Butch Femme Planet  

Go Back   Butch Femme Planet > GENDER AND IDENTITY > The Trans Zone

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 08-15-2010, 05:04 AM   #1
Jaques
Member

How Do You Identify?:
male/TG
 
Jaques's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: England
Posts: 220
Thanks: 51
Thanked 398 Times in 122 Posts
Rep Power: 2583511
Jaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST Reputation
Default

when we are born, our gender is defined and logged on our birth certificate, by the kind of genitals we have, not by the way we feel/act/dress later on. Therefore - though a transguy, being born with female genitals, I will not deny I am physically female. I can never, by way of taking testosterone or the operations I had to alter my body to that which felt comfortable, be a biological male. Its much easier to accept that, since there is nothing more I can do about it.
I consider myself male in essence, i.e. I feel/dress/behave in a male fashion, though there are female characteristics, as there are with any bio male. Therefore, I accept myself, as I am and live as male - easier now I look masculine - if anyone finds out I was born female, i have no problem with them knowing and am happy to answer any questions they may have.

When I thought I was butch lesbian, i did have a problem - it felt very wrong - so my take on this question, is that one should go with what's right for them - it can take time, sometimes a lifetime to discover what that is...............and its often a painful journey
Jaques is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 10 Users Say Thank You to Jaques For This Useful Post:
Old 08-15-2010, 09:19 AM   #2
Liam
Senior Member

How Do You Identify?:
Guy
Preferred Pronoun?:
He, Him, His
 
Liam's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: The Evergreen State
Posts: 2,269
Thanks: 14,865
Thanked 6,876 Times in 1,861 Posts
Rep Power: 21474854
Liam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaques View Post
when we are born, our gender is defined and logged on our birth certificate, by the kind of genitals we have, not by the way we feel/act/dress later on.
Some folks are born with genitals that are confusing to the people filling out the birth certificate. Sometimes procedures take place to remove the confusion, there is a fifty percent chance that the results of that procedure, will match the infant's mind later in life. Not every FTM is truly a female transitioning to male.
__________________
<3
Love is weird.
Liam is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 6 Users Say Thank You to Liam For This Useful Post:
Old 08-15-2010, 12:46 PM   #3
Jaques
Member

How Do You Identify?:
male/TG
 
Jaques's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: England
Posts: 220
Thanks: 51
Thanked 398 Times in 122 Posts
Rep Power: 2583511
Jaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post
Some folks are born with genitals that are confusing to the people filling out the birth certificate. Sometimes procedures take place to remove the confusion, there is a fifty percent chance that the results of that procedure, will match the infant's mind later in life. Not every FTM is truly a female transitioning to male.
that of course is true, but we are talking butch v transguy here, not amaphrodite..............werent we all amaphrodites once - at the beginning of time, so the male v female thing is only transitory anyway, just like everything is...........
Jaques is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-2010, 02:02 PM   #4
Liam
Senior Member

How Do You Identify?:
Guy
Preferred Pronoun?:
He, Him, His
 
Liam's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: The Evergreen State
Posts: 2,269
Thanks: 14,865
Thanked 6,876 Times in 1,861 Posts
Rep Power: 21474854
Liam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaques View Post
that of course is true, but we are talking butch v transguy here, not amaphrodite..............werent we all amaphrodites once - at the beginning of time, so the male v female thing is only transitory anyway, just like everything is...........
Your ignorance astounds me. People who are intersexed are butches, femmes, and even transguys.
__________________
<3
Love is weird.
Liam is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Liam For This Useful Post:
Old 08-15-2010, 04:11 PM   #5
Thinker
Senior Member

How Do You Identify?:
transman
Preferred Pronoun?:
male
 
Thinker's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Texas
Posts: 1,868
Thanks: 710
Thanked 4,133 Times in 1,079 Posts
Rep Power: 21474853
Thinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST ReputationThinker Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post
Your ignorance astounds me. People who are intersexed are butches, femmes, and even transguys.
Liam, that first sentence isn't very kind or welcoming. Please make an effort to keep your comments positive. If you have any questions, you are welcome to write via PM.

