Prenuptial Agreements. Anyone have one? Anyone who would consider one if they married?

[imperfect_cupcake]

Originally Posted by Kent

Dapper, there's nothing wrong with the way you feel about the topic. But, just to clarify my feelings: if money is that important to someone, I doubt that I'll be marrying her. To me marriage is a sacred bond between two people who love each other til death do they part, money or no money. Money does not figure into my equation for marriage in any shape or form. Love is all that I want and need from a woman. Money is not important to me. Love is all it's about for me.

Money iis not important to me either. I also have nothing. I don't care about material goods. I really don't. I've moved around too much to see them as anything but a pain in the ass. I never wanted a morgage or to stay put.

I married someone who felt about those things exactly the same as I did. Exactly. It was fantastic. We never fought about money, not once.

And then forever fucked off with someone from work because her father died and she lost herself. Everything changed, very *VERY* suddenly. I didn't have a single doubt about her, not one. Not ever. And I don't trust people. But she chose someone who makes £100,000 a year with a house and to have kids with. As in she will be giving birth. She never wanted to have kids and the thought of giving birth wierded her self-concepts out.

Her father dying changed everything. everything everything everything.

When the divorce was in process I got a letter off of her telling me she saw our marriage as a business transaction.

you could have knocked me over with a feather. This was my anti-capitolist, socialist, die hard unionist, loving partner that proposed to me in a tree in Hamstead heath with a glass ring because we couldn't afford a silver one.

A business transaction.

Our wedding was in the snow in amsterdam during a full lunar eclipse on the longest night of the year.

A business transaction. that's all it meant to her now.

Invasion of the bodysnatchers.

We both had debts, not stuff. But my mom is not well and the gal I was dating at the time said "push that through asap before she gets her arsehole hands on your mom's inheritance"

I was given the option to file for 12 years of alimony because of desertion. Leaving me with all the bills etc.

I had left the country. what the hell did I care. But I thought about taking those 12 years of alimony to make her understand just what the fuck she did.

My dad told me no. let her go and make your own money, like you always have. So I signed the opportunity away.

Never ever think that people cannot suddenly change. I just learned that one.

Would I have a prenup next time? I have no idea. I don't have anything. I have 9 bags of stuff and 20 boxes and a student debt. That will change when I get my inheritance but we'll see. I'm not interested in anyone else's money. I've had people offer me the moon, and very wealthy people. It never impressed me and frankly rather put me off.

But who knows. But I do know that people can change on a dime.

[Blade]

I don't think anyone is contemplating divorce when they get married. I do believe it is in the best interest of both parties to create a pre-nup.

Rest assured, in a majority of the cases the person you marry, is not the same person you are divorcing. You can trust, but you can't predict how someone will behave when they are faced with dividing assets that were actually acquired before marriage, let alone the ones acquired during the marriage.

I was faced with sharing not only my 401k, but my company retirement as well. Also if my ex died before my retirement, then I would have owed the same percentage to the heirs monthly, when I began to draw from it. Heirs could have meant the next spouse. Umm yes this would have PISSED me off. You cheat on me and I'm going to end up paying the person you cheated with, for the rest of my life. WTF is that? This didn't pan out like this but for a while I thought it was going to, and it could have.

Count me in for a prenuptial agreement on the next marriage. Yes there will be another one, someday. I ain't scared.

[Rockinonahigh]

Yes I would have a prenup in a heart beat,I would protect my asetts plus whatever my son stands to inherit from me.I would also make shure whatever we accumalated dureing a marrige (if I ever did it again) that she would be taken care of finiancly in case of my passing or agree to an ammount of settlement prior to divorce.Getting married again is not high on my list of things.

[thedivahrrrself]

I think the issue of trust is a straw man here. EVERYONE trusts the person they marry when they marry them, but life can throw serious curve balls that fuck up even the best of relationships. A perfectly wonderful person can become an addict, for instance, and destroy the relationship 15 years down the line.

No one wants to think about divorce before marriage, but Anya is right. It happens about half the time. Not all of that is because people married an asshole. Most of the time it's two normal people who were (or maybe still are) very much in love, but they can't make it work for whatever reason. None of us can see the future.

As for me, I won't be pondering marriage any time in the near future, so I don't know exactly what I would do, but I do think it's prudent for both parties to at least consider a pre-nup, particularly if anyone comes into the relationship with a child.

[always2late]

I have no plans on getting married again. But, for those who are considering marriage, a pre-nup is not unreasonable. As other posters have stated, no one enters into a marriage thinking it will end in divorce, but it does happen.

