What makes a Butch "Butch"

[girl_dee]

at the risk of invading the butch space, i would like to say that for this femme, i don't want a shiny new mint condition butch, i like the battlescars, limps, silver top, and everything in between, every character trait,

i don't want what you used to be, i want who i see in front of me right now.

[Miss Scarlett]

Originally Posted by Cajun_dee

at the risk of invading the butch space, i would like to say that for this femme, i don't want a shiny new mint condition butch, i like the battlescars, limps, silver top, and everything in between, every character trait,

i don't want what you used to be, i want who i see in front of me right now.

Amen Sistah! i feel exactly the same way!

Clay, my beloved, Sexy Silver Butch...i love you just the way you are, for you are absolutely perfect in the eyes of my heart and those are the ones that matter...although the others do make it easier to avoid things like putting one's elbow in ice cream...

[clay]

Thank YOU & dee!!! I so appreciate your kind words...
as for "elbow in ice cream...umm that would be "frozen custard"...lol...too funny that episode was Honey, thank you for loving me..just as I am...huge grin

Originally Posted by Miss Scarlett

Amen Sistah! i feel exactly the same way!

Clay, my beloved, Sexy Silver Butch...i love you just the way you are, for you are absolutely perfect in the eyes of my heart and those are the ones that matter...although the others do make it easier to avoid things like putting one's elbow in ice cream...

[Miss Scarlett]

Originally Posted by claybaby

Thank YOU & dee!!! I so appreciate your kind words...
as for "elbow in ice cream...umm that would be "frozen custard"...lol...too funny that episode was Honey, thank you for loving me..just as I am...huge grin

LOL...it was frozen custard and you DID tell me to keep my eyes closed...

How could i possibly NOT love you just as you are?

[Wolfsong]

Originally Posted by Mr. Cynthia

I dress in what society-at-large considers "drag" every single day. I put myself out into the world as a woman-id'd butch who passes as a man just as often as not...and that is MY truth. Any comments here that might appear derisive toward drag seem to be directed inward at the posters who experienced awkwardness and discomfort in clothing that does NOT express their truths.

Throughout the course of my day I would say that I get addressed as a equal times as Sir or Ma'am. There are times that, for no apparent reason, when people address me as Sir I just want to scream at them "Are you fucking blind? Do you NOT see these tits? If these tits got any bigger they'd be required to have break lights and a license plate you dumbass!" but I just smile and move along. I've come to believe that this reaction is more about being hurt at being invisible to people than it does to my gender identity.

Originally Posted by Toughy

I never ever felt comfortable in a dress or skirt....except for military uniforms.....that kind of drag just is not me. I am the oldest generation in my family so I don't have to please parents grandparents aunties uncles and neither of my sisters would ever think I should wear a dress/skirt.

I went through a period where dresses and I didn't get along. I put on a kilt for a function once and something changed. (I know, weird!!) Now I am simply neutral on the issue. I am in general physically comfortable in the dresses/skirts that I have. They are modest in appearence and color. Not frilly or with coloful patterns or anything like that. The shoes not so much. Actually, the shoes make me feel way more gender-discomfort than the dress does. I hate those damn shoes!!

I do not wear dresses now except for special occasions where, for me, it is a sign of respect (Such as my cousin's funeral earlier this year) for my family. I should clarify that this is my choice to do that for them, they would be fine if I had worn respectful (in this case black) clothing.

*Laughing....in those situations I am still simply a butch in a dress.

[Toughy]

Originally Posted by Wolfsong

<snip>
There are times that, for no apparent reason, when people address me as Sir I just want to scream at them "Are you fucking blind? Do you NOT see these tits? If these tits got any bigger they'd be required to have break lights and a license plate you dumbass!" but I just smile and move along. I've come to believe that this reaction is more about being hurt at being invisible to people than it does to my gender identity.

<snip>

ok you made me spit donuts (yeah yeah I know real healthy) and coffee all over my puter...........laughin....

oh yeah welcome to the Planet.........

[Mr. Cynthia]

Originally Posted by Wolfsong

Throughout the course of my day I would say that I get addressed as a equal times as Sir or Ma'am. There are times that, for no apparent reason, when people address me as Sir I just want to scream at them "Are you fucking blind? Do you NOT see these tits? If these tits got any bigger they'd be required to have break lights and a license plate you dumbass!" but I just smile and move along. I've come to believe that this reaction is more about being hurt at being invisible to people than it does to my gender identity.

