Parenting

[jelli]

Originally Posted by christie0918

I typically don't post a lot about parenting. I don't want others judging my parenting skills/style and I don't want to judge theirs.

However, I find myself on a very uncertain road. I'm not sure I am looking for answers/advice or if I am looking for someone to tell me that its gonna be ok, that they have walked/walking the road or the road scares the bejezus out of them.

Some of you may know that we have a 17 (almost 18) year old son who is lovingly referred to as Bratboy. I am quite open about his being an ASPIE (Asperger's Syndrome) as well as a myriad of other acronyms. I have always prided myself on being able to navigate single-parenthood of a special needs child and really tried not to become a martyr about "Why?". Truth is, I can't imagine wanting my son to be any different than he is - except when I do.

He graduated high-school in May and is one of those kids who is just not ready in terms of maturation to attend college either away from home or close to home without some additional support systems. We are fortunate in that he has been accepted at a school about three hours from us where he will first have a nine week "life skills" course and then go on to begin the culinary arts program. He will live on campus but have more supervision than if he were at a mainstream (lack of better word) college.

The conundrum is that he is a pig and has little to no regard for the impact of his actions on others. It doesn't matter that Jess and I could both have the tidy-fit award on a daily basis. It doesn't seem to matter that we have a freakin' housekeeper and all he has to do is to pick up his crap and she will dust, do the floors and make the bed. It doesn't seem to matter that he has a mountain of dirty laundry and no clean underwear - he wears "basketball" shorts if he has no clean underwear. He deplores showering and personal hygiene as if you are asking him to bathe in acid and only does so when whatever he wants (internet access usually) becomes the currency.

Having his internet access was a great repercussion when he spent hours upon hours talking/skyping with his internet pals. Low and behold, he has made real-time friends. Something he has never had. The last month or so has been these two boys (young men, really) and Bratboy traipsing back and forth between our house and theirs.

They seem to have no concept of how their escapades at all hours impact our lives. Jess can't sleep during the week (I work a couple hundred miles from home) because the dogs are alerting her to every time they hear a noise. We have tried talking to him about how ecstatic we are that he has friends and that we are trying to teach him about the different expectations now that he has close folks to interact with - not that we want to continue to treat him as a child, but that we are teaching him things that he's just coming to need.

At moments, he seems to get it. Just about a month ago, he spent his first night away from home since he was about 6 (other than with my folks or his father on occasion). Following that, Jess was able to leave him alone overnight and he took amazing care of the dogs. It felt like the anchor of him not being self-sufficient/mature was being lifted! We were overjoyed.

Last week, we attempted Jess coming to Richmond for the night so we could attend the Melissa Etheridge concert. He agreed to take care of the dogs. Good, right? Uh-huh - until Jess found the pool filter system full of airsoft pellets (kinda like plastic BB's). Until I couldnt reach him till THREE THIRTY the next day to find that our giant schnuazer who lives outside most days hadn't been watered because, "Mooooommmmmm - I am tired. It just rained." Don't even get me started on my reaction.

I know to some it sounds simply as if we aren't enforcing boundaries. The issue seems to be that there is no repercussion because there is no currency. He is completely apathetic most days and the internet and his cell phone are of no importance to him now. Money isn't an issue because he has EVERYTHING he could possibly want - and short of taking things away (which he doesn't care about anyway), there isn't a possible solution there either.

My rope is short and I am finding myself about to have a "Mommy meltdown." These usually aren't pretty and do result in what I term as band-aids on an artery. Stops the bleeding for a hot minute and then things are right back to where they were.

Jess does an amazing job of caring for him while I am away and I will own that I do feel a certain amount of Mommy guilt at having someone there doing the hard stuff while I am away for work. I don't want to add to what I already consider a huge undertaking for Jess. I don't want him to get a "pass" on unacceptable behaviors because he is wired differently, yet, I constantly find myself searching for the one thing that will finally click and make sense to him.

Sigh. Anyone have a magic wand? My apologies if this seems too long or too detailed. Once I started, it poured out like a river.

Thank you for posting Christie,

I can't even imagine and major props to you and to Jess for continuously and lovingly striving to help "bratboy" become the most independent and integrated young man as he can possibly be. Go easy on yourselves it reads as if you're doing all you can do at this point.

Have you looked into any local or online support groups?