My ex an I had a domestic partnership, entered into with the best of intentions. I would never have believed that the person I started our partnership with was the same person that appeared at the end. At the time of our split, I couldn't afford a divorce (it still rankles me that in NJ I wasn't afforded all the benefits of marriage...but had to pay the full cost of divorce). Anyway, I wasn't able to afford the divorce until a few years after our actual split. By that time, my ex had begun using drugs and was not the same person I'd known. Luckily, I had no assets or any money to speak of...because I know that in the state she was in, she would have tried to get whatever she could to support her habit.

We all want to believe a marriage will last forever, and that we can trust our partner completely...but things can, and do, happen. Life holds no guarantees.

[QueenofSmirks]

A lot of issues being raised here can be addressed through other means - wills, beneficiary designations, trusts, etc.

[Ciaran]

I would not get married without some form of pre-nuptial agreement. This would be a pre-requisite for marriage and I'd want this regardless of whether my prospective spouse was (much) wealthier than I am.


For me, it's not about adding up the $$$ and seeing who is bringing more assets into the marriage. Rather, it's about ensuring assets are ring-fenced which preserves a sufficient level of independence so that I have the choice to exit the marriage at any stage, should I wish to do so.


I feel the same way about joint bank accounts i.e. I would be happy to have a joint bank account for general household bills etc. However, the feeling of actually having joint bank accounts where both partners credit their wages too and manage finances on a totally joint basis would fill me with absolute horror.


Some may possibly say that, with my attitude, I should never consider marriage. They would be welcome to their views. However, there's no one size fits all version of a perfect long-term relationship.

[Gráinne]

I too would be concerned about maintaining my financial independence in any future marriage, especially as those finances will be paying for college (well, part of it anyway) and retirement. Plus, I also have an inheritance coming and want that separate from joint funds. I've made the mistake of getting my finances too enmeshed with someone else's, and it's expensive and ugly to untangle.

For me, anyway, it wouldn't be about difference in wealth but difference in responsibility.

I have seen too many good marriages fall apart seemingly overnight, and former lovers go absolutely crazy over dividing money and things. I was fortunately spared all that, but never again will I consider marriage without some kind of agreement.

[sofimichi]

My fiance and I both come from families which have been divorced. We have both seen our parents fight for money and goods and we don't want anything like that.
We are planning on having a prenup. Truth is, we aren't Kanye West or Warren Buffet, and we don't want to be. But if something happened in the future which would make us have money, and if something were to happen in which we couldn't fix it, and just had to separate, I want her to have everything she came into the marriage with. Should we ever split up, I would hope that the person with the most income would be generous enough to help the other person.
We aren't wealthy (at. all.) but we think that being happy and safe is something no money can buy. And if the prenup makes us both feel safe, so be it.

[Jane Bond]

Originally Posted by Kobi

I am a realist and a pragmatist. I am also 57 years old. I would insist on a prenup for both parties.

The reason, for me, is to protect premarital assets, to shield each other from premarital debt, and to protect any foreseeable future monies that are unconnected to the marriage.

To me, at my age, it just makes sense. We each have made decisions and financial plans for ourselves and our future well before the marriage. Positive or negative, we each have to live with the consequences.

In addition, at my age, my earning capacity is time limited. To have to assume someone else's debts is just illogical, and to have to rebuild a nest egg is self defeating.

Dapper, I am also confused about why you are lumping the distribution of assets after the death of a partner with a prenup. They are totally separate issues in my head, each with their own legal instrument and purpose.

I wouldn't get married again, but if a miracle happened and I wanted to give it another go, the prenup would be more water tight than a frog's ass.

[Jane Bond]

Originally Posted by imperfect_cupcake

But who knows. But I do know that people can change on a dime.

Mine changed on a dime, then the witch wanted 9 cents change from me. Sorry for what you went through, my dear, but it may help you to know you'll likely meet a woman far superior to the rat you married.
The way I see it, any woman would be better than the ex wife.

[imperfect_cupcake]

No. Not "any" woman would be better than my ex. There have been far, far worse.
And when we got together she was a VERY different person. Someone who treated me incredibly well, better than any one ever had, and genuinely loved me like mad. She was kind, protective, intellectual, and funny.
She was my best friend.

But the point is, she changed after going through trauma.

And that can happen to anyone.

So, now that I'm making good coin and I have an inheritance, pre-nup. And living either in seperate places or with stipulations that ensure I keep my independence and private space.

I'm deeply romantic and very caring. But I'm not a mug and I'm no ones nurse maid/cleaner either.

[kittygrrl]

I have nothing against the idea of a prenup. I realize some people wouldn't get married without one and frankly they shouldn't. Personally if you can't trust me with your assets, why in the world would you want to marry me or visa versa? You don't need legal paper to live together.