I used to get anxious every time I had to interact with people who don't know my name- would they call me sir, ma'am, he, she? Should I correct them? Should I make a joke or should I be all offended and snap at them?

Now, I just don't care.

Cashiers, wait staff, the guys at Jiffy Lube...they don't know that blue is my favorite color. They don't know that I collect Zippo lighters and books and sharp-pointy things. They don't know that I have a dog named Max and cats named Bella and Vinnie. Why should they know all about my gender identity/sexual orientation?

I just go with whatever they call me...which is especially funny when they call me "sir" 15 times and then look at the name on my Visa card- talk about priceless!

[Hollylane]

Originally Posted by Morgan

Would I do it again...perhaps, for me being a butch is not on the outside, but on the inside. I am a woman first and it felt good to embrace the feminine side of myself, if only just for a night.

I am sharing the link here. http://s206.photobucket.com/albums/b...gan%20picture/

I've chewed on this for a few days. I guess I just want to say that I don't think that feeling in touch with my femininity means that I need to put on a dress, make-up, pantyhose or high heels, or expect to be oogled by someone of another gender.

I don't feel like I am any less feminine when I am wearing hiking boots, hiking pants, and a t-shirt, struggling uphill, sweating and trudging through mud and muck. I feel strong, and I feel feminine, because that is who I am.

I don't mean to invade butch space, or discount anyone's experiences. I just don't feel that "What makes a Butch "Butch"" has anything to do with clothing. I think that what makes a butch "Butch" is about how they feel about themselves.

[Parker]

I havent yet evolved to the point where being called sir or having mail addressed to Mr. Wolf doesnt bother me. I would like to say that I have but it would be bullshit - it hurts and pisses me off at the same time - which is interesting, seeings how it happens all the time - you'd think I'd be used to it by now.

Like Wolfsong, I am surprised they dont see these huge tits - even in an over-sized t-shirt, they are still quite prominent and enter a room a few minutes before I do. I would love to get a breast reduction if for no other reason than to be able to lay on my stomach without having to adjust them and move them out of the way.

But I digress with my TMI ...

I have to agree with what Wolfsong said about being invisible - no, I dont expect strangers to know anything about my sexuality or gender identity, but being invisible as a woman simply because I am masculine gets tiresome - hell, it even happens on sites like this where "he/hy" is still the default for a lot of folks when addressing butches.

I dont like being invisible, but I refuse to change who I am or how I dress in order for others to "see" me; so I just have to suck it up and find a way to get past the hurt and anger and come to understand that no harm is meant - some people will just never see me.

I hope one day to evolve into that state of Zen where things like that dont even come up on my radar of things that bug the crap out of me.

[BullDog]

I don't pay much attention to whether someone calls me Sir, Ma'am, he, she etc when it's coming from store clerks or some other customer service person. I figure they are either required to say it or they are saying it out or habit. Not everyone who says "have a nice day" truly means it, lol.

When it comes to butch femme communities it is extremely invalidating and frustrating when male defaults are used. Most butches are not male or male id'd so why this continues to be perpetuated is truly beyond me. I thought we were trying to get past the binary. It's certainly not as bad on this site as others but it still occurs.

I am happy to refer to anyone by he or hy if that is what that individual prefers. However most butches are not he/hy and when it is used as a default I just feel the person doing it must be truly out of touch with the reality of how most butches live or they do it to not offend males (which is another sign of male being valued over female). The argument that we have to use he/hy for butches and she for femmes to tell the difference between the two is truly beyond ridiculous to me.

[Ginger]

Wolfsong wrote: "Throughout the course of my day I would say that I get addressed as a equal times as Sir or Ma'am. There are times that, for no apparent reason, when people address me as Sir I just want to scream at them "Are you fucking blind? Do you NOT see these tits? If these tits got any bigger they'd be required to have break lights and a license plate you dumbass!" but I just smile and move along. I've come to believe that this reaction is more about being hurt at being invisible to people than it does to my gender identity."



Wolfsong, your response to being mistaken for a man, despite your impressive boobage, made me remember fondly a butch lover who was almost always called "Sir," and who was confronted by security not once but twice in the time I knew her—after women reported a man in the ladies' bathroom.

She too marveled that anyone could mistake her for male, as her breasts were (and are, I suppose, though I haven't seen her for a while), absolutely huge.

What's interesting is that I read her as butch from the first moment I heard her beautiful deep voice on a friend's answering machine (she was trying to set us up, and knew I would swoon for it), and my reading never wavered, even though she is much more endowed upstairs, than I am.