I took just a moment to look around and found one that has some forums:

http://www.aspergersyndrome.org/

As tapu stated, let us know if you find some resolution. I'm sorry I couldn't be much help.

{{{{{Christie & Jess}}}}}

[christie]

Originally Posted by tapu

Hi, Christie.

A couple of things came to mind as I was reading your post...

First, I thought, eh, that's what a guy that age is like. But I figure you've got a handle on that and know that this goes beyond.

Another thing that I get out of it is that you do think he's capable of great improvement in this area. So it's not that he's completely limited in maturing this way. It just hasn't happened.

I assume you do the list thing because I can't imagine getting this far without such proven tools.

I wonder if setting him up in more of a space of his own would eventually lead to natural motivation to improve in this area. Like, I don't know your house set-up obviously, but if he has a bed/bath of his own, or even just a separated out bedroom, and you stop all housekeeping service in there.... Well, eventually he runs out of basketball shorts, too.

It might take a while, which could be blech-y. Most older teen guys just have basically bad hygiene so who wants to sit next to them? Eventually though, he may be motivated to clean up.

The other thing that can jumpstart a kid is developing an interest in romance. You may have to use only a band-aid right now.

I don't know if any of this would be helpful, but I really got into your post. Please give word of how it goes. tapu

Thanks, Tapu for your response.

Unfortunately, he does have his own bedroom and even his own "boy cave" space where his bicycles, "faux" Flex weight machine, the 10 thousand (it seems) airsoft guns and his sword and knife collection lives. It doesn't seem to matter that they are his spaces and that he is responsible for them - he just doesn't care - and I think more than anything, the apathy he has about life just really wears me out.

He is so blessed in comparison to most of the kids in our lil town. Most families in our town have issues with putting food on the table much less to have the abundance of material things we have. It irks me to no end that even when you point out to him his privlige and he acknowledges it, you can still walk into his room and find both of his laptops on the floor, the iPad tossed on the bed amongst just trash, his nasty fingerprints on the flat screen tv - I could just open the window and toss it all in the front yard (except that tidy yard Jess won't let me unless she can pull the Beast (don't ask - its an old truck) under the window so I don't make a mess.

He has a romance of sorts, but manages to shower is she is coming over.

Last night after I made the post, he called to ask if he could spend the night at his friends'. I have told him (and Jess) time and time again that its NOT a good idea to put me on speaker - there is no accounting for what I might say.

Low and behold, I start in on, "What are you and your friends going to do to pay for the $500 pool filter you ruined after you were told not to airsoft in the yard?", quickly followed with, "Are your friends going to help you do your laundry and clean that pig-sty of a room, and while they are at it, are they gonna get in the shower and wash your nasty ass?" (He's almost 18 - saying ass to him isn't the worst thing in the world and sometimes he seems to "hear" me when its not the same Mom speech).

There is a part of me that abhors embarrasing him. Really. There is another part of me that thinks maybe, just maybe, it might make him take action. *shrugs*

I'll keep you posted. I have told him that he might wanna think about getting it together because when Momma comes home this weekend, reality is about to smack him square between the eyes. I'm not sure yet what that entails, but I am certain that its nor going to be pretty.

Originally Posted by jelli

Thank you for posting Christie,

I can't even imagine and major props to you and to Jess for continuously and lovingly striving to help "bratboy" become the most independent and integrated young man as he can possibly be. Go easy on yourselves it reads as if you're doing all you can do at this point.

Have you looked into any local or online support groups?

I took just a moment to look around and found one that has some forums:

http://www.aspergersyndrome.org/

As tapu stated, let us know if you find some resolution. I'm sorry I couldn't be much help.

{{{{{Christie & Jess}}}}}

Jelli -

Thanks for your response.

The unfortunate part of support groups, for me, has always been I have little patience for those who seem to get wrapped up in their issues, wearing them as a blanket to keep them warm - I tried an autism group when he was first diagnosed at 2.5 years and found that most times, it was just a lot of venting and not a lot of practical solutions. I feel like Jess and I spend enough energy talking about it and I just don't want to sacrifice any more of the precious time we have together to "boy issues."

I'm not dismissing anything that you or Tapu offered - really. You have no idea that just someone else heard me means so very much and I appreciate it. I know Jess does too.

Thanks again to you both -

Christie

[tapu]

Hey, does he have a therapist or a life coach or some kind of social worker? His having one might take some of the stress off you guys. But also, what about a family counselor. Confront him with the problems in front of someone else. A therapist might have good ideas for "enforcement" or "pay-off" or whatever....

