made me feel terrible. I used the terminology of "other gender" not male and not female but masculine energy. I'm looking for more understanding as they won't talk to me about it. Please be gentle with me though!

Also is this a topic best shied away from if it comes up? Meaning is it too personal and sensitive a place for most butches? The ones I have dated in the past were never this sensitive about it so maybe it is about being in the trans spectrum?

If it were me? The first thing out of my mouth would have been 'do you feel like a man?'.

Sure, it's deflection, but like others have said...the question was out of the blue and unfair if the two of you had not spoken of your friend's presentation before.

I do think, however, despite the way your friend went about it, it shows a great deal about YOU in that they chose you to ask. That speaks volumes about the type of friend they think you are.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Silverseastar

Well to be fair this is a young butch struggling with trans identity for a while. I agree I felt sort of cornered but I don't think that was the intent.

For my part I think in retrospect I wish rather than answering I had asked why to see where the conversation might go and gain more insight.

Thank you all for wading in with your opinions. I appreciate the feedback more than you can possibly know.

Hindsight, right?

I think you were as fair as one might expect.

Quote:

Originally Posted by macele

is she new to coming out?

a butch woman sometimes needs a femmes approval, i think.
if she is tying to figure out if she is a homosexual or a transsexual.

just speaking from my experience,
it's a big relief when a femme really digs your tomboy ways.

not all lesbians are attracted to other women with masculine ways.
may be she is questioning you for that reason. she wants to know if you like.

insecurity can be a mega factor for a butch just coming out.
i'd say she is questioning herself.

i don't know the statistics, but they have to be high, ...
that most butch women wonder if they are really supposed to be male.
she has to work thru a lot. it's thought about, for sure.

Since this thread is about a friend asking another friend if they saw them as a man and we've been informed that this butch has been struggling with his trans identity, I think it's inappropriate to refer to him as 'her'.

It feels weird, like if someone called me 'sir' or 'he'.

always2late · 11-02-2011, 06:55 PM

I agree with Gemme...the only possible response to a question like that is "How do YOU think you seem?" I also agree with Dapper that the question sucks. I understand that the person asking may be young, and may be conflicted, but still that question is very unfair to ask of someone else. You cannot define anyone's identity for them..so any answer you could have given could be perceived as the wrong one. And then to hold your answer against you...that is just unfair.

11-02-2011, 06:55 PM	#10
always2late Senior Member How Do You Identify?: Femme Preferred Pronoun?: m'lady Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: NJ Posts: 2,000 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 1,834 Thanked 6,231 Times in 1,462 Posts Rep Power: 21474854	I agree with Gemme...the only possible response to a question like that is "How do YOU think you seem?" I also agree with Dapper that the question sucks. I understand that the person asking may be young, and may be conflicted, but still that question is very unfair to ask of someone else. You cannot define anyone's identity for them..so any answer you could have given could be perceived as the wrong one. And then to hold your answer against you...that is just unfair. __________________ Out beyond ideas of wrongdoing and rightdoing there is a field. I'll meet you there ~ Rumi

11-02-2011, 06:01 PM	#6
Silverseastar Member How Do You Identify?: femme, submissive, girl Preferred Pronoun?: she Relationship Status: Singular Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Vancouver BC Posts: 133 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 348 Thanked 492 Times in 107 Posts Rep Power: 3095523	Well to be fair this is a young butch struggling with trans identity for a while. I agree I felt sort of cornered but I don't think that was the intent. For my part I think in retrospect I wish rather than answering I had asked why to see where the conversation might go and gain more insight. Thank you all for wading in with your opinions. I appreciate the feedback more than you can possibly know.

11-02-2011, 06:06 PM	#7
macele Member How Do You Identify?: a bold-assed maximus Preferred Pronoun?: she Join Date: Sep 2011 Location: mississippi Posts: 1,066 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 3,178 Thanked 3,230 Times in 847 Posts Rep Power: 21474850	is she new to coming out? a butch woman sometimes needs a femmes approval, i think. if she is tying to figure out if she is a homosexual or a transsexual. just speaking from my experience, it's a big relief when a femme really digs your tomboy ways. not all lesbians are attracted to other women with masculine ways. may be she is questioning you for that reason. she wants to know if you like. insecurity can be a mega factor for a butch just coming out. i'd say she is questioning herself. i don't know the statistics, but they have to be high, ... that most butch women wonder if they are really supposed to be male. she has to work thru a lot. it's thought about, for sure.

11-02-2011, 06:09 PM	#8
Hollylane Practically Lives Here How Do You Identify?: . Preferred Pronoun?: . Relationship Status: . Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: . Posts: 11,495 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 34,694 Thanked 26,362 Times in 5,875 Posts Rep Power: 21474862	In all seriousness... Nothing like being set up for a 50/50 chance at failure. I think that you are right, waiting and feeling it out for a friend might have been better. However, I think the friend should be able to handle the answer to the question they put you in the position of answering.