[imperfect_cupcake]

Because I may trust who the person is as they are, but shit happens to people. And sometimes trauma, or severe injuries, or unknown/unforeseen shit can change people into people you no longer recognize. I've seen it happen. Stuff you'd never guess would ever happen to someone, happens. And it changes someone. And suddenly they are gone. And then the person they are now with convinces them to take half of what's yours. You have no idea.

It's not about trust. It's about not being naive that life doesn't do surprising things that change us. I've watched nervous break downs, brain cancer, deaths, new and sudden addictions, midlife crisis etc these are all things that have deeply changed people I know and put them through divorces.

[kittygrrl]

Originally Posted by imperfect_cupcake

Because I may trust who the person is as they are, but shit happens to people. And sometimes trauma, or severe injuries, or unknown/unforeseen shit can change people into people you no longer recognize. I've seen it happen. Stuff you'd never guess would ever happen to someone, happens. And it changes someone. And suddenly they are gone. And then the person they are now with convinces them to take half of what's yours. You have no idea.

It's not about trust. It's about not being naive that life doesn't do surprising things that change us. I've watched nervous break downs, brain cancer, deaths, new and sudden addictions, midlife crisis etc these are all things that have deeply changed people I know and put them through divorces.

Granted, Cupcake and if previous experience makes you doubtful you should do whatever you need to do. But if it's just a legal license to fuck, why would it be needed in the first place? If you view marriage as a business arrangement, I don't see the value in entering into one. Have an exclusive relationship and enjoy each other as needed without the entanglements marriage involves. Far simpler and enjoyable if you want the benefits without the risk and responsibilities.

[MsTinkerbelly]

Part of this entire conversation is borne of marriage coming to us only recently.

We have spent so many years in relationships that were not seen as valid; where it was actually not in our best interests to combine money due to how easy it was to slide into and out of being together, that IMO most of us are not sure how to do "ours".

My grandparents, parents, sister....they never gave a thought to combining resources and building a life together. In their world, pre-nups were for the wealthy combining family fortunes, or one person being very wealthy and one not so much. In their world money was combined, houses were jointly bought and plans were made for the future.

We have the type of financial arrangement that we are comfortable with...we combine everything. If this relationship ends, I want it to be messy and hard to get out of! I know that sounds odd, but we both promised forever...and I wouldn't have married her if I thought she would walk away.

The only concession I made to having had a child before coming into the relationship, was to have my 401k divided 50/50 between Amy and Kasey should I pass away before she turned 21. I made my way in life, and my daughter can do the same.

[jools66]

even though its not romantic, i think in this day and age its a wise thing to have a pre-nup.
We never like to think that when we get married it will end in divorce, but some things are just out of our control.
i got married years ago, wasnt true to who i was (as in gay) and i left the relationship with nothin bc i wanted it that way.
i was the one who hurt him, and for me personally, i went into it with nothing much money wise.
i just wanted a clean break, with no tangles.
but if i was ever to get married again, i think i would lean more towards getting a prenup.
simply bc my own money circumstances have changed.

[Nattih]

Short answer: Nope.

Long answer: Hell nope.

I realize this will largely kill my ability to marry and I 100% accept that. The idea that I am already a liability to my future wife? Can't deal with.

[Jesse]

I have to agree with imperfect_cupcake, people do change. Sometimes it's for the better, sometimes, through no fault of the person it's for the worse.

Were I to ever marry I would want a prenup. I prefer to see it as a means of the two of us taking care of one another and being responsible financially for the sake of both of our futures. It may have to have a lottery clause too.

I also will not share a banking account. There was a time years ago (30) when a girlfriend and I shared a bank account and I paid for that the hard way. It took me 6 months to pay all of the bounced check fees and bills that got behind because she walked the day after we put the checks in the mail for the monthly bills, and she cleaned out the bank on her way out and everything bounced. Lesson learned.

Also I think most of us go into a committed relationship with the thought in mind that it will be forever, and well, sadly it doesn't always work out that way.

[DapperButch]

Originally Posted by Jesse

Were I to ever marry I would want a prenup. I prefer to see it as a means of the two of us taking care of one another and being responsible financially for the sake of both of our futures. It may have to have a lottery clause too.

Exactly. That is how I was seeing it when I wrote the first post. I saw/see it as a way to protect my wife and also as a way to make things easy and less stressful if we ended. I would actually see it as me being a good husband and doing something "for us", by initiating the process for the two of us.

I think that it is also easy for people who dont have any family assets to say that they would never consider it, as there is not a reason for them to consider it in the first place. It has nothing to do with the money you make as a couple, it has to do with money that you had before the person ever existed in your world. Or, at least for me, that is what I would want in a pre-nup. Not the money we make as a couple.