Trust and Technology

[Ginger]

Originally Posted by Girl_On_Fire

I've heard in some committed relationships, the understood and expected norm is shared email addresses, cell phone numbers, Facebook accounts, and passwords for everything. Oftentimes this isn't just for convenience but for the express purpose of checking up on each other and "keeping each other honest" in the relationship.

How do you feel about this behavior for the above-mentioned purpose? Is this the established rule in your committed relationship? Or do you believe this crosses certain personal boundaries? Or are you somewhere in between?

I think it sounds incredibly invasive, to be that merged with someone, that "watched." I would never get to that level of commitment with someone that needy of access to my every interaction with others.

And now I'll tell you what I really think!

[Angeltoes]

I started to respond to this the other day and changed my mind because I knew my view would be different from the majority. Well here it is anyway. I don't understand why it is that we are so careful about judging others when it comes to certain choices like, say, D/g or D/s lifestyles but when it comes to other relationship choices it's perfectly fine to point our fingers and call it creepy. To be sure, I would not share my personal passwords to social networking sites. Sharing other personal info I have done and might do in the future if the situation called for it. I just find the judgments to be really unnecessary. If 2 or 3 or 20 people agree to something and it works for them, it's not my place to say it's wrong. Conservatives go around calling everything different 'creepy.' There is nothing creepy in a consensual relationship imo. It only becomes creepy when somebody is being victimized.

[Amber2010]

If you have been cheated a few times I do understand the issues. I myself don't want any partner I have now or later to give me their personal information like that. First I feel that is kind of like looking in their wallet for phone numbers and it is wrong. It would be a problem with me and not with them. I believe in treating each relationship with new eyes and to trust first. If it gets where I feel I can't trust that person than it is time to take a good hard look at myself and why am I even in that relationship. Love without trust ruins any relationship in the end. Again this is just my point of view.

[Sachita]

Originally Posted by Angeltoes

I started to respond to this the other day and changed my mind because I knew my view would be different from the majority. Well here it is anyway. I don't understand why it is that we are so careful about judging others when it comes to certain choices like, say, D/g or D/s lifestyles but when it comes to other relationship choices it's perfectly fine to point our fingers and call it creepy. To be sure, I would not share my personal passwords to social networking sites. Sharing other personal info I have done and might do in the future if the situation called for it. I just find the judgments to be really unnecessary. If 2 or 3 or 20 people agree to something and it works for them, it's not my place to say it's wrong. Conservatives go around calling everything different 'creepy.' There is nothing creepy in a consensual relationship imo. It only becomes creepy when somebody is being victimized.

I don't think they are talking about the consensual choice to give up control but insecurity and trust issues. There is a dynamic you want to dial into and if it means giving up your privacy then its a choice. Plain and simple.

I am not a jealous person. I AM a controlling person. But I have no real desire to check up on someone or invade their privacy. I wouldn't want the same. In fact the moment someone suggest it or questions my intention I'm history. I just can't deal with jealousy and insecurity.

[*Anya*]

Originally Posted by Angeltoes

I started to respond to this the other day and changed my mind because I knew my view would be different from the majority. Well here it is anyway. I don't understand why it is that we are so careful about judging others when it comes to certain choices like, say, D/g or D/s lifestyles but when it comes to other relationship choices it's perfectly fine to point our fingers and call it creepy. To be sure, I would not share my personal passwords to social networking sites. Sharing other personal info I have done and might do in the future if the situation called for it. I just find the judgments to be really unnecessary. If 2 or 3 or 20 people agree to something and it works for them, it's not my place to say it's wrong. Conservatives go around calling everything different 'creepy.' There is nothing creepy in a consensual relationship imo. It only becomes creepy when somebody is being victimized.

I read and re-read everyone's responses here.

People in this thread were calling behaviors creepy.

No one is saying that particular individuals were creepy.

Everyone here is stating their own opinion, just as you are stating yours.

We can each have an opinion without it being called a judgment. I sit in judgment of no one but have a strong feeling about many issues.

Unless someone says that how I personally feel about something is wrong- anyone is free to have a different opinion than mine!

I actually try to have an open mind because if someone states a very good case for a perspective different than mine-it may change how I look or feel about a particular issue.

That is how I see this issue.

