Trans and Relationship's

[Sam]

I have so many things going on in my mind and im curious.

For the Single trans guys out there, do you have issues from the Community telling you to look outside your "gay community" for a relationship?

Do you get bashed because you date within your community?

Conversation has it, we should not be dating lesbian's, femme women inside our community. I disagree, because some transguy's stay within the community. NOT all date straight women.

I just dont agree on this subject.

How do you feel? Simple conversation, not a community bashing thread.

No nit picking. Just curious.

[Liam]

Originally Posted by Sam

I have so many things going on in my mind and im curious.

For the Single trans guys out there, do you have issues from the Community telling you to look outside your "gay community" for a relationship?

I am not aware of my community telling me to look outside of my "gay community," for a relationship.

Do you get bashed because you date within your community?

No one has bashed me to my "face," because I seek potential dating partners from within my community.

Conversation has it, we should not be dating lesbian's, femme women inside our community. I disagree, because some transguy's stay within the community. NOT all date straight women.

I just dont agree on this subject.

How do you feel? Simple conversation, not a community bashing thread.

No nit picking. Just curious.

I am interested in femmes or queer gals, I'm not interested in dating lesbians—nor do I believe they would be interested in dating me. While my participation in my community may fluctuate, I choose to stay connected.

[Jet]

Originally Posted by Liam

I am interested in femmes or queer gals, I'm not interested in dating lesbians—nor do I believe they would be interested in dating me. While my participation in my community may fluctuate, I choose to stay connected.

ditto. this seems to be my niche — the availability of transensual femmes who I find very attractive. It;s just too bad it'll never happen. (for reasons)

[Dylan]

I find it interesting that trans people are not only told they are not part of the glbTq community, but they're also then told how to act/acceptable terms/whom they may partner with/etc when they are in the glbTq

Yet the same 'rules' are not expected when the glbq's are in the T community

This isn't a retort towards you June...honest. I'm talking about the OP.

I have definitely been told I whom I 'should' be dating. We have all been told how we 'should' act in this community. We've all seen those who don't 'behave' excommunicated. It's just funny to me that trans ppl are often seen as 'guests' of the glbq community who can be easily discarded if they don't abide by the 'rules' even though we've helped the glbq community forever. Yet never once have I seen a cis glbq ask about their behavior when in T space...it's almost just an assumption that glbq's 'should' be welcome.

It's just funny to me


In A Not HaHa Way,
Dylan

[Linus]

Originally Posted by Dylan

I find it interesting that trans people are not only told they are not part of the glbTq community, but they're also then told how to act/acceptable terms/whom they may partner with/etc when they are in the glbTq

Yet the same 'rules' are not expected when the glbq's are in the T community

This isn't a retort towards you June...honest. I'm talking about the OP.

I have definitely been told I whom I 'should' be dating. We have all been told how we 'should' act in this community. We've all seen those who don't 'behave' excommunicated. It's just funny to me that trans ppl are often seen as 'guests' of the glbq community who can be easily discarded if they don't abide by the 'rules' even though we've helped the glbq community forever. Yet never once have I seen a cis glbq ask about their behavior when in T space...it's almost just an assumption that glbq's 'should' be welcome.

It's just funny to me


In A Not HaHa Way,
Dylan

Perhaps this may be a worthwhile separate thread to start, Dylan.

[Dylan]

Originally Posted by Sam

I have so many things going on in my mind and im curious.

For the Single trans guys out there, do you have issues from the Community telling you to look outside your "gay community" for a relationship?

Do you get bashed because you date within your community?

Conversation has it, we should not be dating lesbian's, femme women inside our community. I disagree, because some transguy's stay within the community. NOT all date straight women.

I just dont agree on this subject.

How do you feel? Simple conversation, not a community bashing thread.

No nit picking. Just curious.

Originally Posted by Linus

Perhaps this may be a worthwhile separate thread to start, Dylan.

I've bolded the parts that make me feel it's right on target with the conversation and OP

Queers (queer trans people) are often told they *should* be dating straight people...even if the GLBTQ community is theirs too.

Queer transpeople are also told how to act in the GLBTQ community ("You shouldn't be dating SoAndSo"/"You shouldn't be seeking a partner here"/etc)

Yet, the same rules don't apply for cis queers


I Think It's Right In Line With The Conversation,
Dylan

[Dylan]

Originally Posted by June

Dylan -- You can retort back to me! And I do get what you are saying, I have seen that as well.

For me, when I am in this space, I operate on the assumption that we are all willing participants in the same broader community that we all create here. Not the .com, the people who choose to engage here. That may very well be coming from a place of Femme Privilege for me, I am a Femme in the Butch/Femme Spectrum. No one ever questions why I am here. (Well, perhaps some people wish I would sit down and shut up, but that's a whole 'nother issue!).

