Question to butches and how they deal with differences in dating

imperfect_cupcake · 01-18-2015, 02:53 PM

Quote:

If I knew that this, I don't think I'd be threatened or insecure. I guess it depends on how much you want to share about this with someone new.

Hmn. Tricky. I don't know. The last time I dated someone I quite liked neither of us was asking for monogamy off the bat because we were both the same about it. I told her on the first date that I didn't mind who she dated or slept with and she didn't have to tell me about it unless she wanted to talk to me as a friend about it (which she did. She had an issue and a bad date and wanted to tell me and I listened and we joked. Which actually made me feel closer and safer with her).

After we had been dating a while, we both decided we would like to know if the other person was sleeping with anyone else. She had never done this before and was nervous about it so I said "let's role play it! You tell me and I'll be me!"
We laughed and joked our way through the role play and she felt much better about it.

But about four months along she wanted to meet someone "for sex or for a date, date. Like proper romantic date?"
"Proper romantic date"
And I knew at that point we were at different stages and wanted different things, for now. So I bowed out. And it busted me to do it. If she had been meeting someone for a fun casual sex date, I would have felt jealous but nothing I couldn't deal with. Her wanting to meet someone to romance, made me scared and I knew I couldn't do it.
She was deeply upset with me breaking things off and didn't understand. I said that we were at different points and I wouldn't be able to handle it and it would affect us both. But she was welcome to come back at anytime in the future should she choose because I still thought she was the bees knees.
No, apparently, for her, if you ring the bell, it's done.

Dating is hard. I'm not really a big fan of it.

So the possibility of me sleeping with someone would be there. Just highly unlikely. And if I *had* slept with someone while I was dating her, it would have been very casual and of little consequence to how I felt about her or what we were doing. But if someone fell in my lap and said "hey! Just passing through!" I might have. I was dating, and if I'm dating, I am not in a couple. I'm not ready to answer to someone just yet, even though I really, really like them. Just like I don't want to have to explain why I'm going on a holiday with friends if I'm dating someone, or why I didn't call last night. They don't have to check with me to go bowling with mates and if they don't call me at 10pm for a chat (say it's something we might often do) they don't have to text and apologise.

I think the word "expectations" is something I like to keep on very close to nil, or quite low when dating.

Perhaps that's key to it?

SleepyButch · 01-18-2015, 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by imperfect_cupcake

Hmn. Tricky. I don't know. The last time I dated someone I quite liked neither of us was asking for monogamy off the bat because we were both the same about it. I told her on the first date that I didn't mind who she dated or slept with and she didn't have to tell me about it unless she wanted to talk to me as a friend about it (which she did. She had an issue and a bad date and wanted to tell me and I listened and we joked. Which actually made me feel closers to her).

After we had been dating a while, we both decided we would like to know if the other person was sleeping with anyone else. She had never done this before and was nervous about it so I said "let's role play it! You tell me and I'll be me!"
We laughed and joked our way through the role play and she felt much better about it.

But about four months along she wanted to meet someone "for sex or for a date, date. Like proper romantic date"
"Proper romantic date"
And I knew at that point we were at different stages and wanted different things, for now. So I bowed out. And it busted me to do it. If she had been meeting someone for a fun casual sex date, I would have felt jealous but nothing I couldn't deal with. Her wanting to meet someone to romance, made me scared and I knew I couldn't do it.
She was deeply upset with me breaking things off and didn't understand. I said that we were at different points and I wouldn't be able to handle it and it would affect us both. But she was welcome to come back at anytime in the future should she choose because I still thought she was the bees knees.
No, apparently, for her, if you ring the bell, it's done.

Dating is hard. I'm not really a big fan of it.

So the possibility of me sleeping with someone would be there. Just highly unlikely. And if I *had* slept with someone while I was dating her, it would have been very casual and of little consequence to how I felt about her or what we were doing. But if someone fell in my lap and said "hey! Just passing through!" I might have. I was dating, and if I'm dating, I am not in a couple. I'm not ready to answer to someone just yet, even though I really, really like them. Just like I don't want to have to explain why I'm going on a holiday with friends if I'm dating someone, or why I didn't call last night. They don't have to check with me to go bowling with mates and if they don't call me at 10pm for a chat (say it's something we might often do) they don't have to text and apologise.