Thank you.

Thinker (moderating)
__________________
Practice humility and kindness.
Thinker is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2010, 01:22 AM   #6
Jaques
Member

How Do You Identify?:
male/TG
 
Jaques's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: England
Posts: 220
Thanks: 51
Thanked 398 Times in 122 Posts
Rep Power: 2583511
Jaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post
Your ignorance astounds me. People who are intersexed are butches, femmes, and even transguys.
.................yes i know that -and 4 people thanked me for my post (thankyou) no wonder you call yourself "Mr crankypants" - lol!
Jaques is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-15-2010, 02:09 PM   #7
citybutch
Member

How Do You Identify?:
Butch
Preferred Pronoun?:
I answer to "hey you" (either works for me!)
Relationship Status:
19 years together- Very Married for 10 years
 

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: San Diego
Posts: 557
Thanks: 835
Thanked 1,194 Times in 355 Posts
Rep Power: 6434866
citybutch Has the BEST Reputationcitybutch Has the BEST Reputationcitybutch Has the BEST Reputationcitybutch Has the BEST Reputationcitybutch Has the BEST Reputationcitybutch Has the BEST Reputationcitybutch Has the BEST Reputationcitybutch Has the BEST Reputationcitybutch Has the BEST Reputationcitybutch Has the BEST Reputationcitybutch Has the BEST Reputation
Default

I think you mean hermaphrodite... and I think intersexed is a preferred term.

For ME, sex and gender are different... and there is a rainbow of expression for both... Male/female is a binary illusion... language and culture set us up to squeeze into one box or the other...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaques View Post
that of course is true, but we are talking butch v transguy here, not amaphrodite..............werent we all amaphrodites once - at the beginning of time, so the male v female thing is only transitory anyway, just like everything is...........
citybutch is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to citybutch For This Useful Post:
Old 08-16-2010, 01:20 AM   #8
Jaques
Member

How Do You Identify?:
male/TG
 
Jaques's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: England
Posts: 220
Thanks: 51
Thanked 398 Times in 122 Posts
Rep Power: 2583511
Jaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by citybutch View Post
I think you mean hermaphrodite... and I think intersexed is a preferred term.

....................yes, my spelling certainly needs a lot to be desired doesnt it?
Whether intersexed is the preferred term, im not sure but it means the same.

For ME, sex and gender are different... and there is a rainbow of expression for both... Male/female is a binary illusion... language and culture set us up to squeeze into one box or the other...
I think sexuality and gender are different - and, depending on your outlook, everything we are is an illusion brought about by our own minds/energy - but again thats a matter of personal belief............
Jaques is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to Jaques For This Useful Post:
Old 08-16-2010, 08:30 PM   #9
Liam
Senior Member

How Do You Identify?:
Guy
Preferred Pronoun?:
He, Him, His
 
Liam's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: The Evergreen State
Posts: 2,269
Thanks: 14,865
Thanked 6,876 Times in 1,861 Posts
Rep Power: 21474854
Liam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by citybutch View Post
I think you mean hermaphrodite... and I think intersexed is a preferred term.
The term hermaphrodite is a stigmatizing and misleading term, it implies that a person is both male and female, which is impossible physiologically. One can possess parts of what is consider male or female, but one is neither completely male or female. It is an offensive word to the intersexed.
__________________
<3
Love is weird.
Liam is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Liam For This Useful Post:
Old 08-16-2010, 08:33 PM   #10
Corkey
Infamous Member

How Do You Identify?:
Human
Preferred Pronoun?:
He
Relationship Status:
Very Married
 
Corkey's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Where I want to be
Posts: 8,155
Thanks: 47,491
Thanked 29,270 Times in 6,637 Posts
Rep Power: 21474859
Corkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liam View Post
The term hermaphrodite is a stigmatizing and misleading term, it implies that a person is both male and female, which is impossible physiologically. One can possess parts of what is consider male or female, but one is neither completely male or female. It is an offensive word to the intersexed.