[kannon]

Originally Posted by *Anya*

I read and re-read everyone's responses here.

People in this thread were calling behaviors creepy.

No one is saying that particular individuals were creepy.

Everyone here is stating their own opinion, just as you are stating yours.

We can each have an opinion without it being called a judgment. I sit in judgment of no one but have a strong feeling about many issues.

Unless someone says that how I personally feel about something is wrong- anyone is free to have a different opinion than mine!

I actually try to have an open mind because if someone states a very good case for a perspective different than mine-it may change how I look or feel about a particular issue.

That is how I see this issue.

Imagine telling a child that his or her behavior is creepy. What if you found your 4 year old child touching their genitalia and you told them that's creepy or demented. Whether his or her behavior is considered socially inappropriate, is it okay to belittle them? I don't think so. There have been a significant number of studies that show that punishment (e.g. denigration) fails to serve any positive outcomes. Conversely, punishment, and in this case humiliation, usually have negative outcomes.

[Scuba]

Originally Posted by kannon

Imagine telling a child that his or her behavior is creepy. What if you found your 4 year old child touching their genitalia and you told them that's creepy or demented. Whether his or her behavior is considered socially inappropriate, is it okay to belittle them? I don't think so. There have been a significant number of studies that show that punishment (e.g. denigration) fails to serve any positive outcomes. Conversely, punishment, and in this case humiliation, usually have negative outcomes.

Kannon, with all due respect, we're not referring to children or punishment here. I agree, if this were an open forum for those under the age of 21 to view, then this thread could potentially be called into question. As it is, this is not the case. We're all adults here and are here to express opinions. Granted, opinions are judgement but no one here has said that anyone specifically is wrong, bad or otherwise weird and creepy for having them. They have simply stated how they themselves see certain types of behaviors.

It takes a strong person to stand in their convictions. It takes a stronger person to do this with compassion and understanding. I know my first instinct, when in the minority on a topic, is to get defensive. The only reason I do get defensive is because I personalize something someone said. That's on me and not on them. Just because I don't agree and just because I have an opinion doesn't mean I think anything less of others who differ from me.

For me, it's all about respect...

Scoobs

[Angeltoes]

Anya, I've noticed you bicker quite a lot on this site, however I am excellent at ignoring that kind of childish behavior. My sweetheart replied again, so I'll have one last say and then I'm done.

Suppose we feel certain sexual behaviors are creepy? Let's say behaviors such as bondage or daddy/girl. How well do you think it would go over if we decided to start calling those practices creepy on this website? I mean, sure you could do that. You'd be perfectly entitled to call those behaviors creepy just like those who enjoy those things would be entitled to tell you to get a life, mind your own business and stop being so judgmental. And that's basically what I'm saying now. You may say password sharing is creepy behavior and I personally have my own opinions about your behavior, but I'll keep them to myself. I
f I made the effort I would not use words like creepy because as a thinking, sensitive adult I see no reason to offend you.

[Angeltoes]

Heck no, I certainly won't apologize. I spend too much time here anyway. I have no idea why this thread was resurrected...not too happy about that. But please do whatever you think fits. See ya.

[imperfect_cupcake]

my wife and I had one bank account. My bank kept fucking me around and I just closed my account and stuck it in hers. We shared her bank card. One card. It never caused a problem. I don't why it didn't, it just didn't. Niether of us gave a shit because my money was hers, and hers was mine. All of our money was needed to be pooled for all of the bills, there was almost nothing left over. I budgeted what we had and told her how much shared spending money we had for the week.
if I spent anything that cost more than £10 I asked if that was ok with her first - we had to, we were fucking broke. Sometimes we didn't have enough bus fare and had to walk places.

I knew her passwords to her email accounts because I had to respond on her behalf to some things, english was her second language and writing is my strong point. she often got me to take care of the home admin and her personal admin, which ment as I had to respond as her. I would never open the emails. I only wrote them.

She trusted me to do this and I never broke it till the very end when I new she had been with a work collegue, sexually. I went away for three days to get support from my friends and for her to think about the marriage. when I came home, her bike was gone. I went into her email and found out just how long it had been going on. six weeks. they had been planning it for six weeks. She had been open about her sleeping with someone else, but not that she had been plotting it. I also found out that she had been lying about me, telling this girl she was looking after a mentally ill wife.

