The Gendering of the Young

[evolveme]

Originally Posted by julieisafemme

My child finally did get a Bratz doll from her father. She played with it maybe one or two times and was over it.

My daughter liked boy things when she was little. Her first big girl panties were boys briefs with Thomas the Tank Engine on them. That is what she wanted. Now she likes sparkly pink stuff. I like girl stuff. Is it beacuse I was socialized that way? Maybe. Maybe not. You are exactly right in that it is hard to know what makes up gender.

Ha! I love her undies! Today, mine is thirteen and wears boxer briefs on occasion. I don't think it's a masculine gesture however. (I think she thinks it's sexy. Kill me.)

P.S. I told my wee one she could have Bratz when they started making an action figure (read: doll) for boys called Jerkz or Idiotz, but not a minute before.

[Gemme]

If I have a child, I'm not going to specifically aim for a gender neutral name, although it may very well happen, but it would not be a primary goal of mine. If I had a child and they felt their name did not fit them, and calling them by a nickname wasn't helping, and it was more than the usual "I hate my name" crap that most kids go through, then I'd help my child look into legally changing their name at an appropriate time (some time after bullies on the playground but before college apps when out).

As for toys and stereotyping sports or careers available to my child based on gender, I'm not having it. If I had a girl that loved Tonka trucks as much as Barbie, then she'll get both. If I had a son that really wanted to dance ballet or be a cheerleader then, by George, I'll do whatever I could to help him reach that goal.

Any child of mine will know two things, even if they forget anything else I will have taught them, they will know:

1. They are LOVED. Every day they will hear this, see this, feel this.
2. The only person(s) that can stop them from reaching their dreams and goals is their own self.

[BornBronson]

I always knew that i was loved by both my parents,but they were raised old school.My father is 81 this month and he alway told me that i could never be like him,which confused me because i'm just like him in many ways.But I suspect he was talking about me physically.My parents didn't care much that I was a tomboy,although i do remember once or twice my mother putting a dress on me,come to think of it it was probably only once,the other time must of been a bad nightmare.I played like a little boy(whatever that means) even though I knew that I was not one.I had two brothers that taught me the ways of being a guy,not that they were both experts themselves.The males in my family are sexist,you know the types,they believe men should look like men,women should look like women.Stuff like that only= insecurity in my book.But at a very young age I knew who I was and I never faught it,I just faught others who insisted that I look more 'womanly'.I was not like any 'normal looking girls' in this family/society,and I took pride in that.Yet still today I fight for who I am,I won't change for anyone,that includes my politics/beliefs/ect.Being a butch woman is a challenge in this world,but I like it.

[Nat]

My mom kinda dressed me butch. She's not super-girly and she didn't inflict supergirly things on me. When she was a little girl, she wanted to be an architect or an archeologist. She was interested in castles - how they were constructed and why. She built little houses for her dolls and then she was done playing with them.

I had a fascination with the barbie stuff. I loved my barbies - loved playing barbies with other girls. I also loved my troll dolls - they were great to play with. I think it was good to have flat-chested, pot-bellied, short, squat, wild-haired, by-no-means-pretty dolls to play with. I made them clothes, I took them outside with me and made homes out of twigs and leaves. I gave them whimsical names. I guess the trolls are what taught me that if you love something or someone enough, you find them beautiful.

I remember when I got to go next door and play with the neighbor boy. He had neat toys. They did things. Transformers, cars, the castle grayskull, games like mousetrap. I remember realizing that there was a difference there and that I didn't know how I ended up with only girl toys. I don't think it was my mom's choice though as much as it was the choice of gift-givers and hand-me-downers. My mom couldn't afford to buy me much.

I have always thought I would name my child a gender-neutral name, though the one I always wanted to name my kid has gotten very popular of late. I think that whatever the deconstructionalists would like to believe about gender, I think people are born with a certain sense of who they are. It may be influenced quite a lot from the external environment, but I think kids know what grates on them gender-wise as much as they know whether or not they like broccolli.

When I was a little kid - ever since I watched the movie Splash, I suppose - I mostly wanted to be a mermaid. To be wild, to have impossibly long hair, to breath under water, to live in the ocean and be magical. I may still want that. That bit of me that's a boy - I think he wants it too.

I have participated in the gendering of the young - at least so far as I've bought girl stuff for baby showers for girls. I don't think I'd do that now though. Kids are so unexpected in their preferences sometimes - it's neat to see without interfering too much. My mom had this whole peter rabbit thing going on with my babyhood - she really did try to avoid gendering me. It was the 70s and all. I still am surprised she doesn't consider herself to be a feminist.

[Medusa]

I saw this thread and was reminded of growing up and being larger than my other brothers and sisters and how that translated to my Mom and step-parents as "She's bigger, she can do "boys" work".

One distinct memory I have is that my Step-Dad owned a used car lot and body shop and he would make me come down to his shop every Saturday morning when I was 8 or 9 and pick up tools, move car parts, stack boxes, etc. He would also make me stack concrete blocks, clean out the horse pens, and bale hay.

I once asked my Mom why I had to help in the garage and work in the barn when my sister didnt have to. Her answer was, "Because your bigger and she's more frilly."

More "frilly" meant "she was a waif and I was a chubster".

Later, this translated into me being seen as "a tomboy", where my sister was a "princess", even though I was asking for the same red Reeboks and miniskirts (It was the 80s!)

Anyone else experience anything like this with size and gender conformity as a child? I know some of us have talked about being adults who are fat and how we are often seen as less feminine because of our size by the outside world.

Great discussion Nat!

[Cyclopea]

[Gemme]

Originally Posted by Cyclopea

Nice. Oversexualizing at an early age. When people get upset about the statistics for teen pregnancy, someone should show them this.

This may be the bitch in me speaking, but it would have been better with gay boys. That one girl was all over the place.

[SuperFemme]

Originally Posted by Cyclopea

Well.

That was ten kinds of disturbing wasn't it?
Where the HELL are their parents?

Did Jon Benet Ramsey not teach anyone anything?

[Enchantress]

Originally Posted by Cyclopea

I find this absolutely disturbing.

Little girls too young to even have curves or breasts yet, being taught such overtly sexual moves and suggestive ways.

As for the original video, I don't believe the father meant anything offensive. He simply reacted as almost anyone would.

It's impossible to tell in this video if it was meant as a *You're not a girl stop being a sissy way*. I believe that the father was simply playing with his son.

I do find it fascinating though how the child reacted. He's much too young to know that there are boy things and girl things (as placed by society). He simpy went with instinct to have fun and be a part of something. He seems to be not only upset about not being able to do as his sisters were, but also humiliated at the fact that he made some sort of a mistake (or so he thinks). Such moments, even if not in the forefront of our minds, stay with us for a lifetime.

I do not feel that giving a little girl pink things and a little boy blue things makes or breaks their sexuality or sense of being.

Instead, it is when a parent or person of authority berates and forces a child into a role or situation, or does not respect the childs wishes for certain toys and such (based again on what they believe society finds acceptable) that it becomes dangerous, cruel and oppresses their (the childs)spirit.