Breeder and other words we use to hurt our own.

[Toughy]

Originally Posted by SuperFemme

Toughy, nobody told anybody to go read a thread about unacceptable words, so you know how to 'properly speak your mind'.

What I did do was start a thread about hurtful language.

In the same vein of do unto others as you would do unto yourself....I am saying that the term breeders hurts me. I am not telling you not to use that word. I am not censoring it. I am telling you why it hurts me.

The choice to use it is yours.

My choice to address you as "She" is not censorship. It is mutual respect. Because that is how I roll, and that is how what you asked.

I love you darlin..............that does not mean we cannot disagree. We have a bond that will not be broken.

I will always always question authority. I worry that when we censor words, we censor thought. I am so fucking wrong because I call part of my family breeders.............really???????............Adel e.......ya can't tell me that. They are breeders in the sense they produce the next generation. My family will produce some queers.........we have for generations past. We breed queers. It's a damn good thing. I hope we continue to breed queers. My family breed me.

Do you see my point? I will do my best to not use that word around you. I hear it is hurtful to you and others. I will not stop using that term in reference to mi familia. I want mi familia to breed more who question authority, who do the right thing in spite of the consequences. I want mi familia to breed folks who see the equality in all of us.

Maybe it's because I am from farm and ranch folks and folks who appreciate genetics...........breeding is not a negative term..........it is a term to connotate the products of conception brought to life. It's a term used to promote the best of the species.

[Toughy]

this is really another thought in relation to the above post.

Homo sapiens are primates. We are animals. We breed. It is the idea that homo sapiens are somehow above other primates and non-primates that is the epitome of arrogance.

Us white folk have viewed other homo sapiens as less than human. We have used the term 'stud' to mean a male (not white or poor) who looks like a breeder of good strong healthy stock. Yet parts of the butch/femme/queer community embrace 'stud' as an identity.

Are we to remove 'stud' from our white vocabulary? If we do remove 'stud' because of offense to white folk?.........what does that say to black culture who view stud in some kind of equivocalness to butch.

I am lost in this conversation. I don't know who to offend and who not to offend.

[Martina]

The idea behind the term "breeder" is to denigrate women for producing, or overproducing, offspring.

[Dylan]

Originally Posted by Martina

The idea behind the term "breeder" is to denigrate women for producing, or overproducing, offspring.

I feel that it is also to *remind* women are their role in the patriarchy.

Like, a this is the reason you're here type o' thing.

I mean, again, I think it can be used either way (sinner/saint thing)



Dylan

[Heart]

As I've said many times, context is everything.

As for FGM - there is no comparison between what is done to boys and what is done to girls, not physically, socially, psychologically, functionally, or culturally.

See the rest of my comments in the GM thread.

[SuperFemme]

Originally Posted by Toughy

I love you darlin..............that does not mean we cannot disagree. We have a bond that will not be broken.

I will always always question authority. I worry that when we censor words, we censor thought. I am so fucking wrong because I call part of my family breeders.............really???????............Adel e.......ya can't tell me that. They are breeders in the sense they produce the next generation. My family will produce some queers.........we have for generations past. We breed queers. It's a damn good thing. I hope we continue to breed queers. My family breed me.

Do you see my point? I will do my best to not use that word around you. I hear it is hurtful to you and others. I will not stop using that term in reference to mi familia. I want mi familia to breed more who question authority, who do the right thing in spite of the consequences. I want mi familia to breed folks who see the equality in all of us.

Maybe it's because I am from farm and ranch folks and folks who appreciate genetics...........breeding is not a negative term..........it is a term to connotate the products of conception brought to life. It's a term used to promote the best of the species.

We can disagree yes. I just want to point out that I am not per se saying that the term is *wrong*. I am saying that it is hurtful. To me.

I am going to have to contact mi familia in Belen and Los Lunas and see how the Queers on the Ranches there feel about the word. Perhaps you have a point in regards to farm and ranch folk. I will go on a quest to find out.

I am not so small minded as to think that my little feelings make something wrong or right. I just know that the word hurts me as a Femme and as a Mother. If I sit around like a good little girl and ignore that? Then what purpose does that serve?