Yes, certain behaviors are called into question. For instance, it is well documented that I am not a fan of "I'm so Butch/Femme/Male that I never..." or if a man comes here and says "I'm only interested in straight women", that's problematic for me *here*. Now, if I was sitting across the table from a Transman and he said "I am only interested in straight women" that is different to me, because we are not necessarily in Queer Space. If I was single, and dating or thinking about dating said Man and they said that to me, I would be pretty affronted and probably respond with "Then baby, you are barking up the wrong tree, I'm not straight and even if we dated, I wouldn't be straight". That is me. I know that there are Femmes out there who have partnered with Transmen who do now consider themselves straight.

I hope that I have not come across as "telling" someone who they should or should not partner with, or beyond moderation, telling anyone how they should behave here. I am totally not snarking or yanking your chain when I ask you now for examples, because I think I know, but I don't want to presume I do for sure.

So, let me ask you then.

In re: to the part I've bolded.

A) If a cis woman comes on the site, IDs as queer, but is married to a cis-man, and has no interest in dating ANYONE (because she's happily partnered to her cismale partner)...do you have a problem with her being on the site?

I ask, because I don't consider whom someone is attracted to as relevant to how they ID for themselves, and whether or not that attraction makes or breaks their queerdom. What about butches who date other butches and aren't into femmes at all? Can they still be here? Or are they also an issue.

B) Does whomever One is attracted TO make or break their queer card? In other words, is One's queer identity dependent upon whomever they're interested in? Ergo, is one still queer if One dates, NO ONE?

C) Do YOU believe het people can be queer?


I'm Having A Hard Time Wording Exactly What I Want To Say, So I Lettered...Not Being Curt Or Terse,
Dylan

[Dylan]

Originally Posted by June

No, but I (as in me, June) would wonder if she wasn't questioning. I mean, we're all real fascinating, but couldn't she find the same types of conversations that are not gender oriented somewhere else that catered to straight, cis folks? Now, if she wanted to read and participate, I just don't want to police things that much, and besides, some of my best friends are both straight and cis. So no, I don't personally have a problem with it.

Here's the part that struck me as interesting. I never said anything about the woman IDing as straight. I purposely made no mention of her orientation. But you went ahead and assumed she would ID as straight. It's just interesting to me.

Originally Posted by June

In my personal opinion, Butches who date other Butches are Queer (as in Gay, part of this community because they choose to be here and participate) However they personally ID. So, while it is unlikely that a Butch who is into other Butches would come here and say "I am straight, but I am Butch and into other Butches" I guess, it could happen?

I don't find it unlikely at all that a male ID'd butch would be interested in dating female ID'd butches, and would/could consider that a straight relationship. Butches who date other butches aren't necessarily queer. Lots of different groups use the term butch.

Originally Posted by June

I think I was pretty clear in my example of a straight man wanting to date me and how I feel about my own personal Queerness, they will not make me straight, and in my own personal world, and I have said this before and it's real, real unpopular for some folks, if that man wants to date me, then they get all Queered up by me. And to be clear, any man I would ever date (as far as how I think/feel at this moment) would not be Cis or Straight. If I was single and dating no one, yeah, I would still be a Queer Femme.

Originally Posted by June

if a man comes here and says "I'm only interested in straight women", that's problematic for me *here*.

This is what I was specifically referring to...not the part about a date saying to you, personally, he was only into straight women.

I was wondering if One's partner makes/breaks their queer card. More specifically if a man's queer card gets taken away if he's only interested in dating straight women. If anyone's queer card gets taken away if they date NO ONE. Or if a femme's queer card gets taken away if she only dates men.
Is that problematic for you as well?

Originally Posted by June

I believe they are free to ID as Queer. Do I think they are Queer? No. Not if they are cis and straight. But it doesn't get me all overwrought if they do. It doesn't affect my life anymore than a straight, cis woman married to a straight, cis man does by claiming Femme. Some people do get really worked up over that though.

So, het, cis people can't be queer? Are you saying then that there's no queer communities in the het world? No matter how a person IDs for themselves, you still consider them NOT queer? But, if someone is trans, they're still queer even if they ID as straight? Would it be problematic for you if that straight, cis woman who claimed Femme participated on this site?

I'm not trying to be a pain in one's rear, and I see this as completely on topic...I guess Sam is the boss of that tho. I'm quite interested in having this conversation also (the one Sam presented), and I think breaking it down is a good way of understanding.

And I swear, if the weather weren't so gross outside, I would immediately get offline and ask no more questions for the whole day.