I think the word "expectations" is something I like to keep on very close to nil, or quite low when dating.

Perhaps that's key to it?

I'm curious. I wonder how she would have reacted had you told her you were going on a "romantic date" with someone else? I know you said you don't like the romance up front so whatever the equivalent of that would be for you. We tend to have a totally different reaction when things are happening to us instead of doing them ourselves.

imperfect_cupcake · 01-18-2015, 03:20 PM

Well, by the four month mark we had done what we both had considered a bit of romance. She had taken me to the science museum and a pic nic, held hands with me in the marina, I let her take the reins with costs (I love it but it's so hard for me to do), I took her to me little secret favourite Ethiopian restaurant and wore her favourite dress for her, and we went to the 217 flavour Italian ice cream parlour and then played goofy games in the park.
She was planning to have me to her house for the first time and to make me steak dinner (her thing) and I wanted her to take me on the boat.

So we had started doing what I consider romantic things, as did she. There are quite a few other things I did for her but those are her private, romantic things and I don't want to blather them.

So when I asked her what her reaction would be the other way, she told me she would have struggled quite hard with it if I had and she said she was not sure herself how she would deal. But she was not "there" where she wanted to not have the option herself, so she would just have dealt with it the best she could have and talked it out with me till she felt ok.

I wish, very much, I could have done that. But I think I was just a bit further too past it to agree. The thought that I could very realistically be replaced because that girl lived in the same town as her and thus far easier to take out for brunch, far easier to take to the zoo and far easier to have her out for drinks every Friday night, I felt unhinged by. I told her that and she agreed. It was possible. And she would feel very uncomfortable if I did the same.

It's just she was willing to talk through it, and I wasn't. I don't know if that is a short coming of mine or good for knowing my limits.

Kelt · 01-18-2015, 03:32 PM

Cupcake, I’m sorry that worked out that way for you. I think you bring up a really good point though and it’s something I’ve been learning later in life. Not all femmes dig romance.

This is something that was trained into me from my very beginning. Every movie, show, book on etiquette, OS mentorship, you name it; it was drilled into me as a default. That if I just showed up with a bunch of flowers, hold your hand and buy you ice cream in the park ... That I’d be doing something right and have a crack at screwing up something else.

I’ve learned that romance is a spectrum just like everything else and that part of learning about someone new is to figure out this bit too. I’m pretty sure I’m not the only older butch that has that wired up wrong. I still love to do the OS rituals, but I can now see that not all will appreciate it and it’s not personal, just a different view.

SleepyButch · 01-18-2015, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kelt

Cupcake, I’m sorry that worked out that way for you. I think you bring up a really good point though and it’s something I’ve been learning later in life. Not all femmes dig romance.

This is something that was trained into me from my very beginning. Every movie, show, book on etiquette, OS mentorship, you name it; it was drilled into me as a default. That if I just showed up with a bunch of flowers, hold your hand and buy you ice cream in the park ... That I’d be doing something right and have a crack at screwing up something else.

I’ve learned that romance is a spectrum just like everything else and that part of learning about someone new is to figure out this bit too. I’m pretty sure I’m not the only older butch that has that wired up wrong. I still love to do the OS rituals, but I can now see that not all will appreciate it and it’s not personal, just a different view.

Hard to believe that not everyone loves romance right? I now make it a point to ask if she likes romance because it's just something I do a lot without thinking about it. I think if someone doesn't want romance, they are not for me. It's hard to retrain yourself into not doing things especially when I get a lot of pleasure from being romantic.

Looking at it from cupcake's point of view from her words on this thread, I think that sometimes right away, things can get hidden behind the blanket of romance, meaning you can get caught up in it all and maybe not really see what is in front of you. So not that you can't be romantic but save the romance for later when you are trusting each other more and know each other better?

