"Butch" and "Femme" - Truly Antiquated Terms or More Marginalization?

AtLast · 06-01-2013, 03:28 AM

What is marginalizing and rather arrogant is the attempt to re-define or "update" anyone's self- identification. These are not simply terms, they describe human interaction and a dynamic between people of hstorical significance. And this dynamic among women has fought hard for inclusion for many years within the entire LGBTIQ umbrella.

GretaGable · 06-01-2013, 05:50 AM

I feel that each person should label themselves--or not label themselves--exactly as they see fit.

When I first realized my true sexuality, I was worried about not finding acceptance in the gay community because--frankly--I'm a femme attracted to other femmes. I love butches as friends, but there's just something about a pretty, feminine woman who is also strong and intelligent that just wildly attracts me.

Then I got to wondering just how butch or femme I really was. I wear makeup, I love flowers and flowery clothes, have hair past my shoulders, I have my apartment decorated in a distinctly Victorian style (or the Pepto Bismol pink motif, as some would call it), I stink at sports and have the mechanical skills of a tse tse fly. On the other hand I detest clothes shopping, am a fierce feminist in my political beliefs, have a tall, sturdy frame, don't go in for perms or manicures, and prefer comfy but colorful pantsuits over dresses.

Also, I wondered, should I really self-identify as lesbian? In my 20s I had some very passionate sexual and romantic relationships with men--all of whom had long hair and beautiful features.

Even now there are certain male celebs--everyone from actors Emmanuel Delcour, Channing Tatum and the late, great Patrick Swayze to musicians like Andy Biersack and Ashley Purdy from the band Black Veil Brides--that make my heart and other parts go all aflutter. Really, though, the average guy on the street does nothing for me, at least not in a romantic or sexual way.

Ultimately, I realized that all of the time I spent trying to analyze and categorize myself could be better spent toward building my career and character, toward thinking of others instead of focusing on myself. What's most important to me is that I try at all times to be a loving, hardworking, strong and giving person; the rest just kind of falls into place.

Greta

SaltyButch · 06-01-2013, 06:44 PM

Well this is a discussion I have to weigh in on, I am not a fan of labels, yet I find as I discover more about myself certain ones are applicable. I no doubt will give away my age when I say that I identified as gay for many many years and if asked that is the first response I will give. Now that I've come into this dynamic I find that the gentlemanly behaviours I display are known as Old School Butch who knew.

Are these terms marginalizing people or merely helping those who have nothing but a nickname identify those who they may be interested in. On the other hand I find that terms that have survived the test of time may be considered antiquated but they served and continue to serve a purpose.

So I shall gladly raise my hand and say that I am a lesbian butch who is gay and who embraces the b/f dynamic and is Old Fashioned and Old School and dang proud of it.

On a site such as this a "label" is only an introduction, the person is who you want to get to know.

Licious · 06-01-2013, 08:24 PM

I am greatly enjoying this thread.... appreciate everyone weighing in. I see how important it is for us to accept each other for the wonderful variety we bring. I admit there was a time I was brainwashed to be stand offish towards those I didn't understand very well. Now I learn and educate myself, and let love guide the way.

dykeumentary · 06-01-2013, 08:38 PM

Lately I've been enjoying calling myself a homosexual. As in "the same"- I am a woman who is sexual with other women. How did that term become subversive again?
Also it's been fun being an older butch dyke. It makes me smile when I see 20something gender queers sneaking looks at me. Makes me want to get a black cloak and a scythe, and point to them with a bony finger outstretched and pronounce "Yes. I am the Ghost of Lesbian Yet To Come! These are the chains I have forged in this life!" (a la Dickens), Then cackle manically.
I just am tickled every day to be a butch, and thankful every day that Femmes exist who like butch women.

