The Gendering of the Young

[Dance-with-me]

I thought I'd posted here before but apparently not. I've been raising my 6yo granddaughter since she was 20m, and she is "gender variant" and every year further affirms that she will be a boy named Michael when she grows up.

While I completely agree with Dykeumentary about wishing that colors and accessories weren't gendered, I have also seen that for a lot of these kids, having those gendered markers is crucial to their gender expression. For some kids it really is just about liking sequins or spiderman, pink or red, dolls or trucks. But for some of these kids the really important thing is to have something that allows people to recognize and validate that their gender does not match their bodies.

Want to write more but too difficult on my iPhone!

[dykeumentary]

Originally Posted by Dance-with-me

I thought I'd posted here before but apparently not. I've been raising my 6yo granddaughter since she was 20m, and she is "gender variant" and every year further affirms that she will be a boy named Michael when she grows up.

While I completely agree with Dykeumentary about wishing that colors and accessories weren't gendered, I have also seen that for a lot of these kids, having those gendered markers is crucial to their gender expression. For some kids it really is just about liking sequins or spiderman, pink or red, dolls or trucks. But for some of these kids the really important thing is to have something that allows people to recognize and validate that their gender does not match their bodies.

Want to write more but too difficult on my iPhone!

Agreed, Dance-With-Me, but the reason I posted this is because they are using sequins as a marker for homosexuality. As usual, it comes back to consent. If a child chooses to use "gendered markers" to indicate their gender, that is great. My question is: To which markers can a child give informed consent that have anything to do with the kind of sex they'd like to have as an adult?

I guess the thing that makes me most sad about this is its just another article reinforcing tired old sexist assumptions. Not surprising that they reference the HRC several times.

[~baby~doll~]

In a society which is rife with gender stereotypes and biases, children regularly learn to adopt gender roles which are not always fair to both sexes. As children move through childhood and into adolescence, they are exposed to many factors which influence their attitudes and behaviors regarding gender roles. These attitudes and behaviors are generally learned first in the home and are then reinforced by the child's peers, school experience, and television viewing. However, the strongest influence on gender role development seems to occur within the family setting, with parents passing on, both overtly and covertly, to their children their own beliefs about gender. This overview of the impact of parental influence on gender role development leads to the suggestion that an androgynous gender role orientation may be more beneficial to children than strict adherence to traditional gender roles.

http://gozips.uakron.edu/~susan8/parinf.htm

We are assigned these roles before we get home and are expected by tradition to adapt and follow what has gone before us.
Melissa says in her song Gotta Go Now

Women can work
As long as dinner is done
And if you let little girls play with trucks
Their sexuality gets all screwed up
This is so the truth about being forced into expectations rather than allowing us to be who we are.

[Ginger]

Every time we reach for an article of clothing to get dressed in the morning we're making a decision based on countless considerations; some conscious, some unconscious. It isn't possible to dress in a neutral way.

As adults on this site supporting the butch/femme identity, our clothes might be seen to send signals as to our sexual preference.

I don't dress "like a femme" because I'm supporting the binary gendering of girls in childhood. But some might interpret it that way.

I also don't dress this way because I'm sending a message to butch women, though that's a perk I guess.

So why do I affect a stereotypically feminine appearance (if you don't look too closely)?

Can't even begin to answer that one right now. But good thread! I like the questions it brings up.

[Nat]

I saw this posted on facebook - no idea if it's a true story or not, but it's cute.

[puddin']

i was kicked out of ballet, not girl enough.
i was kicked out of girl scouts, not girl enough.
i neva wanted to be girl enough, so thank you vera much...

[Greyson]

I think each and everyone of us are impacted by the stereotyping of gender markers. Can children really make an informed decision on many things? Most likely some can and some cannot. (BTW, it depends on one's interpretation of "informed".)

Here is an article/link I ran across today. For better or for worse this camp for young genderqueer cis-boys, I think is a step forward. There is a space where they are free to express their gender without harsh retribution, judgement.

