Obama's Public Support of Michael Vick

[The_Lady_Snow]

He's admitted what he's done to them animals in detail, he's not hiding it, he's continuing to educate that's what I see him doing for those dogs and dogs now. I can't imagine it's easy having to look deep and see what a douche bag you were, my hope is he continues being honest, paying it forward, talking to kids and one day he's forgiven for fucking up really bad he's a young guy he can make a difference. You can only beat a man/woman down so much before they begin to wonder WTF..

Oh and yes the firefighter in Ohio wanted to go on vacation so he killed his dogs and bragged about it to his buddies...

[SoNotHer]

Originally Posted by The_Lady_Snow

I can't imagine it's easy having to look deep and see what a douche bag you were, my hope is he continues being honest, paying it forward, talking to kids and one day he's forgiven for fucking up really bad he's a young guy he can make a difference..

Agreed. With great power and opportunity comes great responsibility. He's in a position to make a change and symbolize that change.

And of the firefighter who wanted to go on vacation, or the man who I saw in a recent news video left his two five-month old puppies caged in a house to die rather than adopt them out (and he knew folks would have taken them) all I can say is that I hope they never have another pet and that there's some justice somewhere along the day.

[kannon]

Everyone who is pointing their finger at Michael Vick and claiming that his crimes are unforgiveable, I would like to know if you guys wear makeup, take medications or use (have) any other animal products? If you do, which I would assume most of you do or have in the past, then are you not a complicit participant in acts of animal cruelty yourself? You may say that animal research benefits humans and excuse the inhumane way we treat animals or creatures we deem as expendable or less than us. Yeah, it’s not as bad as using animals for sport and entertainment. Who said it’s okay to torture animals to get that right type of mascara? Looking at Vick’s case, football is similar to dog fighting in many ways. We have many human sports that are dangerous. Football and boxing are a physically dangerous sports. So, for someone like Vick, dog fighting may not have seemed so cruel. My point it, sometimes it’s about perspective and individual experience.
I’m not excusing his behavior, but he has paid heavily for his crime and appears rehabilitated. So, why not give him a second chance? Why be so self-righteous?

[purepisces]

Originally Posted by kannon

Everyone who is pointing their finger at Michael Vick and claiming that his crimes are unforgiveable, I would like to know if you guys wear makeup, take medications or use (have) any other animal products? If you do, which I would assume most of you do or have in the past, then are you not a complicit participant in acts of animal cruelty yourself? You may say that animal research benefits humans and excuse the inhumane way we treat animals or creatures we deem as expendable or less than us. Yeah, it’s not as bad as using animals for sport and entertainment. Who said it’s okay to torture animals to get that right type of mascara? Looking at Vick’s case, football is similar to dog fighting in many ways. We have many human sports that are dangerous. Football and boxing are a physically dangerous sports. So, for someone like Vick, dog fighting may not have seemed so cruel. My point it, sometimes it’s about perspective and individual experience.
I’m not excusing his behavior, but he has paid heavily for his crime and appears rehabilitated. So, why not give him a second chance? Why be so self-righteous?

I’m not sure who this post is directed to, but I’m happy to respond.

Just to clarify first, are you saying discussing Michael Vick in this thread is pointing fingers at him or is it something specific that I, or someone else is saying? I’ve only recently posted in this thread because, quite honestly, I find the whole subject so upsetting that it is difficult for me to discuss it.

Don’t get me started on animal testing! I don’t want to derail this thread, so I’ll send you a PM. But to answer your questions: I rarely wear makeup but when I do it is cruelty free, I don’t wear leather or fur, and I’ve been a vegetarian for years. But, I’m not vegan. I eat eggs, dairy & cheese, I feel overwhelming guilt about it, because yes, it makes me complicit in the very cruelty that abhor. I also take medications that probably were tested on animals at some point. I wish I could say I was innocent, but there is blood on my hands, too.

I have never given an opinion as to whether I believe what Vick has done is forgivable or not. I did discuss the fact that I can’t forget what he did. I don’t think anyone can expect their actions to be forgotten just because we might be sorry that we did something. I would guess that for the rest of his life his name is going to be associated with dog fighting.

But in this case, the fact that his actions gained such notoriety is what will, hopefully, help him successful work to end dog fighting. He is someone who has been on both sides of the issues. That’s not something I can say. I honestly cannot imagine how a person could not just condone, but enjoy and promote something I consider so cruel. So, I most likely would not be able to connect with someone actively engaged in that type of activity. Hopefully, Vick, can and will be able to use his influence to that end.

As to getting a second chance, it seems to me that he is getting just about the best second chance ever. A lot of people said that the public outcry would keep him from playing football again. That has not happened. He has an amazing contract, he’s getting sponsor’s back, and he got a reality show. I bet most people would love to have his life after getting out of prison.

Since he is quite young, I hope that the years he spends working on behalf of animals will far outweigh the years he was involved in dog fighting. I don’t think redemption is something that happens overnight. I also don’t think it’s something to be judged by me, or the media, etc. I see redemption as a deeply personal journey, not something that can be bestowed by the public.

You make an interesting point about the possible effect of violent sports on those who play them. The problem with the comparison, in my opinion, is that people have the choice to play a sport, and football players and boxer aren’t killed if they lose a game/fight. Those are luxuries that the dogs in question never had.

[Ebon]

Honestly who gives a fuck what people think of him. As long as HE learns his lesson, which he is in the process of doing. He didn't know he was doing wrong but now he does and now he has to live with it. Obviously this is a part of his life's journey, he is learning how to value the life of an animal. Not everyone was born with that information some of us had to learn it. Perhaps some people need to learn compassion and forgiveness. In my own opinion the only people that can judge other people about animal cruelty are the ones that live a vegan lifestyle, everyone else is just a hypocrite. Let the man learn his lesson.

As far as race goes this whole fucking thread was started on some racist bullshit. I'm not going to vote for Obama again because he's showing compassion? Give me a break.

[Toughy]

suebee..........Please don't imply I think they are 'just dogs'. I work with dogs and have for years now. I'm so glad you do too, just remember that finger you are pointing at me and others leaves 3 pointing back at you.

I'm also am so glad you think his race is a 'mitigating' factor......it's the BIGGEST factor in all of this. Rich white men (and women) are in the dog fighting business and you don't see ANY of them on trial or see any hateful, spiteful, mean-spirited attitudes toward them.

Anybody who knows anything more than 'dog fighting is bad' can find out who is doing what. Trust me, law enforcement knows who is involved .....they just don't care unless they can take down a gifted black athlete and whip up a frenzy over it.

[suebee]

Oh Toughy, that wasn't necessarily directed at you. It's just a comment I've heard all too often. My bad if I wasn't clear.