Who knows. All I really do know is that getting to know me is getting to know my romantic side and it tends to come out right away.

Shystonefem · 01-18-2015, 03:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SleepyButch

Hard to believe that not everyone loves romance right? I now make it a point to ask if she likes romance because it's just something I do a lot without thinking about it. I think if someone doesn't want romance, they are not for me. It's hard to retrain yourself into not doing things especially when I get a lot of pleasure from being romantic.

Looking at it from cupcake's point of view from her words on this thread, I think that sometimes right away, things can get hidden behind the blanket of romance, meaning you can get caught up in it all and maybe not really see what is in front of you. So not that you can't be romantic but save the romance for later when you are trusting each other more and know each other better?

Who knows. All I really do know is that getting to know me is getting to know my romantic side and it tends to come out right away.

But the romance has to come from the right place. I have am ex that spent hundreds of dollars on flowers every single week, left gifts at my housr, would call stores that she knew I would be at and bought stuff fore in advance....... BUT.... she turned out to be a psycho. Sometimes people try too hard so that their "other" side doesn't show....... right away.

SleepyButch · 01-18-2015, 04:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shystonefem

But the romance has to come from the right place. I have am ex that spent hundreds of dollars on flowers every single week, left gifts at my housr, would call stores that she knew I would be at and bought stuff fore in advance....... BUT.... she turned out to be a psycho. Sometimes people try too hard so that their "other" side doesn't show....... right away.

Of course it has to come from the right place. I can tell you romance isn't about buying people things all the time. Isn't that more of trying to buy someone's affection? That would be a red flag for me right away I think but that's just me. I would rather someone be creative than buy me things all the time. Yes, I like to be romanced as well.

It's up to the two people involved to take the time to get to know each other. No one's other side is going to show right away, which is what I think one of the points of this thread is. Hell, sometimes someone's true side doesn't show up for a long time!

imperfect_cupcake · 01-18-2015, 03:50 PM

Oh I do like romance, kelt. But not at first. I think it's too personal and intimate from someone I don't know. It scares me. It's like someone breathing in my face and asking all about my feeeeeeelings if I don't know them.

I actually am old fashioned once I am in a relationship. In ways that are very... Particular.

However, I'm just a very emotionally reserved person when it comes to deeper feelings and certain intimacies. I can verbally spill my guts about who I am, all my history and I'm not a private person about details of my life, but you want to know my deeper feelings?

Get to know me first. Be my friend. Show me you can be my friend before you can be my lover.

This gives me confidence that if something needs discussing, or something happens, you can put certain romantic feelings aside and treat me like a cherished friend first. To me, that is the most trusted thing anyone can do for me. And I often put my feelings of jealousy, ego, hurt, pissy snit aside to speak to a partner as a *friend* first, once I trust them.

I have friendships that have lasted for 32 years. None of my relationships have. So Given that my friendships are the most valuable thing I know of, when a partner that treats me like a friend first, then they have my trust. Once I know that they see me as a valuable friend and person first, *then* I like all the romance. Because then I know them well enough for that level of intimacy.

But I can also find a supermarket sandwich in a carpark the rain very romantic if I'm with the right person. I can think of a very romantic afternoon spent laughing in her car with tesco tuna fish sandwiches, sitting in a car park with the rain leaking in the back. There doesn't need to be flowers and chocolates in that memory. It still makes me smile.

I'm not really a flowers and chocolate girl romance girl. I'm a science museum and divey pub romance girl. Everyone has different ideas about what romance is.

Mine just happens to be more geek than traditional princess.

Ginger · 01-18-2015, 03:58 PM

I'm trying to think about what I consider "romance."

I think the romantic gestures that really get to me are quiet and thoughtful, not big and splashy.

When I was in college, on a very cold night, my lover got out of bed and put these big fuzzy red socks on my feet. I was swooning.

Shystonefem · 01-18-2015, 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ginger

I'm trying to think about what I consider "romance."

I think the romantic gestures that really get to me are quiet and thoughtful, not big and splashy.

