SOPA/PIPA: What and why

[Sachita]

No Linus I mean REAL MAIL- the kind you put a stamp on? lol I know its a distant memory but its going on!

an email list is fine but snail mail at least is a back up for networking, events, socials etc. A

also you could, if it came down to it, set up a computer BBS with forums, chat, etc. Today with the voice over internet phone services, allow people to dial in. Have you ever been in a BBS system before? Most are ansi but pretty much the same- forums, newsgroups, chat, etc.

hmmm I wonder by using a VOIP phone dialed direct into a one computer means it part of the internet? Hmmmm not if you had a bank of number and people called in using their own voip service. My brain is hurting now, I'll stop. lol

[Sachita]

I use to operate worldgroup which was called glacticom way back then. I'm sure you can still get bbs software. The key is making it independent of internet.

People could play games, upload pics, pretty much everything you see without all the GUI interface. Users purchased credits to become members.

[Softhearted]

As someone who has worked in the world of music for about 20 years, I'm very sensitive to issues concerning copyright and intellectual property.

I hear a lot of uproar against SOPA and how bad it is but what would be your solution to stop piracy then?

People who work in the music, artistic industries should not work for free... and I'm not talking only about the artists per say... Many people are involved, from the guy who work in the CD packaging to the seller in a store...

Just my .02 cents

[Linus]

Originally Posted by Softhearted

As someone who has worked in the world of music for about 20 years, I'm very sensitive to issues concerning copyright and intellectual property.

I hear a lot of uproar against SOPA and how bad it is but what would be your solution to stop piracy then?

People who work in the music, artistic industries should not work for free... and I'm not talking only about the artists per say... Many people are involved, from the guy who work in the CD packaging to the seller in a store...

Just my .02 cents

The reality is that copyright infringement/piracy will never stop. The internet really caused this to explode and be more visible but it was done before the internet and will continue well beyond the current way the way the internet is. Part of it is cultural and part of it is technological. The reality is that this law is too broad.

I think that perhaps things aren't being address accurately. It has to be addressed two ways:

1. With things stored locally
2. Things stored outside of borders.

Locally (federally) can be address in regards to local laws. If the law had a mechanism where verification was done to ensure that reports were valid and that even the whistle blower wasn't a target (which under SOPA they could be). The realm of the FBI's white collar task force would be an appropriate law enforcement arm to work on this (since it would cross statelines due to the nature of the internet).

Internationally, treaties and in-state police task forces would be a better way to deal with those outside the border. Each state needs to create laws to address this and it should match what is agreed to on the treaty and should have similar minimum sentencing rules. Again, it should be based on verifiable information and not just because someone blows the whistle.

A bad law to address an issue is not better than no law to address it. If anything, it makes things worse.

[SuddenlyWestFemme]

Originally Posted by Softhearted

I hear a lot of uproar against SOPA and how bad it is but what would be your solution to stop piracy then?

People who work in the music, artistic industries should not work for free... and I'm not talking only about the artists per say... Many people are involved, from the guy who work in the CD packaging to the seller in a store...

Just my .02 cents

I also worked in the arts industry for a long time.

I don't really have an answer except to say that theft has always been a part of the industry. Many movies have been piloted through the ages. I can't tell you how many friends of mine made tapes for me off of records and other tapes. And at the time, I never even thought of it as theft. Listen to Lady Gaga and then Madonna (especially the "Express Yourself" song) and you can see how much 'borrowing' is going on. It used to be if someone shoplifted a CD, the people hurt were the storeowners and employees. With the internet that hurt has gone directly to artists more often.

I don't have an answer, but most artists I know wouldn't want the internet to shut down sites - without thorough and proper investigation - to protect them. It is very hard to be a successful artist without free speech and not being able to speak on this 'site' is a form of sensorship.

And one more side note. Pricing is based on expected theft. The reason everything is so expensive is because the industry now understands that there will be theft and they make up for it. I doubt that things will become cheaper for us to buy once we can't get onto our favorite websites.

[Softhearted]

So basically, there is no real solutions.... Good thing I left the music world... that was the main reason actually, sick and tired of seeing people not respect intellectual property and so on... in order to save a few dollars...

I switched to science, being the naive person I am, but no difference. I was looking today at sites and people writing about a specific subject... citing studies but with no actual sources

Hopefully, people will learn at least to cite their sources on internet sites... For me, it is a way to show some respect to intellectual property.