City knows this and was correcting Jaques.

ETA: I want to publicly thank Liam for his kindness to me, you rawk buddy!
__________________
"Many proposals have been made to us to adopt your laws, your religion, your manners and your customs. We would be better pleased with beholding the good effects of these doctrines in your own practices, than with hearing you talk about them".
~Old Tassel, Chief of the Tsalagi (Cherokee)

Last edited by Corkey; 08-16-2010 at 08:36 PM.
Corkey is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Corkey For This Useful Post:
Old 08-16-2010, 08:34 PM   #11
Liam
Senior Member

How Do You Identify?:
Guy
Preferred Pronoun?:
He, Him, His
 
Liam's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: The Evergreen State
Posts: 2,269
Thanks: 14,865
Thanked 6,876 Times in 1,861 Posts
Rep Power: 21474854
Liam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST ReputationLiam Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Corkey View Post
City knows this and was correcting Jaques.
I realise this, and I was hoping to educate others.
__________________
<3
Love is weird.
Liam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 08-16-2010, 08:58 PM   #12
Corkey
Infamous Member

How Do You Identify?:
Human
Preferred Pronoun?:
He
Relationship Status:
Very Married
 
Corkey's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Where I want to be
Posts: 8,155
Thanks: 47,491
Thanked 29,270 Times in 6,637 Posts
Rep Power: 21474859
Corkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaques View Post
that of course is true, but we are talking butch v transguy here, not amaphrodite..............werent we all amaphrodites once - at the beginning of time, so the male v female thing is only transitory anyway, just like everything is...........
Actually we were talking Male ID"d Butches and FTM, not necessarily V.S. I do hope you will read the entire thread. Welcome to the thread.
__________________
"Many proposals have been made to us to adopt your laws, your religion, your manners and your customs. We would be better pleased with beholding the good effects of these doctrines in your own practices, than with hearing you talk about them".
~Old Tassel, Chief of the Tsalagi (Cherokee)
Corkey is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Corkey For This Useful Post:
Old 08-17-2010, 03:45 AM   #13
Jaques
Member

How Do You Identify?:
male/TG
 
Jaques's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: England
Posts: 220
Thanks: 51
Thanked 398 Times in 122 Posts
Rep Power: 2583511
Jaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST ReputationJaques Has the BEST Reputation
Default

forgive me for "wandering" in the thread - intersexed is a relatively new word for hermaphradite - when i used it, it was not meant to be used in a derogatory way, but i am always happy to be educated - its how we learn - I am learning a lot from this site ................. its an education in itself
Jaques is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Jaques For This Useful Post:
Old 08-19-2010, 08:39 AM   #14
SelfMadeMan
Member

How Do You Identify?:
Transsexual Man
Preferred Pronoun?:
Male
Relationship Status:
Married to The Woman of My Dreams <3
 
SelfMadeMan's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Minnesota
Posts: 802
Thanks: 796
Thanked 2,668 Times in 527 Posts
Rep Power: 18972345
SelfMadeMan Has the BEST ReputationSelfMadeMan Has the BEST ReputationSelfMadeMan Has the BEST ReputationSelfMadeMan Has the BEST ReputationSelfMadeMan Has the BEST ReputationSelfMadeMan Has the BEST ReputationSelfMadeMan Has the BEST ReputationSelfMadeMan Has the BEST ReputationSelfMadeMan Has the BEST ReputationSelfMadeMan Has the BEST ReputationSelfMadeMan Has the BEST Reputation
Default