Here is another link on a blog that offers some comment, thought to as the why and how of it in gender expression of genderqueer children.

http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2012/...on-better-hed/

__________________________________________________ _______

A Boys' Camp to Redefine Gender

By David Rosenberg | Posted Monday, July 15, 2013

Over the past three years, photographer Lindsay Morris has been documenting a four-day camp for gender nonconforming boys and their parents.

Although it is unknown if the kids at the camp will eventually identify as gay or transgender—or even if the way gender and sexuality are defined throughout society will evolve—the camp allows the kids to look at themselves in a completely different way.

Read More:
http://www.slate.com/blogs/behold/20...lugin_activity

[Nat]

Ran across this today on facebook and found it hopeful.

[Sheridan]

As a little kid I fought against those that tried to make me a little cute girl. I would ask my mother for boy toys and she let me have them. If I was given dolls I played superheroes and cops and robbers with them not house and barbie dream house (my dolls were GI-Janes). My favorite things were my toy cars and trucks, my bicycle, and stuff animals (which every gender in childhood love, they are soft and cuddly). I would not wear girlie clothes and if someone tried to stick me in pink and ruffles, I threw a total fit.

This kid is my hero:

[Soon]

Campbell Co. girl asked to leave school because of boyish appearance



Campbell Co. girl asked to stop attending school because of her "boyish" looks

LYNCHBURG, Va. -
You won't have any problem getting Sunnie Kahle to open up about her hobbies.


The energetic eight-year-old will proudly show you her collection of coins, hunting knives, and autographed baseballs.

"It's fun," she explained, when asked why she enjoys collecting those items.

Kahle likes teddy bears and colorful bracelets, but for the most part she's interested in things that might be considered "boy hobbies."

"Sunnie realizes she's a female, but she wants to do boy things," said Doris Thompson, Kahle's great-grandmother and legal guardian. "She wants to play rough and tough."

Thompson has raised Kahle since she was an infant. When she turned five, Thompson said she asked for a short hair cut.

"She had hair down to her waist and she wanted to give it to a child with cancer," said Thompson. "After we cut her hair she started wanting to wear jeans and a t-shirt. She didn't want to wear her frilly dresses anymore."

Her appearance started leading to awkward questions at school.

Kahle said her classmates would occasionally ask if she was a boy or a girl, but she said the question did not hurt her feelings.

The issue caught the attention of administrators at Timberlake Christian School, where Kahle was a student.

Elementary principal Becky Bowman sent home a letter last month, reminding Thompson of the school's religious affiliation and it's right to refuse students who contradict a "biblical lifestyle."

"We believe that unless Sunnie and her family clearly understand that God has made her female and her dress and behavior need to follow suit with her God-ordained identity, that TCS is not the best place for her future education," Bowman wrote in the letter, which was given to WDBJ7 by Thompson.

Thompson said she was offended by the letter's language and its references to biblical passages about sexual immorality.

"To claim that we are condoning sexual immorality in our home is nonsense," Thompson said. "We are Christians. We understand the Bible. Sunnie knows it very well. She has accepted Christ."

Thompson says Kahle is simply a tomboy, and that she's too young to understand sexual orientation or gender issues.

"If my child grows up to be homosexual or transgendered, I will love her that much more," Thompson said.

Although she wasn't forced to leave, Kahle is now in public school and no longer attending Timberlake Christian. She wishes things would have turned out differently.

"I should just be able to be me and not let them worry about it," Kahle said.

Jeff Abbett, administrator of Timberlake Christian Schools, sent WDBJ7 the following statement Tuesday afternoon:

"We are heart-broken that Sunnie’s grandparents have made her the subject of a public discussion. We regret that they made the decision to withdraw Sunnie immediately from Timberlake Christian Schools.

For confidentiality reasons related to a minor, it is not possible for us to explain in full detail the volume of documentation we have concerning the situation that the grandparents have made public. There is much more to this story than has been revealed related to Sunnie and the classroom environment. Our documentation shows a significantly different narrative than the one portrayed in the original news report.