What I really really appreciate is that you can feel that the word is hunky dory and still be sensitive enough to try not to use it around me. Thank you.

[Mr. Moon]

It just ocurred to me after Toughy's post, that I really dislike the term "queer".

In my world it was used so much to hurt gay people that I twinge every time I hear it.

Then came the 90's and everybody wanted to "take it back" "own it".
I always had a hard time with that concept. Seems kind of silly to me, but it works for some I suppose, therefore it is not silly to them.

I think maybe the term in question has the same feeling to some people. So therefore I get it. I don't feel that way, but they do and that's what counts.

And I know I made several people blink alot, admitting I do not like the term queer.

Still makes me shudder. But I realize it's not about me, it's not used to hurt me (for the most part unless you travel in certain spots here in Maryland). So, I roll with people using that term.

I hope this made sense. I'm rattling...
-Mr. Moon

[SuperFemme]

Originally Posted by Mr. Moon

It just ocurred to me after Toughy's post, that I really dislike the term "queer".

In my world it was used so much to hurt gay people that I twinge every time I hear it.

Then came the 90's and everybody wanted to "take it back" "own it".
I always had a hard time with that concept. Seems kind of silly to me, but it works for some I suppose, therefore it is not silly to them.

I think maybe the term in question has the same feeling to some people. So therefore I get it. I don't feel that way, but they do and that's what counts.

And I know I made several people blink alot, admitting I do not like the term queer.

Still makes me shudder. But I realize it's not about me, it's not used to hurt me (for the most part unless you travel in certain spots here in Maryland). So, I roll with people using that term.

I hope this made sense. I'm rattling...
-Mr. Moon

Moonie, that must be even tougher than *breeder*. Because that term is used on such a large scale nowadays. I will make sure not to call you that and thanks for letting me know.

I wonder about words that carry that kind of power that have been reclaimed now. What if a person doesn't want to reclaim a word but the majority does?

Language. Argh.

[MsMerrick]

Originally Posted by Mr. Moon

It just ocurred to me after Toughy's post, that I really dislike the term "queer".

In my world it was used so much to hurt gay people that I twinge every time I hear it.

Then came the 90's and everybody wanted to "take it back" "own it".
I always had a hard time with that concept. Seems kind of silly to me, but it works for some I suppose, therefore it is not silly to them.

I think maybe the term in question has the same feeling to some people. So therefore I get it. I don't feel that way, but they do and that's what counts.

And I know I made several people blink alot, admitting I do not like the term queer.

Still makes me shudder. But I realize it's not about me, it's not used to hurt me (for the most part unless you travel in certain spots here in Maryland). So, I roll with people using that term.

I hope this made sense. I'm rattling...
-Mr. Moon

It did..
And it was kind of the same thing I was thinking, and figured if i posted at all, that I would say..
I mean I like the word Queer, but I get, that many don't !
I do think context is important with any word, and yes I really do mean

ANY word...

Me, I don't like it when people use cunt as a swear word or to denote a stupid person
Need I explain why ?
But if I am referring to my cunt.. that's a whole nother story
Also, a lot is cultural..Not just contextual .. or let us say, they cultural differences, lend to different contextual meanings..

Oh and btw, did anyone come up with any other phrases and/or words , that are used by GLBTQ etc people , to hurt each other? I do believe that was the title of the thread, and maybe even the intent

[DapperButch]

Mr. Moon's comment made me think of how when I used to refer to myself as a dyke at work around the heterosexuals that I have a friendly relationship with, would become horrifed FOR me. "Don't say that...you are not a dyke!". This was their way of saying, oh gosh, has Dapper internalized that slur? :-( We don't want her (most I haven't had the gender conversation with), to do that!

I would have to educate them on how for me dyke is a proud term.

For some reason, they don't react to queer...I think at this point they just let me say whatever and don't question it! LOL

[SuperFemme]

Originally Posted by MsMerrick

It did..
And it was kind of the same thing I was thinking, and figured if i posted at all, that I would say..
I mean I like the word Queer, but I get, that many don't !
I do think context is important with any word, and yes I really do mean

ANY word...

