Tristan Taormino - loves butch girls

[Soon]

Originally Posted by Tawse

completely agree! however among my friendship group, I see a large portion of "as long as it's me or mine calling me a girl I'm ok with it".

So either way... I act according to whatever the person wants to be called.

I'm not referring to any of us who use the term *girl* in an affectionate or personal way b/w lovers and/or friends. Of course, whatever terms float your boat b/w you and your SO or peer group is cool. I am talking about the overuse and misapplication of the term *girl* by society at large when referring to women.

[Hollylane]

Originally Posted by HowSoonIsNow

I just need to pipe in and say that the word *girl* can be considered belittling/demeaning to those of us non-butches as well as it is often misapplied to adult women in general. When referring to adult males, the corresponding term of *boy* is rarely applied.

That being said, I don't believe the author of the quote is doing that here (being intentionally demeaning).

I just wanted to point out that the term *girl* is overused in general and can grate on all identities.

Originally Posted by HowSoonIsNow

I'm not referring to any of us who use the term *girl* in an affectionate or personal way b/w lovers and/or friends. Of course, whatever terms float your boat b/w you and your SO or peer group is cool. I am talking about the overuse and misapplication of the term *girl* by society at large when referring to women.

I completely agree HowSoonIsNow. I love that my Butch calls me her girl, or babygirl. When she says it, it doesn't feel like it is a way to refer to me as less than her, or childlike. It is said with love, and it makes me feel good.

But, I bristle when I hear it used in the manner that you describe. Society has a way of continuing to demean women by using words in a way that makes them sound lesser than men. Being the blunt person that I am, frequently puts me in the position of politely correcting people when they use "girl" in the demeaning way, and patiently explaining why it is not appropriate. I think most people are not even aware that they are doing it, because it is still so engrained in our culture when referring to women.

That's why the universe created people like us, who continue to coax others to evolve(whether they want to or not).

[skeeter_01]

Thanks so much Kobi!! I was just about to ask, who the heck is Tristan Taormino?? LoL!! You saved me the embarrassment of being told (and rightly so!) to go Google her!

[Kobi]

Originally Posted by skeeter_01

Thanks so much Kobi!! I was just about to ask, who the heck is Tristan Taormino?? LoL!! You saved me the embarrassment of being told (and rightly so!) to go Google her!

I should have done a little more research myself LOL.

This quote is from an article she wrote for the Village Voice back in 1999 entitled: Of Butches, Kings, and Masculinity.

The exact quote is the first paragraph of the article and was cleaned up a bit.

" I love butch girls. Girls with slick, shiny, barbershop haircuts, trimmed so short your fingertips can barely grip it. Girls with shirts that button the other way. Girls that swagger. Girls who have dicks made of flesh and silicone and latex and magic. Girls who get stared at in the ladies' room, girls who shop in the boys department, girls who live every moment looking like they weren't supposed to. Girls with hands that touch me like they have been exploring my body their entire lives. Girls who have big cocks, love blowjobs, and like to fuck girls hard. It is the girls that get called sir every day who make me catch my breath, the girls with strong jaws who buckle my knees, the girls who are a different gender who make me want to lay down for them."

Reading the paragraph within the context helps a lot. LOL. I can be such a freakin doofus.

The entire article is here: http://www.villagevoice.com/1999-10-...d-masculinity/

[~ocean]

the part that got my attention is u know how to play a womans body like an isntrument >>> hmm << wants to be a drum .. bang me baby ~ lol ?? j/k .. maybe not..

[Tawse]

Might I say... Tristan writes some very hot stuff... very... she's one of the top three on my list (along with Patrick Califia and Laura Antoniou)

[thedivahrrrself]

From a language perspective, I can see why she chose the word "girl". I don't think she would ever call a butch person a "girl", but in her writing, she chose the word that most contrasted with butch. Butch: tough, masculine, hard. Girl: sweet, feminine, soft. I think it was an creative artistic choice. I like the quote, though I can understand why you might object to it. I, however, think it's beautifully written. (And I don't think of butches as "girls". But I doubt the author does either.)

[CherylNYC]

Originally Posted by Kobi

I should have done a little more research myself LOL.

This quote is from an article she wrote for the Village Voice back in 1999 entitled: Of Butches, Kings, and Masculinity.

The exact quote is the first paragraph of the article and was cleaned up a bit.

" I love butch girls. Girls with slick, shiny, barbershop haircuts, trimmed so short your fingertips can barely grip it. Girls with shirts that button the other way. Girls that swagger. Girls who have dicks made of flesh and silicone and latex and magic. Girls who get stared at in the ladies' room, girls who shop in the boys department, girls who live every moment looking like they weren't supposed to. Girls with hands that touch me like they have been exploring my body their entire lives. Girls who have big cocks, love blowjobs, and like to fuck girls hard. It is the girls that get called sir every day who make me catch my breath, the girls with strong jaws who buckle my knees, the girls who are a different gender who make me want to lay down for them."

Reading the paragraph within the context helps a lot. LOL. I can be such a freakin doofus.

The entire article is here: http://www.villagevoice.com/1999-10-...d-masculinity/

Thank you for finding the complete quote, Kobi. I remember reading that in the Voice when Tristan wrote it. That was nearly 15 years ago, and we were all much younger! This piece was incredibly subversive at the time.

