"Traditional" Masculinity in Today's Society

[Liam]

I believe that in the context of this forum, traditional refers to stereotypes, particularly masculine stereotypes. I don't think stereotypes of any gender will be leaving soon, they vary from culture to culture, but as long as there are people, there will be stereotypes, and there will be those individuals who elude stereotypical catagorization.

I think its important to talk about gender stereotypes, however I don't think this is the thread for that. There are folks here identifying how they feel about characteristics and behaviors they possess. To call it crap, or claim it no longer exists, denies them their voice, denies them their self-definition. I don't think this is a place for saying something is right or wrong, but listening. If you don't agree, don't read, better yet, start your own thread to discuss what it is you want to talk about.

[The_Lady_Snow]

Originally Posted by Liam

I believe that in the context of this forum, traditional refers to stereotypes, particularly masculine stereotypes. I don't think stereotypes of any gender will be leaving soon, they vary from culture to culture, but as long as there are people, there will be stereotypes, and there will be those individuals who elude stereotypical catagorization.

I think its important to talk about gender stereotypes, however I don't think this is the thread for that. There are folks here identifying how they feel about characteristics and behaviors they possess. To call it crap, or claim it no longer exists, denies them their voice, denies them their self-definition. I don't think this is a place for saying something is right or wrong, but listening. If you don't agree, don't read, better yet, start your own thread to discuss what it is you want to talk about.

So I have to ask cause i don't know if I am you right..

Are you mad about something? Did my difference in masculine traits not go with what you like think? Should I have not expressed my POV?

Curious...

Do you really feel someone is being erased by words here?

[Liam]

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

What is traditional masculinity? What if *I* happen to have a dash of masculinity along with my femininity?

What if my femininity does not *match* the ideals of *traditional* femininity?

Is there room for these stifled ideals for how things are now being the gender spectrum is so large...

*I* personally do not fit into any stifled *girls do this and boys do that* kinda thing..

*I* feel we fall into the whole heteroworld of masculine is this and feminine is that and then get stuck on this whole gender, role, misogynist way of being and well I don't role that way so yeah......

Lets be honest traditional when out the window as soon as butch women such as Mr Cynthia, BullDog and others before them said, hey I am masculine but I sho don't equate man...

So in my eyes masculinity covers and has evolved into a larger spectrum than that of what *tradition* intended....

I could be wrong

Originally Posted by Liam

I believe that in the context of this forum, traditional refers to stereotypes, particularly masculine stereotypes. I don't think stereotypes of any gender will be leaving soon, they vary from culture to culture, but as long as there are people, there will be stereotypes, and there will be those individuals who elude stereotypical catagorization.

I think its important to talk about gender stereotypes, however I don't think this is the thread for that. There are folks here identifying how they feel about characteristics and behaviors they possess. To call it crap, or claim it no longer exists, denies them their voice, denies them their self-definition. I don't think this is a place for saying something is right or wrong, but listening. If you don't agree, don't read, better yet, start your own thread to discuss what it is you want to talk about.

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

So I have to ask cause i don't know if I am you right..

Are you mad about something? Did my difference in masculine traits not go with what you like think? Should I have not expressed my POV?

Curious...

Do you really feel someone is being erased by words here?

I am not mad at you, Snowy, however I think your questions would be great in another thread. I did not appreciate AtLastHome's comment about crap, and I have addressed that personally, with her. I do disagree with you regarding your statement that traditional went out the window. Its a nice thought, but we are a long ways from achieving that. I think many people have expanded their notion of what masculine is, not everyone has. It doesn't sound like you are into "traditional" masculinity to me. I thought this thread was for those, who were. And yes, I think when you refer to characteristics or behaviours that people have used to describe themselves, as stifling, you are definitely putting them down.

[The_Lady_Snow]

Originally Posted by Liam

I am not mad at you, Snowy, however I think your questions would be great in another thread. I did not appreciate AtLastHome's comment about crap, and I have addressed that personally, with her. I do disagree with you regarding your statement that traditional went out the window. Its a nice thought, but we are a long ways from achieving that. I think many people have expanded their notion of what masculine is, not everyone has. It doesn't sound like you are into "traditional" masculinity to me. I thought this thread was for those, who were. And yes, I think when you refer to characteristics or behaviours that people have used to describe themselves, as stifling, you are definitely putting them down.

I must of misread then, cause I swore that this thread was about *discussing* masculinity and traditions.. I believe the OP asked for our thoughts on this, I mean I did not honestly think this was just for traditional type folks..

You assuming I am not into *traditional* masculinity is jumping the gun no? Do you know this for sure? I don't get where you think I am stiffling or putting anyone down, what I was DOING was discussing or rather asking and wondering what is that exactly?

I do think we have evolved from the whole me tarzan you jane theory of us. I dunno maybe I am wrong and you are foreign to the evolved concept (me assuming) I mean really do we want to be stuck in these presumed roles? Curious I really am? Kinda has a scent of misoginy, a lil machismo going on and other stuff..

[BullDog]

Whose "traditions" are you talking about?

[The_Lady_Snow]

Liam..

Yanno it really bothers me when you say....

"It doesn't sound like you are into "traditional" masculinity to me" it makes me cringe when I read it and here is why..

You are assuming, and I wonder if you assume this because I am not the kind of femme who is the little girl, the girly girl, I am that other type of femme, the bossy, toppy, who likes those boys who *bottom* With this may come the assumption that the boy I fuck is not masculine or a real guy because well what real guy wants to be fucked, guys fuck not the other way around.

I feel like I have to defend myself to my southern father who assumes because I am an assertive woman no *gentle* type is going to look my way.. I am being honest your post to me felt a bit like you asserting your masculinity on me.. I don't respond well to chest thumpers and I wanted to be honest with you.

I hope that is not the case and this is not what I am really reading


I can't imagine how many femmes refrain from posting, who will back down from oppresive shit like this, I just can't never have never will...

Do you see how this can be the real silencing, oppressing tool??

[Liam]

The only thing I assumed here, is that this thread was for folks who embrace and like traditional masculine characteristics. My apologies to all, if I am incorrect.

Snowy, your comments earlier led me to believe that you dislike the notion of traditional masculinity, you tossed it out the window and went on to something larger, I thought you found it stifling.

[Apocalipstic]

I also did not realize that this thread was just for those who are into traditional roles, I thought it was a questions about how we see it today.

[weatherboi]

When I read the OP I felt they were asking for a discussion about what is deemed "Traditional" masculinity. I didnt think this was a thread to discuss "what is a real man" thread, so I am going to go with the "it is a discussion" theory. I also remember reading an invitation to femmes to assert their opinions!!!!

When I hear "Traditional" masculinity, my mind screams role segregation. Segregation of education, housework, profession, decision making, childcare/ child education. I don't equate "Traditional" masculinity to opening doors, holding out chairs, blah, blah and etc. I DON'T equate masculinity with Topping/bottoming or D/s roles. IMO those acts are my "get to's" in any relationship I am participating in not gender defining to me as a guy.

Breaking down masculinity in todays society would entail looking at the impact of gender on a global scale not on an individual scale. How gender relationships connect institutionally and create global gender order/priviledge with in globally large communities(YES) and large buisness corporations (YES) that act as large communities. I would think it would be like breaking down and understanding any other hierarchy system or systemic priviledge pattern.