What is Forgiveness?

[femmy1]

There are several people/situations that I am having trouble finding forviness for. I wish it was easier but I am stuck... I am working on it, that's all I can say.

Seems like the more you need to give it, the harder it is sometimes to give.

f1~

[Blade]

Originally Posted by christie0918

Mostly, I find forgiving myself the most difficult.

Sometimes this is also difficult for me. I realize I am fallible, I make mistakes and sometimes make choices that I live to regret. Usually with the latter it is a choice from the heart instead of from my head. I'm probably having a little trouble forgiving myself for some of those choices at this time.

Originally Posted by femmy1

There are several people/situations that I am having trouble finding forviness for. I wish it was easier but I am stuck... I am working on it, that's all I can say.

Seems like the more you need to give it, the harder it is sometimes to give.

f1~

I agree with this too femmy. I need to give it up real bad, but it just isn't happening. Not right now it isn't. But I keep praying for the release and the ability to forgive. I hope it is soon

[Andrew, Jr.]

Forgiveness is not easy. Not by a long shot. For example, I was falsely accused of raping a woman at work. No lie. She went to management and claimed I put my hands all over her, and I raped her. Well, they took her statement. Next they called me in, and took my statement. It was short and sweet. It read "I was working on the dock. The videotape of me is in security. It verifies my location. In addition, at that particular time frame, I was signing in from Fed. Express the Viagra cartons. The carbon copies are in xyz's in-box." So, it was a bogus claim against me. Do I forgive the woman who did this to me? Yep. I forgive her. But I do not forgive what she said to management and all the other people (gossip). That is going to take a while. I just have prayers to say for her, and leave it at that. She ruined my character and reputation. Why? Who knows why anyone does anything anymore these days.

Andrew

[Jess]

I tend to put my areas of forgiveness in two different areas. Minor and major. The lesser transgressions are easier for me to forgive others or myself for. It sometimes takes a little time and deep breathing techniques, but usually I am able to move on.. make amends to self and others where I can and resume life as usual.

The major ones may take longer and some I admittedly have still not "let go " of yet. Usually these involve breech of trust. Trust is my most difficult thing to deal with. When it has been broken or damaged it is incredibly hard for me to move beyond that into forgiveness. Even when I am able to finally say "ok, I forgive", like Lady Snow said, I still don't forget and still have issue trusting again.

I know that holding on to resentments and ill feelings only serves to make me ill in both spirit and body. I am still working on it.

[Blade]

Originally Posted by hpychick

How can it be that we find it most difficult to forgive ourselves? Is it because we know what goes on in our minds after we thought we forgave someone or a situation, or yes, even ourselves?

I'm fine for a while and then a situation arises or a phone call comes in or a letter in the mail - and all of it comes bubbling back to the surface. Sometimes slowly - at 211 (right before the boiling point) - and sometimes ferociously, like an irate volcano.

There are nights I cry myself to sleep because I can't believe I'm still holding on. I cry because I am not free. I cry because I know, deep inside, there's a reason that I don't forgive.

There is the constant shadow following me, that walks in line with mine. One day I will turn around and it will be gone.

I'm walking that line with you here on the last 2 paragraphs hpychick. Great post!

Originally Posted by Jess

I tend to put my areas of forgiveness in two different areas. Minor and major. The lesser transgressions are easier for me to forgive others or myself for. It sometimes takes a little time and deep breathing techniques, but usually I am able to move on.. make amends to self and others where I can and resume life as usual.Me too Jess, most things that happen are easy for me to forgive. I believe in "this too shall pass" especially on the small stuff

The major ones may take longer and some I admittedly have still not "let go " of yet. Usually these involve breech of trust. Trust is my most difficult thing to deal with. When it has been broken or damaged it is incredibly hard for me to move beyond that into forgiveness. Even when I am able to finally say "ok, I forgive", like Lady Snow said, I still don't forget and still have issue trusting again.
I feel this too Jess, I'm all about some trust and have issues with folks who breach that trust. Forgiveness of this type takes me a while
I know that holding on to resentments and ill feelings only serves to make me ill in both spirit and body. I am still working on it.

I'm working hard in this area, I know what anger and resentment does to me personally in spirit and body. Working on it and making progress feels so good and then there is the day that like hpychick said just something happens out of the blue that kicks you back a few rungs and you almost feel like you are starting all over

[Andrew, Jr.]

Let me explain myself a bit more. It may make better sense.

I believe in forgiveness. That is a gift that I give to myself. I am not so much bitter as I am angry (do I have the definitions of the words wrong?). I do have a very strong desire to heal my heart and soul. Forgiveness is not a stumbling block for me. Forgiveness is a means of letting go. It isn't a one time deal. It is a process that I have done with therapy and on my own. And the one thing everyone seems to forget is that it takes time and patience to deal with the past. But the now and future is brighter and wonderful. Life is good!

[JinxdGirl]

I forgave and forgive..
because if I didn't and don't, you win.
because I refuse to care enough about you to hold on to hate and ill-will.
because you took too many of my years and I'm taking what's left for me.