Her breasts, in other words, did not feminize her. She didn't "present" them the way I present my own little girls, when we are dressing up to go out. She kept them under wraps, snugly out of the way. And they behaved, of course.

I think we "read" people based on certain indicators, and that we do this instantly and subconsciously. The signs that masculine energy is approaching were so clear, in my lover—physical aspects like her walk, her way of holding herself, her gaze, as well as cultural indicators, like her clothing—that the signs she is a woman became secondary.

I raise my glass (I mean, paper cup with coffee), to the large-breasted butch women out there in the world, who emit a welcome and much-appreciated vibe.

[Wolfsong]

Originally Posted by IslandScout

What's interesting is that I read her as butch from the first moment I heard her beautiful deep voice on a friend's answering machine (she was trying to set us up, and knew I would swoon for it), and my reading never wavered, even though she is much more endowed upstairs, than I am.

Her breasts, in other words, did not feminize her. She didn't "present" them the way I present my own little girls, when we are dressing up to go out. She kept them under wraps, snugly out of the way. And they behaved, of course.

I think we "read" people based on certain indicators, and that we do this instantly and subconsciously. The signs that masculine energy is approaching were so clear, in my lover—physical aspects like her walk, her way of holding herself, her gaze, as well as cultural indicators, like her clothing—that the signs she is a woman became secondary.

I raise my glass (I mean, paper cup with coffee), to the large-breasted butch women out there in the world, who emit a welcome and much-appreciated vibe.

I you right now. Thank you for that

[SleepyButch]

Originally Posted by IslandScout

Wolfsong wrote: "Throughout the course of my day I would say that I get addressed as a equal times as Sir or Ma'am. There are times that, for no apparent reason, when people address me as Sir I just want to scream at them "Are you fucking blind? Do you NOT see these tits? If these tits got any bigger they'd be required to have break lights and a license plate you dumbass!" but I just smile and move along. I've come to believe that this reaction is more about being hurt at being invisible to people than it does to my gender identity."



Wolfsong, your response to being mistaken for a man, despite your impressive boobage, made me remember fondly a butch lover who was almost always called "Sir," and who was confronted by security not once but twice in the time I knew her—after women reported a man in the ladies' bathroom.

She too marveled that anyone could mistake her for male, as her breasts were (and are, I suppose, though I haven't seen her for a while), absolutely huge.

What's interesting is that I read her as butch from the first moment I heard her beautiful deep voice on a friend's answering machine (she was trying to set us up, and knew I would swoon for it), and my reading never wavered, even though she is much more endowed upstairs, than I am.

Her breasts, in other words, did not feminize her. She didn't "present" them the way I present my own little girls, when we are dressing up to go out. She kept them under wraps, snugly out of the way. And they behaved, of course.

I think we "read" people based on certain indicators, and that we do this instantly and subconsciously. The signs that masculine energy is approaching were so clear, in my lover—physical aspects like her walk, her way of holding herself, her gaze, as well as cultural indicators, like her clothing—that the signs she is a woman became secondary.

I raise my glass (I mean, paper cup with coffee), to the large-breasted butch women out there in the world, who emit a welcome and much-appreciated vibe.

In my own experience, I used to have very large breasts but I always wore baggy shirts. I still thought they were noticeable. I think a lot of people don't look there once they see the short spikey hair and masculine looks. They just assume I'm male.

One time, I was walking out of the women's bathroom and a woman was coming in. She gave me a look, hesitated, walked back to see the woman's sign for the bathroom. I said.. you are in the right place and I walked out. lol

If I'm in a mood, I will correct them and many times, I get the response: Oh, I didn't look up. Another time, I was checking into a rather fancy hotel and the woman at the desk kept saying sir... I kept saying ma'am.. this happened several times and she never looked at me. She even had my driver's license with my name which is not a male name.

Now that I have longer hair (for me), I don't get mistaken for male as much. My breasts are smaller so that leads me to believe people just don't look at the whole person.

[lusciouskiwi]

Cleo Gardner (amazing Writer) wrote this...wished I had written it...it expresses my feelings sooo well....thank you Cleo!