You can be assured that we have cared for Sunnie and worked with her grandparents for several years to assist them. Our TCS teachers and administrators love Sunnie and we can assure everyone that this has never been an issue of hair length or boots as it has been portrayed. It has been our constant desire over the last several years to work with this family and to shepherd this precious little girl in a way consistent with traditional values.

As a private Christian school, we have the responsibility to all our students to assist parents to instill the Christian values upon which our school is founded.

We reiterate that the decision to remove Sunnie was entirely that of the grandparents."

Thompson said that Kahle never had any behavioral issues at TCS and maintained a 4.0 average in her academic work. She said the only disciplinary issue that Kahle might have caused was that she wanted to wear boy's pants as part of her school uniform.

[Soon]

http://www.wdbj7.com/blob/view/-/251...s-Thompson.pdf

[Ginger]

Maybe they need to make their policy toward students' gender expression more clear in their admission and recruitment materials. I'm assuming it's a private school, and doesn't receive federal or state funds.

[EnderD_503]

Originally Posted by Soon

http://www.wdbj7.com/blob/view/-/251...s-Thompson.pdf

That letter is just gross. God-ordained identity? Bloody hell

[*Anya*]

8 year-old girl disqualified from soccer game because she 'looks like a boy'

SPRINGFIELD, Nebr. (WOWT) Mili Hernandez is 8 years-old. She loves soccer - and her short haircut.

Mili told WOWT 6 News: "When my hair starts to grow I put it short because I've always had short hair. I didn't like my hair long."

Mili plays soccer for Omaha's Azzuri Cachorros girls club team. She's so good that she plays on the 11 year-old roster even though she's 8. Her father, Gerardo Hernandez, couldn't be more proud. He told WOWT 6 News: "It's what she likes. It's what she always wants to do - play soccer."

This weekend Mili helped lead her team to the finals of the Springfield Soccer Club girls tournament. However, before taking the field on Sunday, Mili and her team were suddenly disqualified. Springfield soccer organizers insisted Mili was a boy.

Gerardo Hernandez told WOWT 6 News that his daughter "was in shock." He continued: "She was crying after they told us... They made her cry."

Mili added: "Just because I look like a boy doesn't mean I am a boy. They don't have a reason to kick the whole club out."

Mili's family claims they showed her insurance card to tournament organizers in an effort to prove she's a girl. It wasn't enough.

Mili's brother, Cruz Hernandez, told WOWT 6 News: "They didn't want to listen. They said the president made his decision and there wasn't any changing that."

Mili told WOWT 6 News she thinks the situation isn't fair. However, she won't let it stop her from playing. She said: "There's other tournaments that I can play."

Springfield Soccer Club organizers declined WOWT 6 News's request for an interview, directing us to contact their attorney on Monday, instead.

Organizers also said if Mili's family wants to challenge the disqualification they can appeal it with the Nebraska State Soccer Association.


http://media.graytvinc.com/images/690*448/MILI1.JPG

http://www.wowt.com/content/news/8-y...426397041.html

[Soft*Silver]

I was talking to my 3 year old grand daughter about her 3 month old baby sister. A friend of theirs had had a baby boy. I told her that if her baby sister had been born a boy, he would be her brother. She was adamant that she would be her sister...I was trying to explain to her gender...and caught myself...and listened to her. THIS is where it starts. This gender role assignment of others. We dress them in pink or blue and thats when self assignment begins but to assign others, its in the ID of brother sister, mommy daddy...

I really listen to her...she has alot to teach me...

[Gemme]

Originally Posted by *Anya*

8 year-old girl disqualified from soccer game because she 'looks like a boy'

SPRINGFIELD, Nebr. (WOWT) Mili Hernandez is 8 years-old. She loves soccer - and her short haircut.

Mili told WOWT 6 News: "When my hair starts to grow I put it short because I've always had short hair. I didn't like my hair long."