[RockOn]

It has been my experience that, in certain situations, it can be a long time coming. Even so, I feel so much better when I can forgive someone, give them a break.

[Talon]

Forgiveness is freedom for you...as long as you've taken the lesson from it.

[Ginger]

I don't think forgiveness is always necessary or even beneficial.

Indifference and letting go is where I find peace, when a relationship ends and the dynamic can't be fixed in order for the relationship to morph into something else.

And I also want to say, indifference isn't the same as wishing someone harm, or hating them. It's what happens when letting go reaches a certain ultimate point. It isn't cold or mean, it just is.

On the other hand, if I want to continue in a relationship with a person who has transgressed against me in some egregious way, forgiveness might open the door to trust. It's a way of saying, "I'm not mad at you anymore" but also there is this tacit agreement: "and I trust you not to do that harmful thing again."

If I want to be friends with someone who did something hurtful to me, I can sometimes just avoid the situations in which that might happen again. With family, for example, I avoid certain conversational topics, and don't ask for what I know I won't get, emotionally.

Is that forgiveness? No, I don't think so. It's protecting myself from toxins in order to continue having contact with that person or persons. It's a kind of trade-off, one I've decided is worth the effort.

I guess I just don't like the whole vibe happening around the term "forgiveness." It sounds religious to me, and I'll admit anything with a religious tone turns me off so take that with a grain of salt.

Here's part of what Wiki says:

"Forgiveness is typically defined as the process of concluding resentment, indignation or anger as a result of a perceived offense, difference or mistake, or ceasing to demand punishment or restitution."

So I guess they're saying forgiveness is the letting go of "resentment, indignation or anger," which I'm all for—(it erodes your health, for one thing, to stay mad), but that doesn't mean, the relationship has to pick up where it left off. It can end, continue, whatever, after forgiveness happens.

Here's what I just realized; forgiveness often implies that the forgiver is somehow morally superior to the person being forgiven. That just bugs me.

[Lady Jewel]

Like I once said to someone who was being particularly hard on me (I felt), We humans are imperfect. We are flawed. We make mistakes. Its how we handle those mistakes in the future that is more telling.
I also believe that "mistakes" are really learning opportunities. Learn from them, hopefully dont make them again, and move on.

Jewel (Who believes it is wayyy easier to forgive others than herself)

Originally Posted by Blade

Sometimes this is also difficult for me. I realize I am fallible, I make mistakes and sometimes make choices that I live to regret. Usually with the latter it is a choice from the heart instead of from my head. I'm probably having a little trouble forgiving myself for some of those choices at this time.


I agree with this too femmy. I need to give it up real bad, but it just isn't happening. Not right now it isn't. But I keep praying for the release and the ability to forgive. I hope it is soon

[sylvie]

for me:

forgiveness is extremely hard in some circumstances.
only recently, i've been able to find some forgiveness for people in my past, the hardest to find forgiveness for was my mother, but it's a work in progress, and it's baby steps..

i think like Jewel mentioned in a previous post, i find forgiveness for others much easier than i find forgiveness for myself. that's the journey i'm on, right now... distancing them, helps me with forgiving - i can forgive but i cant forget..it takes a lot to get myself in a place where i can forgive.. i do the forgiving of others for peace in my own heart & mind, helps pave my way to move forward some more... slow journey, but one well worthwhile..♥

i will say tho, although it's hard in some situations to forgive, i tend to forgive very easily in day to day situations, i get walked over very easily.. i'm not much a stand up for myself kinda girl (tho i wish i was) my esteem is low, i know this.. and it's something else i shall work on more. sometimes, i think my lack of esteem allows me to forgive easily for the sake of keeping friendships, or keeping the peace..

now i think i'm all over the place with explaining myself that i don't even make sense anymore, lol!
*shutting up now*
absolutely loved that bit on what forgiveness is, Blade, ty for posting that!

[hpychick]

Femmy1,

Oh how very much I love you and even the fact that we share a common thread. I appreciate that the Universe brought us together, otherwise, it's likely that I wouldn't have met you - nor had my life so beautifully colored by you and your outlook on this existence.

I am still angry too. I can't imagine not being angry about those 3-1/2 years. I'm angry because of what I allowed, because I allowed it to continue, because I was blind and let the lies become my truths.

But more importantly, I can't imagine what my healing or my life would be like without your gentle spirit and the sweet love that you share with so many.

I am working on that healing just as you are. Process, as you know, isn't always easy - but it is alive and working. The day will come, and we will rejoice and be ecstatic!!! Party with FOOD!!!

You are in my heart and in my thoughts sweet femmy1!

Originally Posted by femmy1

There are several people/situations that I am having trouble finding forviness for. I wish it was easier but I am stuck... I am working on it, that's all I can say.

Seems like the more you need to give it, the harder it is sometimes to give.

f1~

[hpychick]

How can it be that we find it most difficult to forgive ourselves? Is it because we know what goes on in our minds after we thought we forgave someone or a situation, or yes, even ourselves?