I'm glad I read those emails. I helped me to pack a bag of her stuff and throw it outside instead of asking her to work on the marriage, which is what I was asking her to do. She broke my trust, she broke the trust of the marriage and I had NO qualms about setting myself straight with info she had been lying by omission.

I even wrote the new gf and informed her of the lies - from her account.

I then closed her email and told her so she could change the password.

I would only do it again under similar circumstances.

I don't have a passcode on my phone. I don't need one.
I have one for my laptop but I have given it to my flatmate and my best mate.
I gave it to my date when she was visiting so she could book a ticket.

My FWB and I used to be OVERJOYED when we found each other's facebook open and logged in. Cause I LOVE leaving posts like "I just found an old dildo on the street and have decorated it to hang in my front window. please make sure you have a good look next time you come by. I think it sets the living room off nicely"
HAHAHAHAHA
She'd put "_______ (her name) is an amazing and wonderful being. In fact my favourite being ever. I will cook for her every day and do her laundry whenever she asks" etc. if she caught mine.

I had her ipad and access to everything. I never accessed it. But occationally emails would come up that I could see and I would get upset and I asked her to please disable that.

I pee in front of my friends too, with the bathroom door open and everything. I have baths with my flat mate on the toilet and my neighbour sitting on the floor and we drink coco. I view it as a tiny hot tub, really.

Last weekend I was getting ready for a party at a pub, and my date was getting ready in my room and I had some friends over for pre-drinks. So I was also standing in the kitchen at one point in my knickers, bra ans stockings, mixing cocktails and yelling at one of my mates to grab me my corset so she could do me up while I poured.
I was in a rush.

I'm not a pvt person, very much, in many ways. In some ways, I am.

[worldwarZ]

im techno-impaired so no facebook or much of anything like that. dunno my gf's info although im sure she'd give it to me if i asked. think shared emails are kinda goin to an extreme. my gf does know my passwords to some stuff, such as my work website to check my schedule if she wants. i have no prob with that. i think to each their own. unfortunately we live in a world of shadiness and insecurity. everyones got a past that shapes those insecurities so if me givin my gf a password eases those concerns then im happy to do it. i think the line would be crossed in the cases where they really dont have any sorta trust. no separate anything. i dunno whats on my girl's fb acct. ive never even looked at it or wanted to. i dont think its strange as far as practical purposes. i think it becomes strange when its due to lack of trust.

[Sachita]

Call me judgmental or anything you want but in a relationship where you have each others passwords and feel the need to be that emerged in each others privacy then I foresee huge problems down the road. Personally I don't know anyone that really does this and I'd question the longevity of the relationship.

I have submissive's who feel they need to offer this to me. It's just not something that interest me. If I can't trust them then I show them the door.

[Angeltoes]

Ciaran, Really you haven't seen personal attacks? The OP implied that this password sharing is completely consensual. Calling people who think differently creepy micro-managers sounds pretty personal to me. I didn't take issue with your post and I wouldn't share my password either. That's not my point. It's more that before we go around saying 'ew' to how other people live we should think about the fact that most of the world is saying ew to us. It's a negative mindset. I think people should do whatever they want to do as long as everyone *involved* agrees...and yeah, opine away. It's easy enough to express opinions without putting people down.

[Ciaran]

Originally Posted by Angeltoes

Ciarin, Really you haven't seen personal attacks? The OP implied that this password sharing is completely consensual. Calling people who think differently creepy micro-managers sounds pretty personal to me. I didn't take issue with your post and I wouldn't share my password either. That's not my point. It's more that before we go around saying 'ew' to how other people live we should think about the fact that most of the world is saying ew to us. It's a negative mindset. I think people should do whatever they want to do as long as everyone *involved* agrees.

Angeltoes


Genuinely, I haven't seen much in the way of personal attacks in this thread. Rather, there have been some critical posts regarding the practice of sharing online accounts and it's clear that most here don't intuitively perceive it as a positive attribute of a relationship.


Whether that's for reasons of trust or maintaining individuality in relationships, the reasons are valid - just as, I'm sure, someone who does share passwords and personal accounts can come on here and justify the practice - and they'd be welcome to. In fact, this type of thread can benefit from those whose positions are different from the majority view and they're prepared to articulate their minority position.