Me, I don't like it when people use cunt as a swear word or to denote a stupid person
Need I explain why ?
But if I am referring to my cunt.. that's a whole nother story
Also, a lot is cultural..Not just contextual .. or let us say, they cultural differences, lend to different contextual meanings..

Oh and btw, did anyone come up with any other phrases and/or words , that are used by GLBTQ etc people , to hurt each other? I do believe that was the title of the thread, and maybe even the intent

There are the attacks on gender which I and somebody else have mentioned: Shim, HeShe

There is the naming of the Slut: This is particularly hurtful. I think it happens in groups of women when we don't understand each other or are feeling insecure. It is sticky because the word slut when used by ones self can be empowering. When used to tear a woman down it can be really hurtful.

Anybody else?

[betenoire]

Originally Posted by blush

I wonder about words that carry that kind of power that have been reclaimed now. What if a person doesn't want to reclaim a word but the majority does?

If an individual doesn't want to reclaim a word but the majority does - really their only "responsibility" it to not use it. If someone doesn't like Queer, nobody is forcing them to say it. You're welcome to articulate why you don't like the word - but don't expect everybody to apologise and never use it again. DO expect everybody to make a mental note of that and not refer to YOU as Queer, however.

And then there's Fat.

I love the word Fat. I think Fat is just about the greatest fucking word in my vocabulary. I'm all about overusing it and desensitizing people to it to the point where when I say it it's clear to the listener that I'm using the same matter-of-fact voice that I would use if I were to mention my freckles.

I think there's a lot of power in taking back Fat.

But, you know, not everybody is on board. And they really don't have to be. I don't get to decide what words make other people uncomfortable.

Sometimes if I reference my Fat it squicks people out. From the co-worker who (so well intentioned) say "Brandy...you are not fat, honey." to lovers who say "I don't think you're fat, I think you're beautiful." (like I fucking can't be both? wtf! I wanna be both!) When that happens the onus is on me to (briefly) explain that I don't think Fat is a bad word, and why, and then move on with my life.

[SuperFemme]

Originally Posted by betenoire

If an individual doesn't want to reclaim a word but the majority does - really their only "responsibility" it to not use it. If someone doesn't like Queer, nobody is forcing them to say it. You're welcome to articulate why you don't like the word - but don't expect everybody to apologise and never use it again. DO expect everybody to make a mental note of that and not refer to YOU as Queer, however.

And then there's Fat.

I love the word Fat. I think Fat is just about the greatest fucking word in my vocabulary. I'm all about overusing it and desensitizing people to it to the point where when I say it it's clear to the listener that I'm using the same matter-of-fact voice that I would use if I were to mention my freckles.

I think there's a lot of power in taking back Fat.

But, you know, not everybody is on board. And they really don't have to be. I don't get to decide what words make other people uncomfortable.

Sometimes if I reference my Fat it squicks people out. From the co-worker who (so well intentioned) say "Brandy...you are not fat, honey." to lovers who say "I don't think you're fat, I think you're beautiful." (like I fucking can't be both? wtf! I wanna be both!) When that happens the onus is on me to (briefly) explain that I don't think Fat is a bad word, and why, and then move on with my life.

And on four hours of sleep Bete succinctly sums it up. Thank you!

There are words that are going to be one persons trigger and anothers salvation. I suppose the key is opening our mouths and letting each other know what those words are?

[MsMerrick]

Originally Posted by SuperFemme

There are the attacks on gender which I and somebody else have mentioned: Shim, HeShe

There is the naming of the Slut: This is particularly hurtful. I think it happens in groups of women when we don't understand each other or are feeling insecure. It is sticky because the word slut when used by ones self can be empowering. When used to tear a woman down it can be really hurtful.

Anybody else?

Sorry, all those words can be endearing in context ..Seriously ...

[SuperFemme]

Originally Posted by MsMerrick

Sorry, all those words can be endearing in context ..Seriously ...

I understand. Until they are not, in context....

[Soon]

Originally Posted by MsMerrick

Sorry, all those words can be endearing in context ..Seriously ...

I never considered that "Shim" and "HeShe" could be ever be "endearing" even in context.

I am curious as to how you have heard these words be used in endearing ways.