Back then I was more sensitive to any man, gay or straight, who called me or any other woman 'girl'. I corrected them relentlessly because... well I really don't have to bother explaining it. Everyone knows why it was so demeaning coming from a man. It was an especially dangerous word to use on me back in the 1980s when I was struggling so hard to be treated with respect while working as a carpenter/stagehand. Now I really don't care about 'girl' when it's applied to me unless it's thrown down in a way that's designed to infantilise me.

On the other hand, I certainly still get twitchy when anyone who isn't one of us refers to a butch as 'girl'. It seems as if that person isn't seeing the butch for who she is, and that gets me all wound up. It's interesting to re-read this quote now, because at the time I never even noticed the use of 'girl'. I think I must have been too distracted by the erotic content.

[*Anya*]

Originally Posted by Kobi

I should have done a little more research myself LOL.

This quote is from an article she wrote for the Village Voice back in 1999 entitled: Of Butches, Kings, and Masculinity.

The exact quote is the first paragraph of the article and was cleaned up a bit.

" I love butch girls. Girls with slick, shiny, barbershop haircuts, trimmed so short your fingertips can barely grip it. Girls with shirts that button the other way. Girls that swagger. Girls who have dicks made of flesh and silicone and latex and magic. Girls who get stared at in the ladies' room, girls who shop in the boys department, girls who live every moment looking like they weren't supposed to. Girls with hands that touch me like they have been exploring my body their entire lives. Girls who have big cocks, love blowjobs, and like to fuck girls hard. It is the girls that get called sir every day who make me catch my breath, the girls with strong jaws who buckle my knees, the girls who are a different gender who make me want to lay down for them."

Reading the paragraph within the context helps a lot. LOL. I can be such a freakin doofus.

The entire article is here: http://www.villagevoice.com/1999-10-...d-masculinity/

I would like to offer another perspective on this!

Before I read it to my butch, I said: "Just substitute butch for 'girl' when you hear it".

When I first read it, that actually is what I did mentally, instead of focusing on the word "girl" but you could substitute whatever ID or gender or gender-free ID that you prefer.

I absolutely loved it because butches in general and my love in particular; thrill and turn me on and my sweetie’s hair is trimmed so short I can’t even grip it and love it dearly *sigh*. Everything else in this paragraph also describes her to a T:

Butches "with slick, shiny, barbershop haircuts, trimmed so short your fingertips can barely grip it. Butches with shirts that button the other way. Butches that swagger. Butches who have dicks made of flesh and silicone and latex and magic. Butches who get stared at in the ladies' room, butches who shop in the boys department, and butches who live every moment looking like they weren't supposed to. Butches with hands that touch me like they have been exploring my body their entire lives".


(My apologies to Tristan for changing the context of her original article, which was written in 1999. A lot has changed in our knowledge and understanding of gender since that time, too).

[WickedFemme]

Originally Posted by skeeter_01

Thanks so much Kobi!! I was just about to ask, who the heck is Tristan Taormino?? LoL!! You saved me the embarrassment of being told (and rightly so!) to go Google her!

lol... I think she would just 'die' if someone didn't know 'who' she is cause of course she's all that. Anywho... I think she wrote that quote years and years ago before the whole gender identity revolution became so widely accepted within the lesbian or queer community.
She really doesn't know any more than any of us about gender identity, etc.. she just chooses to make it her job and her livelihood. I wouldn't look to her as the source of all knowledge. however, I'm sure the vanilla hetero world finds her quite remarkable, which is good cause she is paving the way towards societal acceptance of 'differences'.

[Dude]

Originally Posted by WickedFemme

I'm sure the vanilla hetero world finds her quite remarkable, which is good cause she is paving the way towards societal acceptance of 'differences'.

ohhh
so she is talking about butches TO straight people?
it's almost as if the word is used for "shock value"
and this explains that it was , I guess

it still has nothing but sting value for me

but
but
but
werent butches the anti-girls from the beginning of time?
I think so

[WickedFemme]

Originally Posted by Dude

ohhh
so she is talking about butches TO straight people?
it's almost as if the word is used for "shock value"
and this explains that it was , I guess

it still has nothing but sting value for me

but
but
but
werent butches the anti-girls from the beginning of time?
I think so

I'm not butch and it had 'sting' value for me too. so, I can only imagine how you must feel. At the time, I guess it was cutting edge for some... meh.

[Random]

So butch only comes in one flavor and if it's not the right flavor it has an ick factor?

That's how the last couple of posts felt to me...

Just because the term doesn't resound with you, doesn't make it less than or geared twards hetros...


This piece resounded with me...

I got what she was saying...

I like butch girls..(Ok, I like butch in just about any flavor, but have a weakness for a big ol butch who is a girl)

I happened to be partnered with one...

Nothing shocking, nothing cutting edge..

Just a big old hard working, hard fucking, gets called sir, taking up space butch who is also a girl...

[stonewalldog]

I took the "girl" word as playful myself. The hair part reminds me to go get a trim. It's getting a bit shaggy. Otherwise, I thought it was great!