I've been doing a lot of soul searching during the last few days about my attitudes/opinions on this subject and I just wanted to stop in here and apologize to those whom I offended with my posts earlier. I'm not afraid to admit when I'm wrong. I have had some pretty rigid opinions on the whole TG/TS thing. I think that this was because of the community being so different when I transitioned - prior to the Male ID'd Butch community being so present. The fact is, it doesn't affect me personally how anyone else ID's... and I do believe in individuality and having the right to be/look/live your life in a manner that makes you true to yourself - hence my tattoo on my chest that reads 'to thine ownself be true' I can't expect to have the freedom to live my truth while disagreeing with anothers. For that, I am truly sorry.
So anyway... I hope the conversation in here continues and we can all learn from one another.
SelfMadeMan is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 11 Users Say Thank You to SelfMadeMan For This Useful Post:
Old 09-02-2010, 12:18 AM   #15
AtLast
Infamous Member

How Do You Identify?:
Woman
Preferred Pronoun?:
HER - SHE
Relationship Status:
Relating
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: CA & AZ I'm a Snowbird
Posts: 5,408
Thanks: 11,826
Thanked 10,827 Times in 3,199 Posts
Rep Power: 21474857
AtLast Has the BEST ReputationAtLast Has the BEST ReputationAtLast Has the BEST ReputationAtLast Has the BEST ReputationAtLast Has the BEST ReputationAtLast Has the BEST ReputationAtLast Has the BEST ReputationAtLast Has the BEST ReputationAtLast Has the BEST ReputationAtLast Has the BEST ReputationAtLast Has the BEST Reputation
Member Photo Albums
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaques View Post
forgive me for "wandering" in the thread - intersexed is a relatively new word for hermaphradite - when i used it, it was not meant to be used in a derogatory way, but I am always happy to be educated - its how we learn - I am learning a lot from this site ................. its an education in itself

Although I prefer this site to the old one, I had a difficult time leaving it when I did (don't have time to post in both) because finally, there were more intersexed people speaking up and offering a lot of good information. I get a lot of my information and suggestions for reading from my intersexed cousin, but, my hope is that this gender forms a much stronger presence here- not the same tenets apply to them that do for the TG.

I did post earlier (as a gender-blended female person, the identification I have found to be the most accurate for myself in the literature) about seeing why a transman would continue to identify as butch due to their history, which goes far deeper than an identification or label. It seems to fit for some people. I do view folks that take T, have gender reassignment surgeries and refer to them selves as men or male as transgendered and as men. Mainly, this is because of the bio-physiological and mental status scientific definitions put forth today in gender theory.

However, as has always been the case, I don't believe that everyone is going to fit neatly into specific gender identifications. Hell that is the reason gender-blended female person was introduced for people like me! There is just too much fluidity to gender as I see it for the continuation of rigid definitions.

Now, I do have a problem with one gaining male privilege, abusing it as cisgendered men have for centuries and wanting to claim butch in any female sense. That is just the same old patriarchal power dynamic that men have enjoyed forever. There does come a point in transitioning in which one will be viewed exclusively as male and this is where feminist thought (which is not exclusively the purview of women) needs some self-exploration.

Sometimes, a duck really is a duck and it doesn't matter if that duck started out as a pigeon. If it quacks, it's a duck.

I do feel that more discussions about the entire spectrum of gender as we know it today and especially intergendered manifestations (or female-ifestations), would give the entire site a much more well rounded learning curve on gender in its entirety. We seem to really focus on the TG in this all here as it relates to male, or men or masculinity. My personal sphere is about my comfort with female masculinity because that for me has not always been a congenial space and I am not transgendered, nor do I want to pass. I want to be recognized as the blending of gender that I am and just have that be OK!