I really have to go do some stuff! I will get back later if I can, and I hope this is not derailing Sam's intent. And also, I hope it's not looking like the June and Dylan show here, my apologies if it does, and you know, Dylan and I can go get a room somewhere and hash this out. [/QUOTE]

Maybe we should make sock puppets?


Dylan

[atomiczombie]

As a transguy, I have insecurities about being part of this community. In many ways I do feel comfortable with you guys and gals in a way I don't feel at all comfortable in the cis/straight world. I consider myself queer, because my primary attraction is to femmes, and I am not at home in the cis/straight world. I love the LGBTQ community.

My insecurities are about how I fit into the butch-femme community as a transguy. Will anyone be interested in me once the T that I am on has changed my body? Will anyone still see me as a legitimate member here? Most importantly, will people here still see ME, and not just my body? I am on disability. I live out in the middle of a rural small town area. I have issues with anxiety and panic disorder. There are plenty of reasons for femmes to not have any interest in me. I just hope that my trans status isn't one of them.

All that being said, only once so far have I pursued a femme who told me no, and it was because she wanted to be with a woman. No one has called me traitor or said I wasn't welcome here. I just worry that it might happen, cause I have heard of guys being treated that way. I think it is sad and hurtful.

And by the way, I am attracted to femmes because they are powerful, strong women who embody femininity and courage and heart. They are bold, unapologetic, and not afraid to stand up and be proud of who they are and who they love. No one else touches my heart and heats my desires like a femme.

Thanks for starting this thread Sam.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by June

This community, and others like it who have some form of Butch/Femme/Trans in the title are not geared towards "Straight" anything, there are other websites out there for that.

I would like to know if that feels bad or offensive to anyone, and why. Because I am very interested in having a respectful dialogue about it, either here, or in another thread if it feels inappropriate here.

(Disclaimer) I am going to be pretty busy over the weekend, so if I do not get back to a post right away, it's not because I am ignoring it!

This is exactly what im trying to find out to be quite honest, although i feel straight i still date within the community because i feel the women understand better and they can decide if they want to be with a transguy or not.

Liam, i get the fluctuating within the community. I try to stay connected.

[Soon]

Originally Posted by Sam

This is exactly what im trying to find out to be quite honest, although i feel straight i still date within the community because i feel the women understand better and they can decide if they want to be with a transguy or not.

Liam, i get the fluctuating within the community. I try to stay connected.

So, you choose femmes b/c they understand YOU better.

Don't femmes have inherent qualities that stand alone and distinct from their potential of understanding transmen?

I'm not trying to come off with snark; I just would like to know what it is about queer femmes that transguys are attracted to that doesn't have anything to do with themselves.

Removing the potential *understanding* that queer femmes may have for transmen, aren't they different and attractive in ways that a straight woman is not?

[Dylan]

And to think

I wondered if I could/should participate in the thread, since I'm not single and the question was posed to single transmen


Dylan

[Sam]

Originally Posted by Dylan

And to think

I wondered if I could/should participate in the thread, since I'm not single and the question was posed to single transmen


Dylan

Ok so i should have left out "single" my mistake.

[Sam]

Originally Posted by HowSoonIsNow

I'm not trying to come off with snark; I just would like to know what it is about queer femmes that transguys are attracted to that doesn't have anything to do with themselves.

I cannot speak for anyone except myself, i date and have relationships with femme's because that is who i am attracted to. High Maintenance, girlie girl type women.

Opposing the question to dating within the community, lol i usually get told to leave the "lesbian" community alone and go out and find a straight woman.

Then im told that i "look" too male. So i best get moving on.

I chuckle to myself, cause these are tweeners that have issues and like to cause drama.

I just want to live my life, keep friends and tread lightly with the community.

[Linus]

Originally Posted by Sam

I have so many things going on in my mind and im curious.

For the Single trans guys out there, do you have issues from the Community telling you to look outside your "gay community" for a relationship?

Do you get bashed because you date within your community?

Conversation has it, we should not be dating lesbian's, femme women inside our community. I disagree, because some transguy's stay within the community. NOT all date straight women.

I just dont agree on this subject.

How do you feel? Simple conversation, not a community bashing thread.

No nit picking. Just curious.

I don't think I've ever been bashed because of dating within the community but have been told I'm a traitor to the community (and, from what I inferred, a traitor to women) for transitioning.

But like some of the other comments above, I do not feel comfortable outside the community. It's not where I feel at home. The straight/heteronormative world isn't mine. I'm lucky to have a partner who is queer in who she dates.

If I was to take on another partner (we maintain a poly outlook on life) I would likely look for another queer partner rather than a straight women.