Natural Beauty

[Kitten.With.A.Twist]

I think confidence is sexy - it's not about what you look like or what you do or don't do with your hair/face/fashion. Be unashamedly confident in whatever look you choose to rock and THAT will rock someone's world.

That being said, Coco Chanel said there are no ugly women, just lazy ones. I think that when you choose to go 'natural' you should still be very well 'groomed'!

Da Kitten

[The_Lady_Snow]

Originally Posted by Kitten.With.A.Twist

I think confidence is sexy - it's not about what you look like or what you do or don't do with your hair/face/fashion. Be unashamedly confident in whatever look you choose to rock and THAT will rock someone's world.

That being said, Coco Chanel said there are no ugly women, just lazy ones. I think that when you choose to go 'natural' you should still be very well 'groomed'!

Da Kitten

Coco Chanel is very priveleged and oblivious to the FACT that some women can't AFFORD beauty products nor can ALL women just pull up their hair back in a pony tail with ease.


It's stuff like this that leads women to fall into the sexist expectations of what woman is...

[Kitten.With.A.Twist]

I don't think Chanel's point was misguided, Lady Snow, nor do I think good grooming has to be expensive, or that it's sexist. I think men should be well-groomed as well.

It's possible that I have a different perspective due to being born in Germany and raised by a German mother and a Military father, but I often look at American women and wonder why they dress so sloppy. Everyone is entitled to do what they feel is right for them, of course! And my choices aren't 'right' for everyone It's a free country!

[The_Lady_Snow]

Originally Posted by Kitten.With.A.Twist

I don't think Chanel's point was misguided, Lady Snow, nor do I think good grooming has to be expensive, or that it's sexist. I think men should be well-groomed as well.

It's possible that I have a different perspective due to being born in Germany and raised by a German mother and a Military father, but I often look at American women and wonder why they dress so sloppy. Everyone is entitled to do what they feel is right for them, of course! And my choices aren't 'right' for everyone It's a free country!

Grooming to some people is expensive Ms Kitten, and it is sexist, it may not be so to you, unfortunately it is. There are people from all gender spectrums that can't afford product nor do they have access to make themselves *presentable* according to standard that society deems acceptable. It's also a fact that Coco Chanel comes from a life of privelge and perhaps she isn't self aware of that privelege.


As for different perspectives... My mother isn't American and my Father is a retired military man, so I get the idea of looking neat. I am a fan of neat, but I am also aware that not everyone has the same priviledges when it comes to *grooming*, dressing, make up, beauty products as I do. I also keep in mind that my skin color, hair texture, body shape aren't standard Coco Chanel likings and that other POC like myself don't have access to all these things like most of us here do.


That was really my point about Coco Chanel's delusional, white, priveledge thinking. That's why I let you know ahead of time that I was piggy backing off her quote.



Thanks for the dialogue

[Soft*Silver]

my head turns when I see a silver haired femme or butch walk past. I find them extremely attractive and their life-intensity shows in their bravado to go silver. My eyes curve over their skin, and relish all the life-river type paths their wrinkles lead. If I can catch their eye, I will smile to beckon a showing of their crone/crows feet around their eyes as they smile back. The coolness of their skin warms suddenly under mine if we get to greet and shake hands. I am jolted with arousal from silver ones...always have been. Even now that I am as silver under my black, I find the connection honestly.

I colour my own hair because I do look a good decade or two older when it is not dyed. I did not think so until I coloured it and put photos side by side and saw what others had told me. I have gone silver on and off in my life. Sometimes because I will it, and sometimes, as Snow says, grooming is an expense and there have been times I barely had money for shampoo let alone colouring. I do a poor job myself and always end up with darker ends eventually. Since I still cant afford to go to a stylist to colour my hair, I have resorted to the practicality of dying my hair black. There are no darker ends when its all black. LOL

chrissy dyes his hair..it use to be jet black and the silver would look lovely but he is as femme as they come and struggles already with all the barriers he has to deal with the express that femininity. So he colours his hair. I love him either way.

Sachita, I picture you are a fierce grey haired Athena warrrior. But to each his own...do what you feel comfortable with. And, just so you know, if you go grey, you can always go back. When I wanted to start over in either direction, I would just shave my head. My hair is a wonderful fun element of myself...and I can grow it back..no matter what!

[Sachita]

For way too many years I was in that whole trap thinking I had to be dressed or be a certain way to be desired. Way to many. I was my own damn contradiction because I played the game and then talked about how free I was as a woman. I wasn't really free.

Now I am REALLY free. I still have a few issues to work on but I am far removed from most standards- thank goodness!

I'm not sure I even want to be sexy per se. I want to be beautiful. The damn package beautiful. When someone looks at me that are enthralled with the woman I am no matter the color of my hair or the size of my ass.