If you've already tried that, might be time to try different one. (I like "mixing it up" with therapists every few years. It's all so different.)

[Bard]

OK I have a wonderful 7.5 year old little girl with my EX she is smart sweet and caring. Doing great in school and is well adjusted my ex and I split when she was 3 and it has been hard on her at times I see her torn with wanting to be with both of us she has had melt downs when I took her back to her mom's but we talk about it and she always knows that I love her more then anything. she is headstrong and stoubborn just like me and gets the lovely sarcastic side from her other mother. just now she is starting to try to play us against each other like saying mommie wants me to bring my kindel to her house.. now that kindle is a presant from her grandpa .. my dad and it is staying here again we talked about it so we shall see.. Abigail knows we are all strugging money wise and as much as we would like to there just are places we can't go but we make the most of it. I am dating as you know and Desd has become avery inportant part in Abbys life as has Desd's famliy I think it is for good for Abby. My Ex is not dating but she has Abby when she is with the EX is surrounded by my EX's family and they really don't care for me unless then need something I know they make fun of me at times and Abby gets mad I just tell her its ok kiddo what matters is that Desd and I love her. I think we are doing ok the big key for us is we talk even when she has a meltdown I always hold her and we talk and I remind her that I love her..

[Thinker]

Originally Posted by christie0918

you can still walk into his room and find both of his laptops on the floor, the iPad tossed on the bed amongst just trash, his nasty fingerprints on the flat screen tv

What about taking all of these things away from him? I realize the internet stuff isn't as important as it used to be, but maybe having simple TV is enough of a perk for him......or gaming on the computers.

I'm sorry for the frustration. I do hope it gets better soon. Just so you know... I really do "get" the apathy thing. We've had our own trials over here.

[MsTinkerbelly]

christie...Thinker has a good idea, and one we have had to use with our daughter the slob.

As he is under 18 and unable to support himself, take EVERYTHING away. Make him earn things back. One week of showering daily, he gets his laptop (for example) two weeks of making his bed, he gets an air gun.....

Just a thought...my daughter also has "too much" and she only appreciates the things she buys herself, or that she has had to earn. And the stink? Girls can have funky odors too!

She does not have issues like Aspergers to deal with, but if you keep it basic and consistant it shouldn't take too long. I worked for 16 years with people having all types of issues and basic and simple really work the best. Yelling as you know only works when they think you might kick them hard!

I hope things improve for you soon.

[Jess]

Thanks everyone for responding to Christie's post. I sure appreciate the input and the feeling that we aren't the only parents driven nuts ( temporarily/ forevah) by dread teenagers... LOL!

He is a good kid/ young man. I love him and want to strangle him on a daily basis. LOL! When we are able to stay in good cheer about it, we see the progress he HAS made in the last year. It is actually pretty phenomenal. I think often, that is where so much of the frustration comes from. He is capable of far more than he is willing to do.

I know I was no picnic in my teen years, so I try to keep that in mind. We will just keep plugging away until we find that magic button that helps him "get it". I think he'll stumble across it around age 30. It is well hidden just behind the crap under his bed.

Thanks again folks. I know Christie brought this up, however, it is very important to me.

[jelli]

Originally Posted by christie0918

Jelli -

Thanks for your response.

The unfortunate part of support groups, for me, has always been I have little patience for those who seem to get wrapped up in their issues, wearing them as a blanket to keep them warm - I tried an autism group when he was first diagnosed at 2.5 years and found that most times, it was just a lot of venting and not a lot of practical solutions. I feel like Jess and I spend enough energy talking about it and I just don't want to sacrifice any more of the precious time we have together to "boy issues."

I'm not dismissing anything that you or Tapu offered - really. You have no idea that just someone else heard me means so very much and I appreciate it. I know Jess does too.

Thanks again to you both -

Christie

I understand. One can get tired of presenting problems and not having any useful feedback and/or possible solutions.

With that being said, I like the idea of having him earn things back. Is this a reasonable direction to try? We were having trouble with our daughter and the counselor at one point suggested if it got bad enough to take everything from her room including her door. Give her choices to earn back her rights/things/etc. By choices she meant give her 2 choices that you can live with and let her choose one of those. You get what you want and they "think" they're somewhat in control.