The struggle for acceptance as we are with our female presentation (as female-identified butches for want of a better term) of what is defined as masculine is far from over. So is our need to have what is woman in us being recognized. We are just not that kind of woman or female! This is why, for me, the building of productive coalitions among the various genders that we all represent is critical in gaining equal rights and protections. It seems like we would be getting a lot further if we all could extract that butch history/experience from our souls and use it in conversations like this. We might find many more avenues to build alliances and coalitions. I know many TG men that speak from this space.
AtLast is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following User Says Thank You to AtLast For This Useful Post:
Old 09-02-2010, 06:46 PM   #16
Joe Mario
Junior Member

How Do You Identify?:
Just a guy
Preferred Pronoun?:
'He' will be fine.
Relationship Status:
happily involved
 
Joe Mario's Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: NJ
Posts: 57
Thanks: 55
Thanked 67 Times in 24 Posts
Rep Power: 41800
Joe Mario Has the BEST ReputationJoe Mario Has the BEST ReputationJoe Mario Has the BEST ReputationJoe Mario Has the BEST ReputationJoe Mario Has the BEST ReputationJoe Mario Has the BEST ReputationJoe Mario Has the BEST ReputationJoe Mario Has the BEST ReputationJoe Mario Has the BEST ReputationJoe Mario Has the BEST ReputationJoe Mario Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Regarding the highlighted part of your post:
Have been reflecting much on my transition and gaining this 'male priviledge' after transitioning. In my case, the 'priviledge' has felt superficial at best. My ID for the previous 25 years before I transitioned 2 years ago was some flavor of Butch. First softbutch, then Butch, then TG Butch, which I claim today. In straight culture, I am 'treated as' a man, which is fine with me- like before. But I still need to 'edit' what I do and say-like before, but just in different ways.
I have feminist values and history but am dealing with straight males who want to bond (priviledge?), but who are not from my culture. I dont know their culture either and have no real interest in it. So, I wouldn't appreciate the red carpet leading to the mens club being rolled out for me by My Community. No, Thanks!

I am less visible or invisible in the queer community and (could) face misinterpretation and rejection for transitioning, which many Butches don't have to deal with.

I'd say this 'priveledge' is a trade-off. Perhaps the ones who complain about Butches Transitioning (not you, ALH; but generally speaking) need to examine why they are complaining to begin with. Begrudging us our 'ounce' of (so-called) priviledge and not looking at the drawbacks we face is unfair.


PS: (Culture and Social Influence matter in a duck's life... )


Quote:
Originally Posted by AtLastHome View Post
Although I prefer this site to the old one, I had a difficult time leaving it when I did (don't have time to post in both) because finally, there were more intersexed people speaking up and offering a lot of good information. I get a lot of my information and suggestions for reading from my intersexed cousin, but, my hope is that this gender forms a much stronger presence here- not the same tenets apply to them that do for the TG.

I did post earlier (as a gender-blended female person, the identification I have found to be the most accurate for myself in the literature) about seeing why a transman would continue to identify as butch due to their history, which goes far deeper than an identification or label. It seems to fit for some people. I do view folks that take T, have gender reassignment surgeries and refer to them selves as men or male as transgendered and as men. Mainly, this is because of the bio-physiological and mental status scientific definitions put forth today in gender theory.

However, as has always been the case, I don't believe that everyone is going to fit neatly into specific gender identifications. Hell that is the reason gender-blended female person was introduced for people like me! There is just too much fluidity to gender as I see it for the continuation of rigid definitions.

Now, I do have a problem with one gaining male privilege, abusing it as cisgendered men have for centuries and wanting to claim butch in any female sense. That is just the same old patriarchal power dynamic that men have enjoyed forever. There does come a point in transitioning in which one will be viewed exclusively as male and this is where feminist thought (which is not exclusively the purview of women) needs some self-exploration

Sometimes, a duck really is a duck and it doesn't matter if that duck started out as a pigeon. If it quacks, it's a duck
I do feel that more discussions about the entire spectrum of gender as we know it today and especially intergendered manifestations (or female-ifestations), would give the entire site a much more well rounded learning curve on gender in its entirety. We seem to really focus on the TG in this all here as it relates to male, or men or masculinity. My personal sphere is about my comfort with female masculinity because that for me has not always been a congenial space and I am not transgendered, nor do I want to pass. I want to be recognized as the blending of gender that I am and just have that be OK!