I look at these messages on facebook from the 30 something crowd, mostly on Mia's mothers wall and I just shake my head. I'm so glad that all is behind me.

Thank you all for your replies. I'm going to hate the growing out phase and hope I can hold out. Who know.. I may show up at the reunion with my salt and pepper sporting my levi's and cowboy boots. Yeehaw

[Femminator]

I honestly did not struggle with the decision to let my gray hair be. I am 43, almost 44 and I have very dark, almost black hair. I have just gotten grays in the last 3 years or so, and they are silver, and pretty. Age catches us all so why not embrace it and age gracefully?

I also have found myself greatly downsizing on makeup. I prefer natural looks to over made up look. I don't wear any to work, but on weekends I sometimes do put it on, it makes me feel feminine. I am sure this is do to social conditioning. My eyes are really dark and adding more stuff to them just makes me look as if I have dark circles usually so I leave it at mascara and a bit of eyeliner or shadow. I just want to have a quick grooming routine now. In the Summer, I really don't wear any, but in the wWinter, I feel kinda pale and wan so I do it to perk up my complexion.

Also, I don't know other Femmes experiences, but the Butches I have always dated have liked the 'natural look' and were not into their girls wearing tons of stuff on their faces. It suited me just fine.

[always2late]

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

Grooming to some people is expensive Ms Kitten, and it is sexist, it may not be so to you, unfortunately it is. There are people from all gender spectrums that can't afford product nor do they have access to make themselves *presentable* according to standard that society deems acceptable. It's also a fact that Coco Chanel comes from a life of privelge and perhaps she isn't self aware of that privelege.


As for different perspectives... My mother isn't American and my Father is a retired military man, so I get the idea of looking neat. I am a fan of neat, but I am also aware that not everyone has the same priviledges when it comes to *grooming*, dressing, make up, beauty products as I do. I also keep in mind that my skin color, hair texture, body shape aren't standard Coco Chanel likings and that other POC like myself don't have access to all these things like most of us here do.


That was really my point about Coco Chanel's delusional, white, priveledge thinking. That's why I let you know ahead of time that I was piggy backing off her quote.



Thanks for the dialogue

While undeniably white, it's hard for me to think that Chanel came from a life of "privilege." She was born to an unwed mother in 1883, and upon her mother's death was placed in an orphanage for the rest of her childhood by her stepfather. Though there is no denying that she attained success later in life, I don't think her entire life was as easy as her later years. As to her designs she was a proponent of a more "natural" and comfortable look for women. She has been credited for changing the idea that a woman had to be corsetted to be "beautiful."
*just a little trivia

[Sachita]

Originally Posted by always2late

While undeniably white, it's hard for me to think that Chanel came from a life of "privilege." She was born to an unwed mother in 1883, and upon her mother's death was placed in an orphanage for the rest of her childhood by her stepfather. Though there is no denying that she attained success later in life, I don't think her entire life was as easy as her later years. As to her designs she was a proponent of a more "natural" and comfortable look for women. She has been credited for changing the idea that a woman had to be corsetted to be "beautiful."
*just a little trivia

wow thats such good info! I love her!

[The_Lady_Snow]

Hmm. Funny in that ironic way that she doesn't get it then. Her coming from such a background should of opened her eyes to tge oppression of women. I don't think shed be who she was had she been born with darker skin.

That was really the point about "beauty products" and standards they have A LOT of ism's attached to them

Originally Posted by always2late

While undeniably white, it's hard for me to think that Chanel came from a life of "privilege." She was born to an unwed mother in 1883, and upon her mother's death was placed in an orphanage for the rest of her childhood by her stepfather. Though there is no denying that she attained success later in life, I don't think her entire life was as easy as her later years. As to her designs she was a proponent of a more "natural" and comfortable look for women. She has been credited for changing the idea that a woman had to be corsetted to be "beautiful."
*just a little trivia

[Sachita]

I think the whole industry is fucked up. I think between the media and the patriarchal attitudes forced on us many many moons ago have devalued women. Many of us fell and still fall in that trap. I'm not saying that there is anything wrong with wanting to dress pretty and buy nice things. It's when you feel you have no beauty or value without it. Its when our sons can only see big tits, big hair and name brand jeans. Our whole fucking perception of beauty is distorted.

But I can change that for me today. I can start to live my life differently and hopefully teach my granddaughter the things no one taught me.

[Kitten.With.A.Twist]

I think she does get, it, though, Lady Snow... I wonder if you have a different idea about her quote than I do? While I didn't know Chanel and never had the chance to ask her about it, my perception of it is that she was being very inclusive and accepting of ALL beauties... and simply saying that EVERY woman is beautiful, and if she's not, it's because she's just not taking "care" of herself. I'm a huge fan of taking care of yourself.... but I'm not a huge proponent of expensive cosmetics or beauty regimes...I don't really use them and don't think they are necessary.. but why not take a little 'care' of yourself!