Set up a barter system of sorts. can also use a timer so they can watch/hear when the time is about to be up so they can perhaps work a bit faster. Example: 20 minutes of cleaning could result in 20 minutes of X. If your son wants friends or gf to come over then what is that worth to him? What about racing him to get it done? "I bet I can get the laundry all folded before you take a shower." or perhaps going the opposite of calling him out and using lots of praise and rewards. Or a combination of these. Whatever you choose, be prepared to follow through though.

I know you've probably tried so many things, but I feel for you both and am scratching at what ever might work.

Stay strong together.

[christie]

I have been reading your responses and appreciate the concern and support you all are offering.

It sounds cliche', but we (I) have literally tried most everything you all are suggesting. As Jess mentioned, he HAS made so much progress in his maturation. A little over a year ago, he tried to be waited on hand and foot and literally asked for a mini fridge for his room so he "wouldn't have to walk down the steps and through the house to the kitchen." Sid the Sloth from Ice Age comes to mind.

I would take his door off his room but remember that part about personal hygiene?? Uh, no. Not now, not ever. Sometimes the smell seeps under and through the upstairs foyer. Febreeze and pet-odor candles are making a mint off us.

Something is going to give and its not going to be us. I always remind him that I will win, well, because I do and he might do well to remember that - I may have moments when I feel like just throwing up my hands and hoping for the best, but that doesn't last long. Less than 24 hours and Momma is heading home. He best be ready.

Thanks again - maybe there will be a lightbulb moment before I have a psuedo monster truck rally in the front yard using his stuff to crush. Stay tuned - there might be a youtube before the weekend is up.

(disclaimer: I don't think I really will do that, but heaven knows I have done more drastic things in the past over different issues - never with him)

[Jess]

and thankfully, not with me

[LaneyDoll]

I have been reading this thread for a while and think that everyone has great ideas. My kids are young (the oldest is 13) so I am stashing ideas-lol. I used to have a boss (referred to as B) who had a variation of the "earning back" idea that may help you or someone else following these posts...

Her daughter used to trash her bedroom horribly. So, after endless asking, yelling etc, B removed everything from the bedroom (including the items from the closet). For the first week, the daughter had nothing and had to sleep on the couch. At week two, the girl was allowed to return to her room, with her bed/sheets and dresser (which was emptied). Her daughter had to watch TV in the family room, had no privacy for her phone calls, had to accept the clothes B laid out for her etc. After the determined amount of time for punishment, B's daughter could earn her belongings back. B only had to enforce this punishment once. And, in cleaning out the room, they were able to clean out things that truly needed to go.

Now, obviously this is not feasible if the space in your home is limited (as mine is). Like I said, it may not be an option for everyone but it might be an idea for someone out there.

Happy Parenting

[Thinker]

Originally Posted by LaneyDoll

I have been reading this thread for a while and think that everyone has great ideas. My kids are young (the oldest is 13) so I am stashing ideas-lol. I used to have a boss (referred to as B) who had a variation of the "earning back" idea that may help you or someone else following these posts...

Her daughter used to trash her bedroom horribly. So, after endless asking, yelling etc, B removed everything from the bedroom (including the items from the closet). For the first week, the daughter had nothing and had to sleep on the couch. At week two, the girl was allowed to return to her room, with her bed/sheets and dresser (which was emptied). Her daughter had to watch TV in the family room, had no privacy for her phone calls, had to accept the clothes B laid out for her etc. After the determined amount of time for punishment, B's daughter could earn her belongings back. B only had to enforce this punishment once. And, in cleaning out the room, they were able to clean out things that truly needed to go.

Now, obviously this is not feasible if the space in your home is limited (as mine is). Like I said, it may not be an option for everyone but it might be an idea for someone out there.

Happy Parenting

My wife's son (15 1/2) has only his bed, clothes, and alarm clock in his room. He is not allowed to take his phone or laptop in there, and the charging stations for both are in the main room. He watches the TV in the living room.

It sucks because we have basically lost the living room (except when we all watch something together), but it beats the hell out of the stress we experienced at the start of last school year. Hearing from his teachers that he was falling asleep in class sent me through the friggin' roof.

Gaming systems?

Well....those are a thing of the past in this house. No need for a fancy PS3 when crazed step-dad takes EVERY game to the garage and puts a hammer to 'em. Oh, yes......yes, I did.

(My wife pointed out later how much money we could have sold them for.)

All that to say, I totally dig B's routine!!!