The struggle for acceptance as we are with our female presentation (as female-identified butches for want of a better term) of what is defined as masculine is far from over. So is our need to have what is woman in us being recognized. We are just not that kind of woman or female! This is why, for me, the building of productive coalitions among the various genders that we all represent is critical in gaining equal rights and protections. It seems like we would be getting a lot further if we all could extract that butch history/experience from our souls and use it in conversations like this. We might find many more avenues to build alliances and coalitions. I know many TG men that speak from this space.
__________________

Ciao,
~Joe Mario

Last edited by Joe Mario; 09-02-2010 at 06:52 PM.
Joe Mario is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Joe Mario For This Useful Post:
Old 09-02-2010, 02:01 AM   #17
Cowboi
Senior Member

How Do You Identify?:
Butch
Relationship Status:
Holding My Red Circle
 
Cowboi's Avatar
 
1 Highscore

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 1,811
Thanks: 3,051
Thanked 3,962 Times in 1,230 Posts
Rep Power: 21474853
Cowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST Reputation
Default

hermaphroditism- condition where both testicular and ovarian tissue exit in the same person, the testicular tissue containing seminiferous tubules or spermatozoa in the ovarian tissue containing corpora albicantia. A chomasomal abnormality.


psuedohermaphrodite- a congenital condition in which a person has either male or female gonads but external genitalia of the opposite sex, or both.




pseudohermaphroditism- a condition in which a exhibits the somatic characteristics of both sexes through possessing, the phsysical characteristics of either males or females.
__________________
Let There Be Cowgirls
Cowboi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2010, 02:34 AM   #18
Cowboi
Senior Member

How Do You Identify?:
Butch
Relationship Status:
Holding My Red Circle
 
Cowboi's Avatar
 
1 Highscore

Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 1,811
Thanks: 3,051
Thanked 3,962 Times in 1,230 Posts
Rep Power: 21474853
Cowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST ReputationCowboi Has the BEST Reputation
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cowboi View Post
hermaphroditism- condition where both testicular and ovarian tissue exit in the same person, the testicular tissue containing seminiferous tubules or spermatozoa in the ovarian tissue containing corpora albicantia. A chomasomal abnormality.


psuedohermaphrodite- a congenital condition in which a person has either male or female gonads but external genitalia of the opposite sex, or both.




pseudohermaphroditism- a condition in which a exhibits the somatic characteristics of both sexes through possessing, the phsysical characteristics of either males or females.

In the first paragraph the word exit should be exist.
__________________
Let There Be Cowgirls
Cowboi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-02-2010, 10:45 AM   #19
Corkey
Infamous Member

How Do You Identify?:
Human
Preferred Pronoun?:
He
Relationship Status:
Very Married
 
Corkey's Avatar
 

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Where I want to be
Posts: 8,155
Thanks: 47,491
Thanked 29,270 Times in 6,637 Posts
Rep Power: 21474859
Corkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST ReputationCorkey Has the BEST Reputation
Default

While I am pleased that we have a conversation about Intersexed individuals, this thread isn't about them.
Nor is it about Female ID'd Butches. It is about Male ID'd and FTM's, the differences that we see about the two id's and how we have some of the same issues. Don't know where we veered off topic.
__________________
"Many proposals have been made to us to adopt your laws, your religion, your manners and your customs. We would be better pleased with beholding the good effects of these doctrines in your own practices, than with hearing you talk about them".
~Old Tassel, Chief of the Tsalagi (Cherokee)
Corkey is offline   Reply With Quote
The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Corkey For This Useful Post:
Reply


Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 03:23 AM.


ButchFemmePlanet.com
All information copyright of BFP 2018