I don't think that terms such as "creepy" are, in themselves, problematic. Furthermore, at this stage, it all seems a bit hypothetical as (and I could be wrong as I have not re-read every post in detail) I don't think that anyone has come onto this site, advised that they engage in this activity and justified it from their perspective. If they did and there was to be a witch-hunt against them, I'd likely agree with you (even though, I, myself, view the practice as unhealthy).


I appreciate what you are saying about people should be able to do what they want if it's consensual. Within limits, I agree. That said, just because a practice may be consensual, doesn't necessarily mean it's healthy - although I appreciate that there's a subjective overlay to much of this.


Anyway, I've said enough on this topic. Bottom line is no one is getting my passwords and I don't want anyone's password either

[Angeltoes]

Yeah, I'm done with this topic too. I'm on a plane to see my honey in Texas. It's time to relax.

[kittygrrl]

Originally Posted by Angeltoes

Ciaran, Really you haven't seen personal attacks? The OP implied that this password sharing is completely consensual. Calling people who think differently creepy micro-managers sounds pretty personal to me. I didn't take issue with your post and I wouldn't share my password either. That's not my point. It's more that before we go around saying 'ew' to how other people live we should think about the fact that most of the world is saying ew to us. It's a negative mindset. I think people should do whatever they want to do as long as everyone *involved* agrees...and yeah, opine away. It's easy enough to express opinions without putting people down.

I think Ciaran makes a valid point. This kind of accountability isn't going to be in a normal arrangement between two people in a relationship. Maybe if someone decides to use the word creepy, it's about the accountability issue, not necessarily delivering a judgement about the relationship.

Just speaking from personal experience let's just say that I've shared account information, cell phone access, and have it used in a way that was a betrayal of why I gave it to begin with. So, you see, if someone has said" I don''t think its cool", but not necessarily giving you personal information to validate their opinion, maybe you should be a little more generous and consider perhaps they have a reason to be very negative about an issue? I just think it's something you could consider.

[Girl_On_Fire]

The only thing I found creepy was someone had said something to the effect of watching someone bathe. It was a joke to imply stalkerish behavior. I found that scenario "creepy" in the context it was put in.

Yes, I did state that this password exchange would be consensual. I was curious to see if this was something a vast majority of people did or just a few people I knew or have heard of. To be a bit transparent, I, personally valuable my own personal space and don't like having my boundaries violated. I don't have a problem with leaving my computer open because, like another poster had said, I have nothing to hide but when I get questioned, it makes me crazy.

This, again, is a personal issue for me. I was questioned non-stop as a child because I have a developmental disorder that causes me to view and respond to the world in a different way and this caused chronic misunderstandings.

Because of this, I've developed an aversion to anything that could even be perceived as being spied on or questioned. I can almost over-share when it comes to offering information but I clamp up like a steel trap and stop breathing when somebody goes looking for it because it panics me. (Unfortunately, I've been told this also makes me look "guilty").

It did not help in the slightest that I was recently in a relationship with a very paranoid/suspicious person who questioned me on an almost daily basis. That and some other things I've encountered and read lately caused me to want to open this topic for discussion. I wanted to put it before a diverse and open-minded group of people to get honest answers.

If anything I wrote caused offense, I apologize. I genuinely wanted to start a dialogue and I think it's been a good one so far.

[kannon]

Originally Posted by kittygrrl

I think Ciaran makes a valid point. This kind of accountability isn't going to be in a normal arrangement between two people in a relationship. Maybe if someone decides to use the word creepy, it's about the accountability issue, not necessarily delivering a judgement about the relationship.

Just speaking from personal experience let's just say that I've shared account information, cell phone access, and have it used in a way that was a betrayal of why I gave it to begin with. So, you see, if someone has said" I don''t think its cool", but not necessarily giving you personal information to validate their opinion, maybe you should be a little more generous and consider perhaps they have a reason to be very negative about an issue? I just think it's something you could consider.

\

You agreed with Ciaran's proclamation that "accountability" isn't a "normal" arrangement between two people. That's really a personal judgement and potentially psychologically damaging. Some people want accountability in a relationship and it is normal for them. We can't generalize this sentiment and label it as abnormal. Labeling can create a lot of psychological damage. It serves our community to choose our words carefully.