only another butch would understand

[Mister Bent]

Originally Posted by BullDog

Great post Metro. I am not at all interested in perpetuating stereotypes, and you covered the issues very well.

I enjoyed your post as well Mister Bent, although I don't tend to bond with people over masculinity per se. As an example straight males are masculine too, and I find that I have very little in common with most of them. Masculinity may be a bonding element for some. For me, not so much. I have found that in other organizations and communities where it was supposed to be butch space but ends up being "masculine" space and butches- and in particular female and woman identified butches- tend to get erased and many false assumptions made. I do like bonding with a wide range of people and gender identities- but not at the expense of my gender identity when it is suppposed to be a place for my kind- just something to keep in mind for all.

Right. I probably could have worded that a little better, and I appreciate your post all around.

By bonding element I meant something more in the manner of what I said toward the end of my post, that "masculinity" doesn't belong solely to one group of masculine people and, further, that there is no "hierarchy" of masculinity with which to segregate (I hate that shit).

I, too, have seen incidents where female and woman identified butches have been "erased" or treated as "less than," which I find absurd and harmful. I no more want someone policing my identity, my "butchness" than I want to do so to another. And it does go both ways, which you've no doubt seen, wherein the male identity is criticized as not being what butch is, or not belonging in queer space. You've been around, you know the drill. Regardless, I personally try to honor, and am thankful for the long history of butch. I may be male identified, but butch is meaningful to me, and most evocative (to me), of who I am.

"Being butch" isn't something with which I automatically bond with others either, but the experiences that come of being butch - maybe. Real bonding comes from more than simply sharing a common thread.