I speak solely for myself. I am still hurting by my own doings. I am more angry with myself for allowing someone else to abuse me in their way. Yes, oh yes, I am angry with them! But I believe I am more angry at myself for not holding to my internal belief system.

I'm fine for a while and then a situation arises or a phone call comes in or a letter in the mail - and all of it comes bubbling back to the surface. Sometimes slowly - at 211 (right before the boiling point) - and sometimes ferociously, like an irate volcano.

There are nights I cry myself to sleep because I can't believe I'm still holding on. I cry because I am not free. I cry because I know, deep inside, there's a reason that I don't forgive.

There is the constant shadow following me, that walks in line with mine. One day I will turn around and it will be gone.

[Andrew, Jr.]

When it comes to my abusive childhood...I have problems with forgiving my bio-father. Anger seems to the main emotion I associate with him. There are times when I pity him, and there are times when I can forgive the abuses, and still love my father. It is just very mixed emotions when it comes to him. Obviously he is not my most favorite person in the universe. I just pray to God to help me with him. The years of abuse I endured. I really don't know how I would have turned out if I never was abused.

[Jaques]

Reading some of the posts on here, im not sure what to write on forgivness as although i have been abandoned as a baby, hurt emotionally and let down, ive not been through some of the awful experiences others have.
However, this is my feeling - i can honestly say that its never been in my heart to hate anyone, sometimes i have wanted to feel hate but it just isnt there - hurt yes but never hate.
I also feel we in the western world find it much harder to forgive ourselves than to forgive others, unlike our eastern counterparts. We have a different take on life. In the east they cannot imagine anyone not loving themselves, but how often do we hear of self hatred in the west. Its not that in the east people are selfish, but their attitude seems to be that if you cant love or forgive yourself first, then you are not very well equipped to love or forgive others and to me that makes sense. So over the years i have adopted that way of thinking and it has proved very useful in my life.

[Andrew, Jr.]

Forgiveness...it is a strange bird for me. The latest for me is that my oldest sister (bio) has been estranged from our parents for years. She has found inner peace that way. It was her free will to do so. I had to ask her if she was going to ask our parents to the wedding of her youngest daughter. She said no, so I acknowledged it. I am the kids favorite, so I will be there.

At the funeral of our sister JoAnn, our oldest sister, our parents never shed a tear in public. The opposite of everyone of us. It was strange. I mean you could see and hear everyone else crying. The Church was packed.

God made us a family, but yet the mental illness of our father has destroyed it. Prayers can help us for so much, but it is the real decisions of living and life that make us who and what we are. We need each other, no matter what anyone says, we do. Love is what it is all about.

The heartbreak of being disowned is horrible. I can forgive my parents, but it isn't something I forget. My parents have missed out on so much of my life. My parents are embarassed by me. They want nothing to do with me, and haven't for 30+ years. We can be civil with each other, but that is about it. We were forced into being civil with each other because of JoAnn. Now that she is gone, our relationship has gone back to being nothing. No contact whatsoever. It is best that way. It is a means of survival for me.

Forgiveness has different definitions. Some it means saying sorry, and letting it go. For others, it is thinking it, and asking God for help, but it is really just leaving it in God's Hands.

[SuperFemme]

Without forgiveness we find ourselves inextricably linked to a negative energy. I love love love what the OP said about what forgiveness is and isn't.

Because to me, forgiveness is the key that opens the doorway to healing.

[Lady Jewel]

!00% right Adele.

Originally Posted by SuperFemme

.

Because to me, forgiveness is the key that opens the doorway to healing.

[femmy1]

You are toooooo kind to say this.... and I feel quite the same !! It is strange how life brings us together !! Thank you for sharing this experience with me and validating me in that way. One day there will be others who will join our little club of healing and forgiveness !!

One day I was riding and saw a church sign that said... hatred corrodes the vessle in which it is contained.

It blew me away and it stays with me untill this very day. I try to hold the lesson and let go of the pain. Sometimes it is just hard to accept and that is what holds me back. I know , like you said, one day it'll be gone that gives me hope and hope is everything !! Thank you soo much !!

f1~

Originally Posted by hpychick

Femmy1,

Oh how very much I love you and even the fact that we share a common thread. I appreciate that the Universe brought us together, otherwise, it's likely that I wouldn't have met you - nor had my life so beautifully colored by you and your outlook on this existence.

I am still angry too. I can't imagine not being angry about those 3-1/2 years. I'm angry because of what I allowed, because I allowed it to continue, because I was blind and let the lies become my truths.

But more importantly, I can't imagine what my healing or my life would be like without your gentle spirit and the sweet love that you share with so many.

I am working on that healing just as you are. Process, as you know, isn't always easy - but it is alive and working. The day will come, and we will rejoice and be ecstatic!!! Party with FOOD!!!

You are in my heart and in my thoughts sweet femmy1!