When I was in college, on a very cold night, my lover got out of bed and put these big fuzzy red socks on my feet. I was swooning.

Romantic gestures is not about stuff. It is about thinking about what the other person needs/wants and getting it done.

The_Lady_Snow · 01-18-2015, 03:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Kelt

Cupcake, I’m sorry that worked out that way for you. I think you bring up a really good point though and it’s something I’ve been learning later in life. Not all femmes dig romance.

This is something that was trained into me from my very beginning. Every movie, show, book on etiquette, OS mentorship, you name it; it was drilled into me as a default. That if I just showed up with a bunch of flowers, hold your hand and buy you ice cream in the park ... That I’d be doing something right and have a crack at screwing up something else.

I’ve learned that romance is a spectrum just like everything else and that part of learning about someone new is to figure out this bit too. I’m pretty sure I’m not the only older butch that has that wired up wrong. I still love to do the OS rituals, but I can now see that not all will appreciate it and it’s not personal, just a different view.

Romantic gestures are nice, and a way to show appreciation, love, etc.. It's when those gestures or "love tasks" become a way to want to get all weird and proprietary.. Also, (sometimes and this is where I think folks get all wigged out) Femmes want to be the one's leading the romance or want to be able to express romantic gestures which are for some reason only assigned to butch/masculine/Top/Boss people....

Also, like you stated someone's view of romance is hearts and flowers, where as for others it can be museums and fuck fests.... When things don't stay "binary" is when I feel that people get all oogy and weird, and then somehow someone ends up being uncomfortable...

I am hoping I can communicate what I am muddling in my mind, it's been a while since I have had to type out my thoughts...

imperfect_cupcake · 01-18-2015, 04:12 PM

Romance to me: documentary films with home made pizza. Having them cook me a dinner they like to cook for themselves. Going to the store for me. Taking me to a museum. Sitting in bed on a Sunday and drinking tea and playing cards and laughing and being sarcastic. Buying me a kinder egg. Having a pic nic at my local park and looking at magazines together. Making something stupid and crafty together and making jokes. Swapping goofy pictures of each other grafted into things. Making each other e-books with funny stories and pictures. Going on a drive to find abandoned barns or factories and walk through them. Buying me my favourite gin and strawberries and playing a rediculous board game. Having them climb a tree for me to get me a flower. Showing me their favourite books or journals and telling me why. Talking to me for hours, late at night.

I think understanding that people have different ideas about what is intimate and what is romantic (like the five love languages test, for example) is a good thing. I like people who like touch and quality time, because I'm good at giving that. I love getting acts of service the most. So fixing my bike will be seen as far more swoony and romantic than a gift or a love poem.

But that's also what dating is for, right? Finding these things out to see if you are suited for a relationship!

Kinda why I like taking things slow in the beginning, to find these things out....!

Martina · 01-18-2015, 04:23 PM

I hate romance. Always have. It leaves me flat, and then I feel guilty. I endure romantic gestures, I guess. I do like pizza and documentary films though.

I read this thread and realized how much I do not want a relationship at this point in my life. I wonder if I ever will again.

I am truly grateful for the friends and beloved ex's in my life who fit me like an old glove. If I didn't have them, I'd be alone. I seriously could not go through all that right now. I love being single. I love home-ownership (new to me). I love the freedom of my own time and my own space.

princessbelle · 01-18-2015, 04:21 PM

I've been following this thread and trying hard to understand exactly what to post about that is related to the core subject. It is very interesting and the words in here are so good to hear. I am yearning for deep discussions and i thank the OP for bringing light to a deep subject.

I guess though i'm having a blond moment and not exactly sure what to post about, however i want to be a part of this discussion so i'm gonna give it a try...

Regarding relationships and who seems to fall in the category of monogamy faster, butch vs. femme; I find it totally depends on the individual and i have not actually seen a trend, in my life anyway.