06-01-2013, 05:50 AM	#2
GretaGable Junior Member How Do You Identify?: Xena femme Relationship Status: Single Join Date: May 2013 Location: Florida Posts: 16 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 4 Thanked 56 Times in 14 Posts Rep Power: 1319531	Butch/Femme I feel that each person should label themselves--or not label themselves--exactly as they see fit. When I first realized my true sexuality, I was worried about not finding acceptance in the gay community because--frankly--I'm a femme attracted to other femmes. I love butches as friends, but there's just something about a pretty, feminine woman who is also strong and intelligent that just wildly attracts me. Then I got to wondering just how butch or femme I really was. I wear makeup, I love flowers and flowery clothes, have hair past my shoulders, I have my apartment decorated in a distinctly Victorian style (or the Pepto Bismol pink motif, as some would call it), I stink at sports and have the mechanical skills of a tse tse fly. On the other hand I detest clothes shopping, am a fierce feminist in my political beliefs, have a tall, sturdy frame, don't go in for perms or manicures, and prefer comfy but colorful pantsuits over dresses. Also, I wondered, should I really self-identify as lesbian? In my 20s I had some very passionate sexual and romantic relationships with men--all of whom had long hair and beautiful features. Even now there are certain male celebs--everyone from actors Emmanuel Delcour, Channing Tatum and the late, great Patrick Swayze to musicians like Andy Biersack and Ashley Purdy from the band Black Veil Brides--that make my heart and other parts go all aflutter. Really, though, the average guy on the street does nothing for me, at least not in a romantic or sexual way. Ultimately, I realized that all of the time I spent trying to analyze and categorize myself could be better spent toward building my career and character, toward thinking of others instead of focusing on myself. What's most important to me is that I try at all times to be a loving, hardworking, strong and giving person; the rest just kind of falls into place. Greta

06-01-2013, 08:24 PM	#4
Licious Member How Do You Identify?: femme Preferred Pronoun?: she, her Relationship Status: single Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: California Posts: 686 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 3,502 Thanked 1,971 Times in 546 Posts Rep Power: 21474852	I am greatly enjoying this thread.... appreciate everyone weighing in. I see how important it is for us to accept each other for the wonderful variety we bring. I admit there was a time I was brainwashed to be stand offish towards those I didn't understand very well. Now I learn and educate myself, and let love guide the way. __________________ Don’t be satisfied with stories, how things have gone with others. Unfold your own myth. ~Rumi

06-01-2013, 03:28 AM	#1
AtLast Infamous Member How Do You Identify?: Woman Preferred Pronoun?: HER - SHE Relationship Status: Relating Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: CA & AZ I'm a Snowbird Posts: 5,408 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 11,826 Thanked 10,827 Times in 3,199 Posts Rep Power: 21474857	What is marginalizing and rather arrogant is the attempt to re-define or "update" anyone's self- identification. These are not simply terms, they describe human interaction and a dynamic between people of hstorical significance. And this dynamic among women has fought hard for inclusion for many years within the entire LGBTIQ umbrella.

06-01-2013, 06:44 PM	#3
SaltyButch Member How Do You Identify?: Old School Butch Preferred Pronoun?: he/she/hey you..... Relationship Status: open to the possibilities Tournaments Won: 5 Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: mississauga ontario canada Posts: 345 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 432 Thanked 1,633 Times in 301 Posts Rep Power: 21474852	Well this is a discussion I have to weigh in on, I am not a fan of labels, yet I find as I discover more about myself certain ones are applicable. I no doubt will give away my age when I say that I identified as gay for many many years and if asked that is the first response I will give. Now that I've come into this dynamic I find that the gentlemanly behaviours I display are known as Old School Butch who knew. Are these terms marginalizing people or merely helping those who have nothing but a nickname identify those who they may be interested in. On the other hand I find that terms that have survived the test of time may be considered antiquated but they served and continue to serve a purpose. So I shall gladly raise my hand and say that I am a lesbian butch who is gay and who embraces the b/f dynamic and is Old Fashioned and Old School and dang proud of it. On a site such as this a "label" is only an introduction, the person is who you want to get to know.

06-01-2013, 08:38 PM	#5
dykeumentary Member How Do You Identify?: butch dyke Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: NJ Posts: 449 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 341 Thanked 1,548 Times in 359 Posts Rep Power: 19160663	Lately I've been enjoying calling myself a homosexual. As in "the same"- I am a woman who is sexual with other women. How did that term become subversive again? Also it's been fun being an older butch dyke. It makes me smile when I see 20something gender queers sneaking looks at me. Makes me want to get a black cloak and a scythe, and point to them with a bony finger outstretched and pronounce "Yes. I am the Ghost of Lesbian Yet To Come! These are the chains I have forged in this life!" (a la Dickens), Then cackle manically. I just am tickled every day to be a butch, and thankful every day that Femmes exist who like butch women.