♥♥♥ Butch Appreciation & Adoration ♥♥♥ to all the handsome, swarthy, perverted, warrior, two-spirted, gender bender, dapper, faggy, delicious, top, bottom, switch, witch, heart wounded, un/complicated, careful, pragmatic, chivalrous, rope tying, knitting, tool wielding, packing and anywhere on the masculinity/femininity spectrum Butches. those who are creating the geography of their own identity maps in the face of their constructed “otherness” ! To those who are gentle, firm, tender, those who make us proud to be on their arms, in their lives, their fantasies and a part of their dreams, the Butches who get harassed in the “ladies” rooms and those whose bodies refuse to conform. Those who stand quietly at the back of the room, bar, party but will be the first to step up when you need them.. those who smile even though they have struggled to get through the day dealing with homophobic looks and commentary as they live their everyday lives.. KNOW THIS.. as a Femme I love who you are and I’m aware that when I tell you you are damn fine and sexy that of course you squirm and blush because you enjoy it but it hurts my heart to know your discomfort also comes from being told you are ugly, too often.. yet you continue to challenge the heterosexist construct of being born female that is regurgitated relentlessly and for that humble but giant strength, I adore you.. understand that I have your back as I stand by your side.. That for me there is nothing more perfect and complete than a Butch who embraces their Butchness.. I will always notice your swagger and that your centre of gravity is low, growling vibrations that I can hear 100 metres away. The sound of your boots and the smell of your cologne lingers in my senses long after you have left the room.. Your energy, contradictions and essence are what fits my being and makes me feel I have found “home”. x

[Hollylane]

Originally Posted by IslandScout

Wolfsong wrote: "Throughout the course of my day I would say that I get addressed as a equal times as Sir or Ma'am. There are times that, for no apparent reason, when people address me as Sir I just want to scream at them "Are you fucking blind? Do you NOT see these tits? If these tits got any bigger they'd be required to have break lights and a license plate you dumbass!" but I just smile and move along. I've come to believe that this reaction is more about being hurt at being invisible to people than it does to my gender identity."



Wolfsong, your response to being mistaken for a man, despite your impressive boobage, made me remember fondly a butch lover who was almost always called "Sir," and who was confronted by security not once but twice in the time I knew her—after women reported a man in the ladies' bathroom.

She too marveled that anyone could mistake her for male, as her breasts were (and are, I suppose, though I haven't seen her for a while), absolutely huge.

What's interesting is that I read her as butch from the first moment I heard her beautiful deep voice on a friend's answering machine (she was trying to set us up, and knew I would swoon for it), and my reading never wavered, even though she is much more endowed upstairs, than I am.

Her breasts, in other words, did not feminize her. She didn't "present" them the way I present my own little girls, when we are dressing up to go out. She kept them under wraps, snugly out of the way. And they behaved, of course.

I think we "read" people based on certain indicators, and that we do this instantly and subconsciously. The signs that masculine energy is approaching were so clear, in my lover—physical aspects like her walk, her way of holding herself, her gaze, as well as cultural indicators, like her clothing—that the signs she is a woman became secondary.

I raise my glass (I mean, paper cup with coffee), to the large-breasted butch women out there in the world, who emit a welcome and much-appreciated vibe.

Bravo!....

[clay]

thanks, sweet lady!! Your words mean so much....I miss being able to walk any place, any time...but now I can't...
Like I said, I "waddle" so I will play with those Peabody ducks..maybe sneak a peek around the hotel lobby, find myself something to get into...and like YOU, I am so darn mischievious, I won't be "idle" too long..grins

Originally Posted by Cajun_dee

at the risk of invading the butch space, i would like to say that for this femme, i don't want a shiny new mint condition butch, i like the battlescars, limps, silver top, and everything in between, every character trait,

i don't want what you used to be, i want who i see in front of me right now.

[girl_dee]

mischievous?? MOI? oh dear

there are things we all miss in our lives, i miss my boobs not disappearing into my armpits when i lay down but hey life goes on.....

[clay]

Originally Posted by Cajun_dee

mischievous?? MOI? oh dear

there are things we all miss in our lives, i miss my boobs not disappearing into my armpits when i lay down but hey life goes on.....

hey I can bring a lasso and "wrangle" ducks...yea and a fishing pole and fish in the pool...can I borrow a pole and hook, dee one? lmao
I can make me some sushi with the fresh fish and have duck ala orange

[ArkansasPiscesGrrl]

Originally Posted by claybaby

thanks, sweet lady!! Your words mean so much....I miss being able to walk any place, any time...but now I can't...
Like I said, I "waddle" so I will play with those Peabody ducks..maybe sneak a peek around the hotel lobby, find myself something to get into...and like YOU, I am so darn mischievious, I won't be "idle" too long..grins

Clay, I am soooo looking forward to meeting you at the Reunion!!

[clay]

and I, you...lady!!!!

Originally Posted by ArkansasPiscesGrrl

Clay, I am soooo looking forward to meeting you at the Reunion!!