Sometimes, it was me that jumped in too fast and sometimes it was a partner that seemed to push. The main point i would like to make is this....everyone has different ideas of what a "relationship" or "dating" should be. When i meet someone new and we date, to me that it is just dating. Dating is dating. Discussion can be made at some point on the monogamy part. This is the time we try each other out, the mental connection, culturally, spiritually, physically. Even if i am monogamous, it's not set in stone i will be there long term, forever type stuff. Again, this is *my* definition of dating.

This is where i feel at least in some of my past relationships, communicated or not, it has been a real problem. Some will see monogamous dating is "forever and a day" some won't. I see it just as dating and that's it. Thankfully, a few of my exes agreed with that and we continue to be friends, no matter which of us broke it off. But, i've found that even if you discuss this at the beginning, there are problems later if the other person does not share your views 100%. You can't know for sure you want to spend the rest of your life with someone until you've known them a long time and been around them a lot. That's how i feel anyway.

Bottom line for me Communication is the key. Discussing what dating means specifically, monogamously or not, deeply with each party involved will make it easier in the end, if there is one.

Shystonefem · 01-18-2015, 03:23 PM

I am femme and you a not want my opinion but...

I don't jump into see and I don't like casual sex. I won't bring up the discussion of exclusiveness an
but I will respond if asked.

I don't date younger butches, I date butches close to my age or a bit older.

I did have a butch think that we were "exclusive". It was awkward. She didn't have my phone number or my email or my address... but she felt like we were a couple.

I don't think it is a butch thing or a femme thing, I think it is a person thing.

I probably won't date anyone if I am interested in someone but if you assume we are exclusive without talking about it, we have a problem.

I guess what I am saying is.... don't expect anything from me unless you discuss it with me. It is when you assume that we have a problem.

I am honest and I am fiercely loyal but, before you get that loyalty - you have to ask first.

01-18-2015, 03:20 PM	#3
imperfect_cupcake Senior Member How Do You Identify?: feminine dolly dyke Preferred Pronoun?: Your Grace Relationship Status: I put my own care first Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: In a gauze of mystery Posts: 1,776 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 2,426 Thanked 9,712 Times in 1,611 Posts Rep Power: 21474853	Well, by the four month mark we had done what we both had considered a bit of romance. She had taken me to the science museum and a pic nic, held hands with me in the marina, I let her take the reins with costs (I love it but it's so hard for me to do), I took her to me little secret favourite Ethiopian restaurant and wore her favourite dress for her, and we went to the 217 flavour Italian ice cream parlour and then played goofy games in the park. She was planning to have me to her house for the first time and to make me steak dinner (her thing) and I wanted her to take me on the boat. So we had started doing what I consider romantic things, as did she. There are quite a few other things I did for her but those are her private, romantic things and I don't want to blather them. So when I asked her what her reaction would be the other way, she told me she would have struggled quite hard with it if I had and she said she was not sure herself how she would deal. But she was not "there" where she wanted to not have the option herself, so she would just have dealt with it the best she could have and talked it out with me till she felt ok. I wish, very much, I could have done that. But I think I was just a bit further too past it to agree. The thought that I could very realistically be replaced because that girl lived in the same town as her and thus far easier to take out for brunch, far easier to take to the zoo and far easier to have her out for drinks every Friday night, I felt unhinged by. I told her that and she agreed. It was possible. And she would feel very uncomfortable if I did the same. It's just she was willing to talk through it, and I wasn't. I don't know if that is a short coming of mine or good for knowing my limits. Last edited by imperfect_cupcake; 01-18-2015 at 03:24 PM.