Again my 0.02 cents

[Linus]

Originally Posted by Softhearted

So basically, there is no real solutions.... Good thing I left the music world... that was the main reason actually, sick and tired of seeing people not respect intellectual property and so on... in order to save a few dollars...

I switched to science, being the naive person I am, but no difference. I was looking today at sites and people writing about a specific subject... citing studies but with no actual sources

Hopefully, people will learn at least to cite their sources on internet sites... For me, it is a way to show some respect to intellectual property.

Again my 0.02 cents

Laws that exist about not killing others hasn't stopped people from doing it. Even extreme solutions to those actions hasn't stopped them. While I wish that people were more respectful of each other, human nature is what prevents this.

We could try to control a person's life from start to finish to ensure that they are perfectly made so that they do not do the things we like but that isn't a solution either as that will stifle the creative spirit as well. When I was a professor I was insist on citing sources but few do that. I actually had to educate 3yr and 4th yr students. In college. I knew that in grade 9 so I wasn't sure what happened to education since when I graduated to current times other than information being even more freer.

The suggestions I put forward as ways to address this are potential solutions but there is no perfect solution. That is unrealistic. But I still stand by the fact that these laws do not help and, in fact, hinder -- particularly smaller entities who could effectively be shut down and not have any mechanism to recover. How is that better than what exists now?

ETA: and, I realized I should have asked one more question: in your opinion, how would this be better addressed? Do you think that SOPA/PIPA are sufficient or do you have a better solution on how to protect IP/copyright?

[Sachita]

Originally Posted by SuddenlyWestFemme

I also worked in the arts industry for a long time.

I don't really have an answer except to say that theft has always been a part of the industry. Many movies have been piloted through the ages. I can't tell you how many friends of mine made tapes for me off of records and other tapes. And at the time, I never even thought of it as theft. Listen to Lady Gaga and then Madonna (especially the "Express Yourself" song) and you can see how much 'borrowing' is going on. It used to be if someone shoplifted a CD, the people hurt were the storeowners and employees. With the internet that hurt has gone directly to artists more often.

I don't have an answer, but most artists I know wouldn't want the internet to shut down sites - without thorough and proper investigation - to protect them. It is very hard to be a successful artist without free speech and not being able to speak on this 'site' is a form of sensorship.

And one more side note. Pricing is based on expected theft. The reason everything is so expensive is because the industry now understands that there will be theft and they make up for it. I doubt that things will become cheaper for us to buy once we can't get onto our favorite websites.

This is true but that pirating also contributes to traffic and exposure. Any successful marketing plan needs to allow for a percentage of this. I also feel the music industry raped the public prior to charging 20 bucks for a CD? But this thread is not about that. But I do get your point.

[Cin]

The thing is piracy is more a service issue than one of censorship. Thieves will find ways to steal and peddle their wares no matter the restrictions. The way to win the war against piracy is to provide better service than you will get by illegally viewing or using copyrighted material. SOPA is about censorship and is akin to closing down a bookstore or a library because an author may or may not have practiced plagiarism. And at it’s core it is about controlling the flow of information on the internet and controlling it globally. The US has been applying pressure on other countries to join in using economic sanctions. This is one of those tricks the corporate controlled government is so good at confusing us with by using smoke and mirrors combined with the street hustler’s old game of 3 card monte. SOPA is not what it professes to be. It's about curtailing freedom, like so many laws being passed by the government. The internet should be protected. It needs to remain free. It is the greatest equalizer I have ever seen in this world. Information is available equally to anyone who can find a computer to use. To be coerced or hoodwinked into giving that up would be catastrophic.

[UofMfan]

Obama Says So Long SOPA, Killing Controversial Internet Piracy Legislation ~ Forbes

[SuddenlyWestFemme]

I sent my emails this morning. Grrrrrrr... the irony to me is how many republicans are for these bills. Isn't their whole platform supposed to be LESS government??!! Grrrrrrr....

Okay, I do understand that these bills have democrat and republican support and in fact are being sponsored by representatives of BOTH parties - but I never understand why republicans care so much about the government getting involved in these types of things (I include gay marriage in my wondering, but that's another issue) when their whole platform is 'LESS government'. Grrrrrrr....

[Kätzchen]

I signed the petition.