Mili plays soccer for Omaha's Azzuri Cachorros girls club team. She's so good that she plays on the 11 year-old roster even though she's 8. Her father, Gerardo Hernandez, couldn't be more proud. He told WOWT 6 News: "It's what she likes. It's what she always wants to do - play soccer."

This weekend Mili helped lead her team to the finals of the Springfield Soccer Club girls tournament. However, before taking the field on Sunday, Mili and her team were suddenly disqualified. Springfield soccer organizers insisted Mili was a boy.

Gerardo Hernandez told WOWT 6 News that his daughter "was in shock." He continued: "She was crying after they told us... They made her cry."

Mili added: "Just because I look like a boy doesn't mean I am a boy. They don't have a reason to kick the whole club out."

Mili's family claims they showed her insurance card to tournament organizers in an effort to prove she's a girl. It wasn't enough.

Mili's brother, Cruz Hernandez, told WOWT 6 News: "They didn't want to listen. They said the president made his decision and there wasn't any changing that."

Mili told WOWT 6 News she thinks the situation isn't fair. However, she won't let it stop her from playing. She said: "There's other tournaments that I can play."

Springfield Soccer Club organizers declined WOWT 6 News's request for an interview, directing us to contact their attorney on Monday, instead.

Organizers also said if Mili's family wants to challenge the disqualification they can appeal it with the Nebraska State Soccer Association.


http://media.graytvinc.com/images/690*448/MILI1.JPG

http://www.wowt.com/content/news/8-y...426397041.html

This is effin ridiculous. I would challenge the board. Absolutely.

[Steele]

That's just ridiculous, they should totally challenge the board....

[lisa93]

I do and don't to an extent.

[Nat]

Ran across this today and thought of this thread:

Girl Was Denied Her First Communion If She Wore A Pantsuit

ST. JOHN, Indiana -- Thanks to a viral Facebook post, a 9-year-old girl from Indiana is receiving major support after getting banned from wearing a pantsuit to her first holy communion.

An Indiana girl who was banned from wearing a pantsuit to her First Holy Communion is getting support after her mom's Facebook post went viral. (Chris Mansell/Facebook)

The mother of Cady Mansell said her daughter planned to wear a white pantsuit to receive the Roman Catholic sacrament last month at St. John the Evangelist Parish in St. John, Indiana.

"Me and my mom were talking about what I was going to wear and I said, 'I want to wear a white suit!'" Cady said. "But I don't really like dresses, I don't like them. They're too itchy."

"She felt beautiful in this suit. And she wears suits all the time. She's worn suits for school pictures. She just wore a suit to the daddy-daughter dance in January," said Chris Mansell, Cady's mother.

But when the day arrived, Cady was not allowed to wear pants because the church required a dress.

"If your daughter wears a suit, comes here in a suit on Sunday. She will not be given communion and will be asked to leave," Chris Mansell said the priest told her. "So my husband said, 'Well, I guess we're done here. I think I'm leaving your church.'"

Not only did Cady miss her first holy communion, the Mansell family said they've decided to move to a different church in Crown Point.

On Wednesday, a spokeswoman from St. John the Evangelist released a statement, emphasizing that this was only a dress code issue, nothing more.

"St. John the Evangelist uniformly enforces dress codes at our parish school and for religious rites," the statement said. "We often have requests for exceptions to the dress code, ranging from sneakers to the color of one's shirt; thus, we have consistently chosen to adhere to the dress code rather than allowing a myriad of exceptions to it."

A blogger contacted Chris about her daughter possibly being transgender. Her response was that she is not.

"The writer said Cady was transgender. While I have no problem with that, she is not - or hasn't expressed that. She's nine. Right now, I joke that the only thing Cady identifies as is a Jedi or a Storm Trooper," her mother said.

Chris said in her Facebook posts that Cady's pants weren't the only issue. She said the priest at St. John the Evangelist made comments about their parenting and, ultimately, that's the reason the family decided to leave the church.