01-18-2015, 03:50 PM	#8
imperfect_cupcake Senior Member How Do You Identify?: feminine dolly dyke Preferred Pronoun?: Your Grace Relationship Status: I put my own care first Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: In a gauze of mystery Posts: 1,776 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 2,426 Thanked 9,712 Times in 1,611 Posts Rep Power: 21474853	Oh I do like romance, kelt. But not at first. I think it's too personal and intimate from someone I don't know. It scares me. It's like someone breathing in my face and asking all about my feeeeeeelings if I don't know them. I actually am old fashioned once I am in a relationship. In ways that are very... Particular. However, I'm just a very emotionally reserved person when it comes to deeper feelings and certain intimacies. I can verbally spill my guts about who I am, all my history and I'm not a private person about details of my life, but you want to know my deeper feelings? Get to know me first. Be my friend. Show me you can be my friend before you can be my lover. This gives me confidence that if something needs discussing, or something happens, you can put certain romantic feelings aside and treat me like a cherished friend first. To me, that is the most trusted thing anyone can do for me. And I often put my feelings of jealousy, ego, hurt, pissy snit aside to speak to a partner as a friend first, once I trust them. I have friendships that have lasted for 32 years. None of my relationships have. So Given that my friendships are the most valuable thing I know of, when a partner that treats me like a friend first, then they have my trust. Once I know that they see me as a valuable friend and person first, then I like all the romance. Because then I know them well enough for that level of intimacy. But I can also find a supermarket sandwich in a carpark the rain very romantic if I'm with the right person. I can think of a very romantic afternoon spent laughing in her car with tesco tuna fish sandwiches, sitting in a car park with the rain leaking in the back. There doesn't need to be flowers and chocolates in that memory. It still makes me smile. I'm not really a flowers and chocolate girl romance girl. I'm a science museum and divey pub romance girl. Everyone has different ideas about what romance is. Mine just happens to be more geek than traditional princess. Last edited by imperfect_cupcake; 01-18-2015 at 03:56 PM.

01-18-2015, 03:58 PM	#9
Ginger Senior Member How Do You Identify?: Femme lesbian Join Date: Mar 2012 Location: East coast Posts: 2,416 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 5,829 Thanked 12,295 Times in 2,057 Posts Rep Power: 21474852	I'm trying to think about what I consider "romance." I think the romantic gestures that really get to me are quiet and thoughtful, not big and splashy. When I was in college, on a very cold night, my lover got out of bed and put these big fuzzy red socks on my feet. I was swooning. __________________ Reach out.

01-18-2015, 04:23 PM	#13
Martina Senior Member How Do You Identify?: * Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: * Posts: 4,999 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 13,409 Thanked 18,284 Times in 4,167 Posts Rep Power: 21474854	I hate romance. Always have. It leaves me flat, and then I feel guilty. I endure romantic gestures, I guess. I do like pizza and documentary films though. I read this thread and realized how much I do not want a relationship at this point in my life. I wonder if I ever will again. I am truly grateful for the friends and beloved ex's in my life who fit me like an old glove. If I didn't have them, I'd be alone. I seriously could not go through all that right now. I love being single. I love home-ownership (new to me). I love the freedom of my own time and my own space. __________________ "No matter how cynical I get, I just can't keep up" - Lily Tomlin

01-18-2015, 04:21 PM	#14
princessbelle Infamous Member How Do You Identify?: femme Preferred Pronoun?: femme ones Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Tennessee Posts: 6,100 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 29,380 Thanked 30,496 Times in 5,198 Posts Rep Power: 21474858	I've been following this thread and trying hard to understand exactly what to post about that is related to the core subject. It is very interesting and the words in here are so good to hear. I am yearning for deep discussions and i thank the OP for bringing light to a deep subject. I guess though i'm having a blond moment and not exactly sure what to post about, however i want to be a part of this discussion so i'm gonna give it a try... Regarding relationships and who seems to fall in the category of monogamy faster, butch vs. femme; I find it totally depends on the individual and i have not actually seen a trend, in my life anyway. Sometimes, it was me that jumped in too fast and sometimes it was a partner that seemed to push. The main point i would like to make is this....everyone has different ideas of what a "relationship" or "dating" should be. When i meet someone new and we date, to me that it is just dating. Dating is dating. Discussion can be made at some point on the monogamy part. This is the time we try each other out, the mental connection, culturally, spiritually, physically. Even if i am monogamous, it's not set in stone i will be there long term, forever type stuff. Again, this is my definition of dating. This is where i feel at least in some of my past relationships, communicated or not, it has been a real problem. Some will see monogamous dating is "forever and a day" some won't. I see it just as dating and that's it. Thankfully, a few of my exes agreed with that and we continue to be friends, no matter which of us broke it off. But, i've found that even if you discuss this at the beginning, there are problems later if the other person does not share your views 100%. You can't know for sure you want to spend the rest of your life with someone until you've known them a long time and been around them a lot. That's how i feel anyway. Bottom line for me Communication is the key. Discussing what dating means specifically, monogamously or not, deeply with each party involved will make it easier in the end, if there is one. __________________ ~ I've learned that people will forget what you said, people will forget what you did, but people will never forget how you made them feel. ~ Maya Angelou

01-18-2015, 03:32 PM	#4
Kelt Senior Member How Do You Identify?: Beach Butch Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: SoCal Posts: 2,751 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 19,765 Thanked 15,285 Times in 2,538 Posts Rep Power: 21474853	Cupcake, I’m sorry that worked out that way for you. I think you bring up a really good point though and it’s something I’ve been learning later in life. Not all femmes dig romance. This is something that was trained into me from my very beginning. Every movie, show, book on etiquette, OS mentorship, you name it; it was drilled into me as a default. That if I just showed up with a bunch of flowers, hold your hand and buy you ice cream in the park ... That I’d be doing something right and have a crack at screwing up something else. I’ve learned that romance is a spectrum just like everything else and that part of learning about someone new is to figure out this bit too. I’m pretty sure I’m not the only older butch that has that wired up wrong. I still love to do the OS rituals, but I can now see that not all will appreciate it and it’s not personal, just a different view.

01-18-2015, 04:12 PM	#12
imperfect_cupcake Senior Member How Do You Identify?: feminine dolly dyke Preferred Pronoun?: Your Grace Relationship Status: I put my own care first Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: In a gauze of mystery Posts: 1,776 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 2,426 Thanked 9,712 Times in 1,611 Posts Rep Power: 21474853	Romance to me: documentary films with home made pizza. Having them cook me a dinner they like to cook for themselves. Going to the store for me. Taking me to a museum. Sitting in bed on a Sunday and drinking tea and playing cards and laughing and being sarcastic. Buying me a kinder egg. Having a pic nic at my local park and looking at magazines together. Making something stupid and crafty together and making jokes. Swapping goofy pictures of each other grafted into things. Making each other e-books with funny stories and pictures. Going on a drive to find abandoned barns or factories and walk through them. Buying me my favourite gin and strawberries and playing a rediculous board game. Having them climb a tree for me to get me a flower. Showing me their favourite books or journals and telling me why. Talking to me for hours, late at night. I think understanding that people have different ideas about what is intimate and what is romantic (like the five love languages test, for example) is a good thing. I like people who like touch and quality time, because I'm good at giving that. I love getting acts of service the most. So fixing my bike will be seen as far more swoony and romantic than a gift or a love poem. But that's also what dating is for, right? Finding these things out to see if you are suited for a relationship! Kinda why I like taking things slow in the beginning, to find these things out....!

01-18-2015, 03:23 PM	#15
Shystonefem Member How Do You Identify?: Stone Femme Preferred Pronoun?: She Relationship Status: Shy for President Join Date: May 2014 Location: NH Posts: 1,105 My Photo Gallery Thanks: 5,475 Thanked 3,671 Times in 897 Posts Rep Power: 21474849	I am femme and you a not want my opinion but... I don't jump into see and I don't like casual sex. I won't bring up the discussion of exclusiveness an but I will respond if asked. I don't date younger butches, I date butches close to my age or a bit older. I did have a butch think that we were "exclusive". It was awkward. She didn't have my phone number or my email or my address... but she felt like we were a couple. I don't think it is a butch thing or a femme thing, I think it is a person thing. I probably won't date anyone if I am interested in someone but if you assume we are exclusive without talking about it, we have a problem. I guess what I am saying is.... don't expect anything from me unless you discuss it with me. It is when you assume that we have a problem. I am honest and I am fiercely loyal but, before you get that loyalty - you have to ask first.